[quote]VTBalla34 wrote:
There are plenty of security and armed guards around the installation, which is not very large. [/quote]
Exhibit 1 from the proposition that guards alone will not stop a person willing to die in his or her quest to murder, as “penty of security” did not work here.
Layered defenses (including not disarming competent personnel and civilians because it is politically correct so to do) has worked in Israel to deter these types of attacks.
Guards, even “plenty of guards,” just can’t be everywhere at one time.
[quote]Hell-Billy wrote:
Didn’t Alexis get a DD for criminal conduct, seems like it would be impossible to get a contractor job with that on your record.[/quote]
He was on medication for “hearing voices” and shot up a neighbor’s car and through the ceiling of his apartment into the apartment above.
[quote]Hell-Billy wrote:
Didn’t Alexis get a DD for criminal conduct, seems like it would be impossible to get a contractor job with that on your record.[/quote]
He was on medication for “hearing voices” and shot up a neighbor’s car and through the ceiling of his apartment into the apartment above.[/quote]
Not exactly the kind of person i would trust with a job requiring a security clearance.
Yeah, he was clearly a dude who had no business being hired by the government, and having any sort of base access int he first place. As cold as it sounds, I can’t say I’m surprised this terrible judgment bit them in the ass so badly. I feel for the families that have suffered because of that indiscretion.
[quote]Hell-Billy wrote:
Didn’t Alexis get a DD for criminal conduct, seems like it would be impossible to get a contractor job with that on your record.[/quote]
He was on medication for “hearing voices” and shot up a neighbor’s car and through the ceiling of his apartment into the apartment above.[/quote]
Not exactly the kind of person i would trust with a job requiring a security clearance.[/quote]
It’s not as hard to get as some may think. It was a few years pre-9/11 but I had mid-level security clearance when I worked for a construction company in Virginia at a naval shipyard. It was basically rubber stamped (actually a little colored dot sticker).
Then for further clearances I got a form from the employer stating why I needed it and another dot. Before you know it you are walking around and working in areas with top secret security clearance.
Not that I’m psychologically unstable or anything, but nobody really looked either. It’s not like guys in dark suits interview you grade school teachers or anything.
[quote]Hell-Billy wrote:
Didn’t Alexis get a DD for criminal conduct, seems like it would be impossible to get a contractor job with that on your record.[/quote]
He was on medication for “hearing voices” and shot up a neighbor’s car and through the ceiling of his apartment into the apartment above.[/quote]
Not exactly the kind of person i would trust with a job requiring a security clearance.[/quote]
It’s not as hard to get as some may think. It was a few years pre-9/11 but I had mid-level security clearance when I worked for a construction company in Virginia at a naval shipyard. It was basically rubber stamped (actually a little colored dot sticker).
Then for further clearances I got a form from the employer stating why I needed it and another dot. Before you know it you are walking around and working in areas with top secret security clearance.
Not that I’m psychologically unstable or anything, but nobody really looked either. It’s not like guys in dark suits interview you grade school teachers or anything.
[/quote]
HA, well not sure about before 9/11 but when I had to have a TS activated in 2007 they made me fill out a form with address going back 10years and give names of people that knew me or that lived near me or I worked for. And I can tell you some of those people did get calls and in one case had a sit down with the person doing the background investigation.
I’m not sure how it works for Contract Workers though
The place had private security in full force. I had to show two forms of ID and walk through a metal detector and not even a multi-tool on my key-chain was allowed in.
[/quote]
This is not the case for the majority of buildings on the Navy yard…and I do not know for sure if our security has a “private” element to it. The majority, if not all, are MP’s. [/quote]
The section I went thru to get metro passes had tons of security but they seemed private and not MP. Also they seemed to be on top of it. I thought my key chain was going to keep me from getting in.[/quote]
Were they DOD cops?
The place had private security in full force. I had to show two forms of ID and walk through a metal detector and not even a multi-tool on my key-chain was allowed in.
[/quote]
This is not the case for the majority of buildings on the Navy yard…and I do not know for sure if our security has a “private” element to it. The majority, if not all, are MP’s. [/quote]
The section I went thru to get metro passes had tons of security but they seemed private and not MP. Also they seemed to be on top of it. I thought my key chain was going to keep me from getting in.[/quote]
Were they DOD cops? [/quote]
Not sure
I know they dressed different than regular Federal Security I see in buildings. I’m almost positive it was not Military. Now the outside gate people that was military.
Watching the news on this is sad to puzzling. In a race to say something they are saying almost everything that comes across the desk. Rumor or not seems everything is coming out as a semi fact.
They even posted a Animation showing the shooter with a semi auto rifle then came out (on the same NBC News site) with a report from the FBI saying they think he may have only used a pistol (from a security guard or police) and a shotgun.
By the time the official report comes out it won’t matter from all the “maybe and we think” that has already be reported as facts.
[quote]four60 wrote:
Watching the news on this is sad to puzzling. In a race to say something they are saying almost everything that comes across the desk. Rumor or not seems everything is coming out as a semi fact.
