Shoulder Problem, AAS Related?

Pharma / TRT
1

In the middle of my second cycle, taking the same stuff I did the first time, but having crippling pain in my shoulders (when lifting). I know it’s not an adex/too much e-supression issue because I don’t have pain in any other joints and I’m on a fairly low dose of adex anyway.

On my chest day I’ll start out with bench, I get past my two/three warm up sets to get use to the weight, and even from my first working set I have issues bringing down the bar. I bring the bar down slow enough already, but I have to do it VERY slow now for the first rep or it feels like something very bad will happen…then I can bang the rest out, no prob.

By the time I’m done with flat bench my shoulders are already hurting- and by the time I’m done with my chest work out (4 total exercises, 4 sets each) I’m in excruciating pain. The same thing happens during my triceps workout as well. …and Also after doing squats. I did legs yesterday, but took today off, thinking tomorrow it will be better, but it really feels like it could be a degenerative problem.

So why am I asking you? Well for one, to see if anybody has had any similar experiences (such as lifting too much weight that their body isn’t use to) and two- I’m wondering if it could possibly be blood pressure related?

I’m guessing the general consensus here will be to take a few days off and let them rest. Mentally it’s extremely frustrating when I’m trying to make the most out of a cycle.

2

All of this can be from your neck and rotator cuffs where inflammation and knotted up muscles irritate the nerves. Use naproxin and fish oil caps. Get the knots massaged out. Deep tissue work is painful. If it does not hurt its not the right technique. The jets in a spa or hot tub can be useful.

3

ONE response? Unbelievable.

4

It is virtually impossible for people on the internet to figure out why you have trouble completing reps early in a set but then have no problem later on. The internet is also not the right place to figure out why your shoulders experience progressively more pain as your chest routine goes on. Instead of people posting a response such as “well it could be any number of things” they have just chosen to ignore it. A qualified doctor is what you need.

You didn’t even say which drugs you were using. Wanting people to skim your post history to figure out what drugs you’ve used is asking too much. Just say what you’re on, it takes 5 seconds.

Has it occured to you to use less weight until the problem heals? Heals or you build the connective tissue strength to handle the loads. You can get your body used to the greater loads by making less dramtic jumps in weight from set to set or from session to session. I am not trying to sound patronizing but that sort of thing is common sense.

Edit

I didn’t even look at the timestamp. 5 hours and you complain?? Who are you?

5

[quote]Toby Queef wrote:
ONE response? Unbelievable. [/quote]

Dude - it hasn’t been that long. Give it a day…

I’m no expert but I will just share what I do. I have to be careful with my shoulders. I had a rotator cuff injury once that put me out of commission for about 2 or 3 months because I didn’t take care of it. I ended up having to stop working out my upper body completely for a period of time and only do ‘no load’ exercises to keep the range of motion.

I know that you are on cycle right now and you want to maximize your gains but really but I would NEVER ignore a shoulder injury again.

Here are some thoughts - I take fish oil as KSMan suggested - I take it everyday. I used to take flax seed oil for the same purpose - to ‘lubricate’ the joints. I also take glucosamine/chondroitin regularly also for joint health. knock on wood I haven’t had any problems since and I put A LOT of stress on my shoulders in my chest (and of course) shoulder days (and even bicep and tricep days - I know this because when I had my injury I realized that almost every upper body exercise used my shoulders to some degree). My key seems to be the choice of exercises that I do - I tend to stick to the ‘natural grip’ exercises where possible. I also incorporate a lot of rotator cuff exercises with high reps and low weight which seems to help. Lastly, I focus on good form especially when my shoulders are involved in any way being careful not to overextend. For example, I see guys at the gym that do the pec deck and set the arms super far back. I know that it’s important to stretch etc. but the first thing I do is reset them to no further back than 180 degrees. Sometimes I will even set them a few degrees in the positive direction but that’s just me…

I guess what I’m trying to say is you can continue to go heavy and gain on your cycle, but try to give your shoulders a break and whatever you do, don’t ignore an injury.

Die

6

Agree with all of the above, both wrt the advice and the wording of your second comment.

Shoulder injuries aren’t something to take lightly. Personally, I had a problematic shoulder that took YEARS to fully recover. Get some good imaging done… x-rays are often insufficient, though I’m sure that’ll be the first step.

