Simple Question: 12wk Plan

so you ignore when you’re wrong and can’t offer a good counter argument? i know walkway agrees with me as do many others with actual experience using the compound. bury your head in the sand if you want.

[quote]Test Icicle wrote:
cyco: thanks for weighing in. I will put anything in my body…except clen. I’ve had 2 bad experiences with it, from different RC’s and won’t use it again. I actually just threw away $120 worth a few weeks ago. I will, however, eat ephedrine and caffeine like it’s going out of style. Cutting back for the holidays is no problem; I’m very goal-oriented. Not having a goal is how I got to this current, sorry state.

I’m still a bit confused about what I should be doing. There’s really no consensus yet, is there? Should I be cutting cals because I need to lose some fluff or boosting to get the most out of my cycle? [/quote]

i wouldn’t go crazy with dropping calories, although i do think you should be in a deficit here…

while T3 taken for long times/high doses can eat up muscle, at lower doses it can be almost anabolic, and increase beta-2 receptors in fat cells. that makes it more worthwhile to stack with ephedrine, as it’s a good fat burner on it’s own, and makes the beta-2 fat burners more effective.

[quote]joyfull wrote:
so you ignore when you’re wrong and can’t offer a good counter argument? i know walkway agrees with me as do many others with actual experience using the compound. bury your head in the sand if you want.[/quote]

here’s the deal… if you want to prove how safe DNP is, then go ahead and post the data.

just because some random person on the internet tells me it’s safe, doesn’t mean i’m gonna believe them.

there is plenty of science showing obvious risks, however:

http://www.epa.gov/ttnatw01/hlthef/dinitrop.html

As far as your claims about clenbuterol, here is a study that directly refutes what you say. i’m not saying it’s great for long-term health, but they used 720 mcg/day on heart patients with no ill effects on the heart:

And while T3 increases protein degradation at high doses, it still causes fat loss at a higher rate than muscle loss, which can most be likely offset by a beta-2 agonist:

http://press.endocrine.org/doi/abs/10.1210/jcem.82.3.3827

so the question is this: why would someone who simply needs to drop a few pounds go with DNP, which is not at all synergistic with AAS and training, when they could use clen/ephedrine and/or T3 which makes AAS more effective and is less risky?

@ The-German - I like your idea about increasing the workload. I’m a big fan of Berardi’s and G-flux.

@joyfull - After giving this a lot of thought, I think you’re right about cutting; it’ll look much better to be a bit smaller and cut than larger and soft. While I’m not anti-DNP and I appreciate all the discussion, I don’t think it’s appropriate for what I’m trying to do here (which is look good naked while also being able to fully participate in my day-to-day life).

TBH, I cycle infrequently and have been looking for an excuse to start another one, and this gave me that excuse. I’m not in a great starting position though because of my fluff and I think trying to cut and gain size is so suboptimal that I won’t be happy with the results. So, for the next 6 weeks I’m going to focus on dropping weight, then starting my cycle once I rid myself of some fat. At that point, however I look come Feb will be the best I can do given my starting point and tons better than how I look now.

Cheers, everyone.