They even posted a Animation showing the shooter with a semi auto rifle then came out (on the same NBC News site) with a report from the FBI saying they think he may have only used a pistol (from a security guard or police) and a shotgun.
By the time the official report comes out it won’t matter from all the “maybe and we think” that has already be reported as facts.
This is strange and sad [/quote]
You’re damn right man. I find the speculation from the media disgusting in these events. There is no pride in journalism, just greed trying to generate ratings.
[quote]VTBalla34 wrote:
There are plenty of security and armed guards around the installation, which is not very large. [/quote]
Exhibit 1 from the proposition that guards alone will not stop a person willing to die in his or her quest to murder, as “penty of security” did not work here.
Layered defenses (including not disarming competent personnel and civilians because it is politically correct so to do) has worked in Israel to deter these types of attacks.
Guards, even “plenty of guards,” just can’t be everywhere at one time.[/quote]
Different culture buddy. We’re talking about the US here. Loony toons be 'errwhere.
So does anyone know if his death was self-inflicted or the result of being fired upon?
More leverage for the repeal of the 2nd ammendment. Clearly an Obama plant.
In all seriousness, this is unfortunate to hear. I don’t know where people get these ideas that “shootings” are the solution. If you hate the world, off yourself, and move on. These people are pussies.
[quote]hungry4more wrote:
Yeah, he was clearly a dude who had no business being hired by the government, and having any sort of base access int he first place. As cold as it sounds, I can’t say I’m surprised this terrible judgment bit them in the ass so badly. I feel for the families that have suffered because of that indiscretion. [/quote]
Where are you getting that he is a government employee? And up until a couple months ago, you could access the washington navy yard freely with a drivers license. It is not a secure compound, like a nuclear silo. Civilians can still enter it, throught he pass and id office. There is a museum inside the Yard that civilians are welcome to visit.
[quote]Hell-Billy wrote:
Didn’t Alexis get a DD for criminal conduct, seems like it would be impossible to get a contractor job with that on your record.[/quote]
He was on medication for “hearing voices” and shot up a neighbor’s car and through the ceiling of his apartment into the apartment above.[/quote]
Not exactly the kind of person i would trust with a job requiring a security clearance.[/quote]
It’s not as hard to get as some may think. It was a few years pre-9/11 but I had mid-level security clearance when I worked for a construction company in Virginia at a naval shipyard. It was basically rubber stamped (actually a little colored dot sticker).
Then for further clearances I got a form from the employer stating why I needed it and another dot. Before you know it you are walking around and working in areas with top secret security clearance.
Not that I’m psychologically unstable or anything, but nobody really looked either. It’s not like guys in dark suits interview you grade school teachers or anything.
[/quote]
Has it come out that the guy had a security clearance? Or are we just speculating here?
Edit: NEvermind I just read that he did. I have been travelling all day and not able to keep up with the developments. Said it was issued in 2008, which is not too surprising that he was still able to access. Unfortunately it is NOT a fool proof process, obviously, as you stated. I suspect there are many people out there who if the government had unlimited resources and time to investigate, would probably pull the clearance of.
[quote]timbofirstblood wrote:
No one should have to die at work. [/quote]
They were military personnel, and we are at war. Dying at work is not entirely unheard of for military personnel during a war. They just weren’t expecting enemy fire from somebody who looked like them.
The only thing clear about this situation so far is that not all is as it seems.
[quote]timbofirstblood wrote:
No one should have to die at work. [/quote]
They were military personnel, and we are at war. Dying at work is not entirely unheard of for military personnel during a war. They just weren’t expecting enemy fire from somebody who looked like them.
The only thing clear about this situation so far is that not all is as it seems. [/quote]
Most were civilians…the same ones that took a 20% paycut from furloughs for part of this year because Congress doesn’t think they do the same job at military guys that work right beside them…
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
Unreal. it seems nobody is safe anymore. I feel for the families of those killed…you’re never supposed to die, but if people absolutely had to go, at least it could have been in combat instead of on the homefront, to give some sort of meaning to the families left behind :(.[/quote]
It was combat. Just kind of one-sided because nobody was able to return fire.
The entire point of guerrilla warfare is to bring the battle to the enemy on his own ground: “hit the other fellow as quick as you can, as quick as you can, where it hurts him the most, when he ain’t lookin’.”
That is precisely what this operative did. We don’t know who he was, what his motives were, or who he was working for. Now that he’s dead, we aren’t likely to find out much that resembles the truth. But something tells me he accomplished his objective. Guess we’ll find out in the coming days what the ramifications of his having accomplished his objective might be.
[quote]timbofirstblood wrote:
No one should have to die at work. [/quote]
They were military personnel, and we are at war. Dying at work is not entirely unheard of for military personnel during a war. They just weren’t expecting enemy fire from somebody who looked like them.
The only thing clear about this situation so far is that not all is as it seems. [/quote]
Most were civilians…the same ones that took a 20% paycut from furloughs for part of this year because Congress doesn’t think they do the same job at military guys that work right beside them…[/quote]
Military contractors doing the same job as military personnel, alongside military personnel on a military base.