The fact that you have pain when doing squats makes me think that either KSman is correct and there is a rotator cuff plus neck element to it, or you’ve actually got an AC issue, which would be unfortunate. Or I could be completely wrong, cuz this is the internetz.

Good luck.

7

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
It is virtually impossible for people on the internet to figure out why you have trouble completing reps early in a set but then have no problem later on. The internet is also not the right place to figure out why your shoulders experience progressively more pain as your chest routine goes on. Instead of people posting a response such as “well it could be any number of things” they have just chosen to ignore it. A qualified doctor is what you need.

You didn’t even say which drugs you were using. Wanting people to skim your post history to figure out what drugs you’ve used is asking too much. Just say what you’re on, it takes 5 seconds.

Has it occured to you to use less weight until the problem heals? Heals or you build the connective tissue strength to handle the loads. You can get your body used to the greater loads by making less dramtic jumps in weight from set to set or from session to session. I am not trying to sound patronizing but that sort of thing is common sense.

Edit

I didn’t even look at the timestamp. 5 hours and you complain?? Who are you?[/quote]

lol, you’re right, you didn’t look at the ‘timestamp’ because it was 17 hours, not 5. The amount of time elapsed is irrelevant really, it was more the fact that the thread had over 50 views and only person chose to give input.
Secondly, I don’t know why you chose to focus on the fact that I didn’t mention what I was taking as if THAT was going to be the issue. That is such a stretch. Is there a form of Test that doesn’t raise BP? I realize different compounds have different side effects, but it’s not as if I’m asking about MPH or something along those lines. It’s almost as if you were trying to avoid answering the question just to start an argument- on top of avoiding even reading the post. I already said I’m taking the same gear (from the same place) as I did last time, thus I do not suspect it is a gear issue. It’s just Test E and Dbol.

Furthermore, I ALSO stated in my post that I do 2-3 warm up sets on bench before hitting my working sets. You wouldn’t have come off as patronizing if you actually took the time to read that, because I suspect you wouldn’t have even said anything about that then.
I also said I had taken two days off from any workouts that involve my arms. Seriously, there is no way you could have even read my post beyond the first line.

[quote]DieSucka wrote:
Toby Queef wrote:
ONE response? Unbelievable.

Dude - it hasn’t been that long. Give it a day…

I’m no expert but I will just share what I do. I have to be careful with my shoulders. I had a rotator cuff injury once that put me out of commission for about 2 or 3 months because I didn’t take care of it. I ended up having to stop working out my upper body completely for a period of time and only do ‘no load’ exercises to keep the range of motion.

I know that you are on cycle right now and you want to maximize your gains but really but I would NEVER ignore a shoulder injury again.

Here are some thoughts - I take fish oil as KSMan suggested - I take it everyday. I used to take flax seed oil for the same purpose - to ‘lubricate’ the joints. I also take glucosamine/chondroitin regularly also for joint health. knock on wood I haven’t had any problems since and I put A LOT of stress on my shoulders in my chest (and of course) shoulder days (and even bicep and tricep days - I know this because when I had my injury I realized that almost every upper body exercise used my shoulders to some degree). My key seems to be the choice of exercises that I do - I tend to stick to the ‘natural grip’ exercises where possible. I also incorporate a lot of rotator cuff exercises with high reps and low weight which seems to help. Lastly, I focus on good form especially when my shoulders are involved in any way being careful not to overextend. For example, I see guys at the gym that do the pec deck and set the arms super far back. I know that it’s important to stretch etc. but the first thing I do is reset them to no further back than 180 degrees. Sometimes I will even set them a few degrees in the positive direction but that’s just me…

I guess what I’m trying to say is you can continue to go heavy and gain on your cycle, but try to give your shoulders a break and whatever you do, don’t ignore an injury.
[/quote]

