T Nation

Shoulders before Flat bench


#1

Hey guys, I was wondering if its bad to be doing hang clean and jerk, push press, and barbell shrugs before doing flat bench?

Hang clean and jerks are sets of 3 reps.

Push press is sets of 5 reps.

Barbell shrugs are in sets of around 10 reps.

Then I do flat bench in sets of 5 reps.


#2

You can do it but it would probably make the bench weaker. Also, for olympic lifts I would stay away from bench to keep the shoulder flexibility you need for snatches. Up to you though, and your commitment to Oly lifting vs just lifting heavy.


#3

[quote]cloystreng wrote:
You can do it but it would probably make the bench weaker. Also, for olympic lifts I would stay away from bench to keep the shoulder flexibility you need for snatches. Up to you though, and your commitment to Oly lifting vs just lifting heavy.[/quote]

Ive never done snatches but have been thinking about it. My most important lifts right now are hang clean and jerk, front squats, dead lifts, and flat bench (least important).

I might get rid of the flat bench and start doing hang snatches before my hang cleans and jerks.


#4

@Natebrochill
Interesting lifts for a person on this site…you’re training like a thrower (shot, discus, hammer, jav). I used to do something very similar. My favorite exercise was by far the power snatch. I’m surprised you’re doing the push press after the jerk…and the shrugs. Adding snatch to this pretty intensive day would be a mistake. All of those lifts do have their place though…even bench press (which I was terrible at…was actually less than my max on hang clean).

I used to do it last as well and it showed…it was interesting though…my incline bench was actually slightly better than the flat bench at the time (330 incline, 320 flat). I had pretty decent lifts in the hang clean (162.5) and power snatch (117.5)…not sure how a bp over 400 would’ve affected it. You should do snatch though if you’re in a power sport. I’d recommend splitting it up…and still do two olympic movements every day…like:

day one: power snatch, clean pulls from blocks (ditch the shrugs), bench press
day two: hang clean, snatch high pulls from floor, front squat
day three: off
day four: hang snatch, maybe take a break from pulls, incline bench (maybe try different grips or pauses here and there),
day five: squat…i hated squats…would prefer just giving the whole day to lower body varieties and ditch the olympic stuff for a day…1/4, full squat w/ box jumps, step ups, lunges, etc

You should ask Christian Thibaudeau how he’d recommend mixing olympic lifts with the traditional stuff…I’d be curious for his response…after all…lifting was to supplement a sport for me…it was third on priority after throwing and plyometrics

…about plyos…you should consider supplementing as well with hurdle hops (put 6 in a row and bound over them)…that was my favorite at least…did them usually twice a week for 5-6 sets…would only do them in phases though…prior to a peak do them starting 1.5 months out and taper them off to nothing with a week or so left before competition


#5

quick question…anybody out there that trains olympic lifts as their primary focus have a higher incline than flat bench press?

one more exercise for that same guy…rack press is awesome. you need a power rack that’s very tall inside (i’m 6’5’’ and they do make them tall enough for me to do them) where you put the stoppers at shoulder level and just do standing military press from the pins…i’d actually set it closer to chin height

oh…must give props to creatine. that’s the only supplement i ever used and it was amazing…all lifts would go up about twenty pounds in 1.5 weeks…would feel bloated though (gained around 7 pounds in a week from water retention)


#6

[quote]gtdiscus wrote:
@Natebrochill
Interesting lifts for a person on this site…you’re training like a thrower (shot, discus, hammer, jav). I used to do something very similar. My favorite exercise was by far the power snatch. I’m surprised you’re doing the push press after the jerk…and the shrugs. Adding snatch to this pretty intensive day would be a mistake. All of those lifts do have their place though…even bench press (which I was terrible at…was actually less than my max on hang clean). I used to do it last as well and it showed…it was interesting though…my incline bench was actually slightly better than the flat bench at the time (330 incline, 320 flat). I had pretty decent lifts in the hang clean (162.5) and power snatch (117.5)…not sure how a bp over 400 would’ve affected it. You should do snatch though if you’re in a power sport. I’d recommend splitting it up…and still do two olympic movements every day…like:
day one: power snatch, clean pulls from blocks (ditch the shrugs), bench press
day two: hang clean, snatch high pulls from floor, front squat
day three: off
day four: hang snatch, maybe take a break from pulls, incline bench (maybe try different grips or pauses here and there),
day five: squat…i hated squats…would prefer just giving the whole day to lower body varieties and ditch the olympic stuff for a day…1/4, full squat w/ box jumps, step ups, lunges, etc
You should ask Christian Thibaudeau how he’d recommend mixing olympic lifts with the traditional stuff…I’d be curious for his response…after all…lifting was to supplement a sport for me…it was third on priority after throwing and plyometrics
…about plyos…you should consider supplementing as well with hurdle hops (put 6 in a row and bound over them)…that was my favorite at least…did them usually twice a week for 5-6 sets…would only do them in phases though…prior to a peak do them starting 1.5 months out and taper them off to nothing with a week or so left before competition[/quote]

Thanks man.

I have this day loaded with lifts because I only workout on my off days of work. I work 32 hours a week and have school Monday through Friday. My other two days are back (main lift: deadlifts) and legs (main lift: front squats). I am in the process of getting my hips and core ready for front squats because I cant get too low without pissing off my hip flexors and its hard for me to keep lumber curve when getting in a deep front squat.

I don’t do any sports just like to lift weights. Oly and Power Lifts mainly but I still do pull ups, barbell rows, dips ect.


#7

[quote]gtdiscus wrote:
quick question…anybody out there that trains olympic lifts as their primary focus have a higher incline than flat bench press?

one more exercise for that same guy…rack press is awesome. you need a power rack that’s very tall inside (i’m 6’5’’ and they do make them tall enough for me to do them) where you put the stoppers at shoulder level and just do standing military press from the pins…i’d actually set it closer to chin height

oh…must give props to creatine. that’s the only supplement i ever used and it was amazing…all lifts would go up about twenty pounds in 1.5 weeks…would feel bloated though (gained around 7 pounds in a week from water retention)[/quote]

Haha damn man. Ive been gaining a couple pounds a week. Eating around 6-7 small meals a day (small as in like a sandwich). Started at 135 lbs and now I am 151 lbs. Been training on this routine/diet for a couple of months.

And to your question it all depends on if they are training chest at all. If they only do Oly lifts then I would say incline just because of jerks/push press. You probably already know that though.


#8

[quote]Natebrochill wrote:
Hey guys, I was wondering if its bad to be doing hang clean and jerk, push press, and barbell shrugs before doing flat bench?

Hang clean and jerks are sets of 3 reps.

Push press is sets of 5 reps.

Barbell shrugs are in sets of around 10 reps.

Then I do flat bench in sets of 5 reps.

[/quote]

I personally wouldn’t do flat bench after shoulders. Shoulders are really important stabilizers on the bench. I personally, also have issues because my shoulders will get to tight after things like the push press.

I’d either do bench before shoulder work or do a more shoulder friendly bench chest exercise.

Just my .02.


#9

Personally, I can’t incline bench. Any weight over like 150 really hurts in the armpit area. Somethings tight there, and I couldn’t bring myself to care about it at all. Flat bench is fine. Shoulder press is fine. Jerks are fine. Everything except incline bench. Well, I can do DB incline bench. Not barbell. Its strange. And I train for Oly lifting, yes.