T Nation

Should I Wait or Go Ahead? 1st Cycle

Hi guys,

I posted on TRT section earlier this month. Issue at hand:

  • My Dr. tested my T3, both results were low. First test 200 ng/dL and second test 288 ng/dL
  • Dr gave me a referral to see a Endocrinologist for TRT but no appointment with this particular endo (who is TRT friendly) for 4 months.

Current stats:

  • 36 year old male
  • Been training on and off for 10 years
  • Weighing 105kg with around 30% body fat, so not super fat but not lean either. I keep decent muscle mass. Photo below.
  • BP slightly high, regular readings at ~150/70
  • No prior steroid use

I have enough pharma test at hand as well as arimidex/noval/evista.

Question is, is it a stupid idea to get on a test only cycle to accelerate my bf decrease and increase lean body mass whilst I wait to see an endocrinologist for TRT?

Logic behind this is that I feel that because I have low T3, it’ makes it harder for me to lose the bf needed plus I feel lethargic, unmotivated, and with slight ED, hence why I want to see the endo to discuss ongoing TRT.

Thoughts?

Current physique:

regular readings at 150/70? please elaborate in detail on when you are taking readings and where, are you using the appropriate size cuff?

I have been taking my BP every other day as precaution for the last few weeks using the QardioArm BP Monitor.

I take the BP early in the morning and afternoons, always laying down and it’s consistent, always around ~150/70.

I would wait because your endo will probably want to give you more blood tests, before prescribing you testosterone. Doing a cycle unless very short is going to effect the results of his tests.

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Testosterone doesn’t burn fat. Eat less and you’ll lose weight. If you have a thyroid problem then you should address that, it’s not something to leave hanging out there. If you already have elevated BP then absolutely do not start a cycle. If you’re planning on going on trt soon and it’s being done through a new doctor you have no experience with then absolutely do not start a cycle.

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You have elevated BP, can you confirm its not a faulty cuff/monitor and get it done manually?

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Your endocrinologist my one to retest. Mine did. Even though I already had multiple tests already

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Thanks mate. Agree with you, will wait until I see the new endo.

My doctor took my BP, and it was higher with him too, so it’s not my monitor. My gf’s readings are within range using the same monitor.

“If you already have elevated BP then absolutely do not start a cycle.” THIS IS GOSPEL. Don’t go try and find justification for starting the cycle until this is taken care of.

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You aren’t 30%, you aren’t lean… But not as high as 30%

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Damn man, you must be going crazy with thyroid hormones this high! :laughing:

I don’t think you are near 30%. You actually look more around 20. I’d guess between 19 and 24%.

If this is confirmed for more than a few weeks, you must go to the doctor, he’ll put you on medication for it. It could be that if you lose weight, your blood pressure goes down. You could also wait until you’re lighter and see in a few weeks if you start a good diet now. Also look at the list for lifestyle changes for blood pressure. Life style changes are known to be more effective than medication. If you don’t get under 140 in 8-12 weeks, I’d advise you to go for medication.

Now, diet. Don’t do testosterone, just diet and lift. The muscle loss on a diet is for the greatest part a myth except for excessive diets. Shoot for a loss of 1-1.5 kg in 2 weeks and you’ll be ok. If you drop carbs and salt (a bit) it could be that your blood pressure gets better fast.

For TRT wait for the Endo.

Thank you everyone, I’ll take the consensus here and don’t start any cycles until my test levels are sorted with the Endo.

I’ve started to diet and aiming for 1kg per week with nutrition as follows:

2,620 cals per day

330 grams protein
100 grams carbs
100 grams fat

I’m tracking all my meals with MyFitnessPal so should be pretty accurate. Hopefully the BP issue will get better once I shed 5 or so kg.

Add more LISS. I’m a broken record around here with that particular statement, but it’s good for lowering BP and it helps you raise TDEE, which helps when you’re cutting.

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I think 330 protein is overload and will be detrimental to your mental well-being and your will power to stick the course because to eat 330 p you dropped your carbs to 100 g.
150 g is around the amount of sugar that your brain uses every day so drop below that and you won’t be happy very long. I’d drop the protein to 250 and take the remaining 320 kcal and put at least 200 of them in carbs, so:

250 g protein (still enough at 105 kg)
180 g carbs
100 g fat

You could also drop the fat to around 80 and up the carbs a bit more depending on how you feel.

All if this is just advice. If you did a few diets before and you know what works for you, more power to you.

Also the LISS advice is great. I do slow walking for a few km, which is overall just a benefit.

Yep. High BP is tough on kidneys if protein is high.

IMO, 200 g of protein a day would for sure be sufficient. More is generally okay, but gets expensive, isn’t very environmentally friendly (generally), and might be worse for you if you also have high BP.

I think it depends on BW. He’s 230 lbs. On diet most fitness trainers recommend a bit more than 1 g/lbs

I think we here are not in a position to make this argument convincingly as for the most part we shoot up non biodegradable substances cooked in an unregulated underground lab haha (no need to take this serious or start an argument)

I’ve always heard this, but don’t really agree with it. I think going off of LBM makes sense, not total BW. Does a 250 lb man that is 40% BF need to be eating 250 g/protein?

I guess the environmental impact here is unknown to me. Test is made from yams, and the oil is a small quantity.

I eat plenty of animal products. I drive a car. I am not trying to be holier than thou (tough with the lord himself). I do however think being aware of our consumption is a good thing. I try to drive economical cars, and drive them a long time (current car has 190K on it and is a 2005). I guess I am just advocating that people think about what they consume. It is all relative. Some parts of the world would see my consumption as hedonistic, but I consume a lot less new products than most people (in the US). On the other hand, I probably eat more meat than an average American, which is a lot.

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I think BW is alright if LBM is reasonable. We are generally not talking about 40% people. But I agree LBM would be better

I agree with everything in that paragraph.

Just for Information and Fun purposes: there’s a whole field called environmental pharmaceutics which tries to find problems with compounds and production and other things and find alternatives (one example would be substituting diclofenac with ibuprofen). The field is relatively young and right now it is crossed by these militant hard left-wing environmentalists which leads to assumptions, political correctness and virtue signaling more than real findings. That is a shame since the field is important (estrogen and metformin metabolites in drinking water) and I think if more serious scientists go into it, there’s a lot to be learned. Problem is that that’s a nono for your earnings so no top notch scientist will do it.

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Just to play devil’s advocate here… if you wanted to be environmentally correct you would drive a car with far more emissions systems that a 2005 model. Shame on you!

Also, I’m not eco friendly. I don’t litter, my hippy love of earth stops there.