I’ve been taking fish oil and I may start taking glucosamine while on this cycle. I did my shoulder workout tonight, and it wasn’t nearly as painful as I thought it would be. My chest and triceps exercises are much more strenuous.
I know when I first started lifting I didn’t pay close enough attention to what I was doing with my shoulders (your pec deck example would’ve been me in my younger days) but I changed that awhile ago and it really seemed to help alleviate some of the problems I had. I only recently started doing more rotator cuff exercises when my chiropractor thought they might help. I’ve seen a chiro. semi-regularly for the last few years and it always seemed to help…temporarily.
My right shoulder seems to slump down and forward a little- and they need to reset it like every two-three weeks usually. The problem is that the shoulder could be slumping from a completely different reason like something going on in my back.
I have a great chiropractor which typically keeps me from seeing a doctor. I’ve seen so many people go in for shoulder/neck/back issues to a doctor and they end up having surgery or an operation for something totally minor. It blows my mind. So that’s why I’m hesitant to see a doctor about something like this.
I’ve had x-rays done of my shoulder in May, but they were ‘inconclusive’.

8

[quote]Toby Queef wrote:
BONEZ217 wrote:
It is virtually impossible for people on the internet to figure out why you have trouble completing reps early in a set but then have no problem later on. The internet is also not the right place to figure out why your shoulders experience progressively more pain as your chest routine goes on. Instead of people posting a response such as “well it could be any number of things” they have just chosen to ignore it. A qualified doctor is what you need.

You didn’t even say which drugs you were using. Wanting people to skim your post history to figure out what drugs you’ve used is asking too much. Just say what you’re on, it takes 5 seconds.

Has it occured to you to use less weight until the problem heals? Heals or you build the connective tissue strength to handle the loads. You can get your body used to the greater loads by making less dramtic jumps in weight from set to set or from session to session. I am not trying to sound patronizing but that sort of thing is common sense.

Edit

I didn’t even look at the timestamp. 5 hours and you complain?? Who are you?

lol, you’re right, you didn’t look at the ‘timestamp’ because it was 17 hours, not 5. The amount of time elapsed is irrelevant really, it was more the fact that the thread had over 50 views and only person chose to give input.
Secondly, I don’t know why you chose to focus on the fact that I didn’t mention what I was taking as if THAT was going to be the issue. That is such a stretch. Is there a form of Test that doesn’t raise BP? I realize different compounds have different side effects, but it’s not as if I’m asking about MPH or something along those lines. It’s almost as if you were trying to avoid answering the question just to start an argument- on top of avoiding even reading the post. I already said I’m taking the same gear (from the same place) as I did last time, thus I do not suspect it is a gear issue. It’s just Test E and Dbol.

Furthermore, I ALSO stated in my post that I do 2-3 warm up sets on bench before hitting my working sets. You wouldn’t have come off as patronizing if you actually took the time to read that, because I suspect you wouldn’t have even said anything about that then.
I also said I had taken two days off from any workouts that involve my arms. Seriously, there is no way you could have even read my post beyond the first line.

[/quote]

You’re right about the time. I just glanced at it. Oh well.

I’ll reiterate. No one answered because it’s an impossible question to answer. And instead of giving you that one line I explained it a little. Good luck getting any more replies.

Edit

And of course which drugs you are using is relevant. How are we supposed to know if you are getting enough estrogen conversion in your cycle? Or if you are using too much AI?

What do your warm up sets have to do with the fact that your early work sets are harder to complete than your later ones? What do warm up have to do with the increase in pain you experience throughout the workout?

9

IMO the best glucosamine type product on the market is GLC 2000 originally developed for race horses, just google it

10

Alright Toby, I’ve been out of town for awhile so here is your answer… hate it or love it Bonez is right on this one. In my professional opinion you should go see a Dr. if it’s bothering you that bad. IMHO it’s probably not BP related, maybe the juice, but most likely has to do more with your back(see rotator cuff Supra and Infraspinatus, Sub scapluarius, Teres minor). Meaning even if you are warming up really well those are pretty small muscles whose primary funtion is internal and external rotation of the gleno-humeral joint(palms in & palms out motion)and are easily over loaded/over used. Most men’s backs are pretty broad and hang off the sides of the bench unless you’re really meticulious about “setting” your shoulder blades.

Side Note 1: Setting your shoulder blades- Stand straight up with hands by your sides. Now, turn your thumbs away from your body as far as you can, that’s external rotation. Feel how your shoulder blades retracted together? Thats setting your shoulder blades, it helps emphasize pec major activation and reduce overload on the rotator cuff.

