[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
Pious fraud my friend. A myth invented by your Church. Was it “inspired”? Or just a fraud? And now your Church is the arbiter of interpretation for the original Hebrew? LOL[/quote]
I don’t know how long you’ve been on the CBW (Catholic Bashing Wagon), but get some better resources than religioustolerance.org.
From their About Us page:
“As of 2010-DEC, we consist of one Atheist, Agnostic, Christian, Wiccan and Zen Buddhist. Thus, the OCRT staff lack agreement on almost all theological matters, such as belief in a supreme being, the nature of God, interpretation of the Bible and other holy texts, whether life after death exists, what form the afterlife may take, etc.”
Sorry, all these things disqualify them from being a reliable source (MOSTLY: because they deny absolute truth). They dislike the fact that the Church has a claim on authority of truth (in matters of faith and morals) and interpretation, not that the Church claims it (which they hate), but because it’s a truth held by just over 1/6th of the world. As well, the site is relative on issues of morals. On top of that, they use private interpretations of the Bible, I don’t accept private interpretations because it holds no authority.
And, sorry I have a tendency to discredit people who don’t look to the Early Church Fathers and try to disprove the Church, because am I supposed to believe a man 2000 years after it happened or the early Christians who clung to the traditions that they were taught?
“The Book [the Protoevangelium] of James [records] that the brethren of Jesus were sons of Joseph by a former wife, whom he married before Mary. Now those who say so wish to preserve the honor of Mary in virginity to the end, so that body of hers which was appointed to minister to the Word . . . might not know intercourse with a man after the Holy Spirit came into her and the power from on high overshadowed her. And I think it in harmony with reason that Jesus was the firstfruit among men of the purity which consists in [perpetual] chastity, and Mary was among women. For it were not pious to ascribe to any other than to her the firstfruit of virginity” (Commentary on Matthew 2:17 [A.D. 248]).
[quote]“And behold, an angel of the Lord stood by [St. Anne], saying, Ã?Â¢??Anne! Anne! The Lord has heard your prayer, and you shall conceive and shall bring forth, and your seed shall be spoken of in all the world.Ã?Â¢?? And Anne said, Ã?Â¢??As the Lord my God lives, if I beget either male or female, I will bring it as a gift to the Lord my God, and it shall minister to him in the holy things all the days of its life.Ã?Â¢?? . . . And [from the time she was three] Mary was in the temple of the Lord as if she were a dove that dwelt there” (Protoevangelium of James 4, 7 [A.D. 120]).
“And when she was twelve years old there was held a council of priests, saying, Ã?Â¢??Behold, Mary has reached the age of twelve years in the temple of the Lord. What then shall we do with her, lest perchance she defile the sanctuary of the Lord?Ã?Â¢?? And they said to the high priest, Ã?Â¢??You stand by the altar of the Lord; go in and pray concerning her, and whatever the Lord shall manifest to you, that also will we do.Ã?Â¢?? . . . [A]nd he prayed concerning her, and behold, an angel of the Lord stood by him saying, Ã?Â¢??Zechariah! Zechariah! Go out and assemble the widowers of the people and let them bring each his rod, and to whomsoever the Lord shall show a sign, his wife shall she be. . . . And Joseph [was chosen]. . . . And the priest said to Joseph, Ã?Â¢??You have been chosen by lot to take into your keeping the Virgin of the Lord.Ã?Â¢?? But Joseph refused, saying, Ã?Â¢??I have children, and I am an old man, and she is a young girlÃ?Â¢??” (ibid., 8Ã?Â¢??9).
“And Annas the scribe came to him [Joseph] . . . and saw that Mary was with child. And he ran away to the priest and said to him, Ã?Â¢??Joseph, whom you did vouch for, has committed a grievous crime.Ã?Â¢?? And the priest said, Ã?Â¢??How so?Ã?Â¢?? And he said, Ã?Â¢??He has defiled the virgin whom he received out of the temple of the Lord and has married her by stealthÃ?Â¢??” (ibid., 15).
“And the priest said, Ã?Â¢??Mary, why have you done this? And why have you brought your soul low and forgotten the Lord your God?Ã?Â¢?? . . . And she wept bitterly saying, Ã?Â¢??As the Lord my God lives, I am pure before him, and know not manÃ?Â¢??” (ibid.).[/quote]
Hilary of Poitiers
“If they [the brethren of the Lord] had been MaryÃ?Â¢??s sons and not those taken from JosephÃ?Â¢??s former marriage, she would never have been given over in the moment of the passion [crucifixion] to the apostle John as his mother, the Lord saying to each, Ã?Â¢??Woman, behold your son,Ã?Â¢?? and to John, Ã?Â¢??Behold your motherÃ?Â¢?? [John 19:26Ã?Â¢??27), as he bequeathed filial love to a disciple as a consolation to the one desolate” (Commentary on Matthew 1:4 [A.D. 354]).
“Let those, therefore, who deny that the Son is by nature from the Father and proper to his essence deny also that he took true human flesh from the ever-virgin Mary” (Discourses Against the Arians 2:70 [A.D. 360]).
Epiphanius of Salamis
“We believe in one God, the Father almighty, maker of all things, both visible and invisible; and in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God . . . who for us men and for our salvation came down and took flesh, that is, was born perfectly of the holy ever-virgin Mary by the Holy Spirit” (The Man Well-Anchored 120 [A.D. 374]).
“And to holy Mary, [the title] Ã?Â¢??VirginÃ?Â¢?? is invariably added, for that holy woman remains undefiled” (Medicine Chest Against All Heresies 78:6 [A.D. 375]).
The only absolute truth in your mind goes back to your Church. It’s a circular and pointless discussion. It’s why I didn’t sift thru the remainder of your post - no disrespect intended. I don’t believe any of the lore, no matter who wrote it.