Side 2: It could be the juice because you’re getting really strong, really quick, lifting heavy, all of which sets you up for that shoulder injury. Sorry bro, hate to piss in your Wheaties, but thats what it sounds like…OVERUSE.
To help you can try doing what I suggested on the bench or you can try one of my favorite chest exercises. The Ball Chest Press- It allows for natural movement of the scapula, plus it burns the hell out of your ass holding that bridge, it works on your periphial nervous system(bal/stab/core strenght), and I get a great pump. Done.

Oh yea btw I’m no bet’n man but, I got 20 bucks that says if Mr. Queef does go to the Dr. all he gets is a NSAID. Out J-23

11

[quote]morepain wrote:
IMO the best glucosamine type product on the market is GLC 2000 originally developed for race horses, just google it[/quote]

I have had struggles with my shoulders and elbows for some time. It been one reason Nandrolone is usually a part of my cycles since I do experience some relief while on ND. However, invariably as I come off and the weeks go by I regress back into greater pain.

Now I routine take 10G of fish oil a day. But that only helps so much too. I have tried Glucosamine previously and was under impressed. However, Im giving it another go right now. This time I decided to quadruple the dosing. Most pills or serving are 1500mg Im taking 6000mg ED along with 6000mg of MSM. After just 10 days Im pleased to report I can feel a difference already. So while GLC 2000 might be best I’d advise anyone who expects to see anything from Glucosamine to try a significantly higher dose.

Its not a cure all and after just 10 days I know Im probably a month away from where I’ll eventually be; but so far so good

12

[quote]James23 wrote:
Alright Toby, I’ve been out of town for awhile so here is your answer… hate it or love it Bonez is right on this one. In my professional opinion you should go see a Dr. if it’s bothering you that bad. IMHO it’s probably not BP related, maybe the juice, but most likely has to do more with your back(see rotator cuff Supra and Infraspinatus, Sub scapluarius, Teres minor). Meaning even if you are warming up really well those are pretty small muscles whose primary funtion is internal and external rotation of the gleno-humeral joint(palms in & palms out motion)and are easily over loaded/over used. Most men’s backs are pretty broad and hang off the sides of the bench unless you’re really meticulious about “setting” your shoulder blades.

Side Note 1: Setting your shoulder blades- Stand straight up with hands by your sides. Now, turn your thumbs away from your body as far as you can, that’s external rotation. Feel how your shoulder blades retracted together? Thats setting your shoulder blades, it helps emphasize pec major activation and reduce overload on the rotator cuff.

Side 2: It could be the juice because you’re getting really strong, really quick, lifting heavy, all of which sets you up for that shoulder injury. Sorry bro, hate to piss in your Wheaties, but thats what it sounds like…OVERUSE.
To help you can try doing what I suggested on the bench or you can try one of my favorite chest exercises. The Ball Chest Press- It allows for natural movement of the scapula, plus it burns the hell out of your ass holding that bridge, it works on your periphial nervous system(bal/stab/core strenght), and I get a great pump. Done.

Oh yea btw I’m no bet’n man but, I got 20 bucks that says if Mr. Queef does go to the Dr. all he gets is a NSAID. Out J-23[/quote]

I do set my shoulders when I bench. It’s more difficult for me to do it on flat bench than decline, but I still do my best because I know how much it helps me.
Bro, I am telling you, it is not the gear. I’m essentially doing the SAME cycle I did last time, except I upped the Dbol 10mg- that’s it, I don’t think that constitutes “overuse”. My lifting patterns are the same as they were before too. To start out I’m not doing much more weight than I normally would, just more reps, in attempt to avoid situations like this.

When I did my shoulder workout, I felt pretty good- the only exercises that seem to wreak havoc on my shoulders are FLAT bench (close and wide grip) and Dips. I would go to a doctor, but for the first time in my life it’s really not that feasible. I’m in a transition period where I just graduated from college, am off my parents insurance, and am literally just starting working as an independent contractor (very slow going) so I obviously don’t have insurance and can’t afford it at the moment.

I think I will also try to find some glucosamine and up the fishoil while on cycle to see if it helps.

I did some ‘ball chest press’ sets tonight, they didn’t seem to aggravate my shoulder. What else would you suggest for ‘shoulder rehab’ with the rotator cuff?