T Nation

Self Medicating - T3


#1

i know, i know i shouldnt touch this stuff w/o being under a Dr's supervision BUT i am 20 years old and invincible. so now that that's out of the way...

so i was wondering, would a basic replacement dose of 25 mcg T3 per day be a (relatively) good option?


#2

back ground info - forgot

i was under the supervision of a well known poster here for a couple months and through extensive testing (nearly every test on the requisition sheet) it was determined that i was in fact hypothyroid and had decreased test levels due to the underactive thyroid

its been about 6 months of supplementing vit C, dessicated beef liver, selenium, vit D, tyrosine, digestive enzymes, basic multi vitamin, zinc, magnesium, calcium and a few others i cant remember to name... any way you get the point.

over the aforementioned time my t3 only increased 5% still below the normal range so i said fuck it ordered some cytomel from india

my mother's side of the family has a history of hypothyroid - 3 aunts are on thyroid meds although my mother is not by they are irish (heard some theories of potato famine causing irish descendants to be more proned to hypothyroidism)

i tried dieting to extreme measures on my own going literally 0 carb (or as close as possible) at 1800 calories a day for months at a time w/ NO carb-ups or cheat meals

i have accepted that i will be taking T3 for the rest of my life and am perfectly fine with that b/c popping a pill every morning is NOTHING compared to feeling like shit for as long as you can remember

thanks for any help


#3

If you have clinical evidence of your hypothyroidism, why wouldn't you just find a doctor to work with you so you can get human grade T3 instead of who knows what from India?


#4

You really should work with a Dr. but here is some very helpful info about treating with T3. The Yahoo group mentioned is also pretty informative. Nice helpful people if you have any questions.

http://www.thyroid-rt3.com/


#5

Can you post your most recent thyroid labs here?

It would be pretty irresponsible for any poster here to provide you with direct medical advice, which I am sure you must know... so what is your reason for not going to a doctor? No insurance, feel they won't help, or are you just being lazy?

Why T3?


#6

It's not alway's that easy man. I delt with hypo symptoms and thyroiditis for just over 1yr. before I finally took action myself. The excuses for me were one of 2 things #1 your normal even though TSH was over 3.0 and a ultra sound showed swelling or They learn that I'm on TRT and say I'm causing my own problems. I use T3 myself because I had high RT3. Average doses range from 25mcg-100mcg/day in divided doses. Im rigt at 75mcg/day with blood work pending and after 4wks all symptoms have passed and most important the swelling is gone.
I tried Dr's for over 10yrs and all it did was waste my money. Sometimes the best thing to do is educate yourself as best you can and take care of yourself.


#7

You are preaching to the choir, partner...but your case is not the same as the OP...you had an undiagnosed subclinical hypothyroidism, from what I gather, with "normal" bloodwork...this tidbit of information that you may have overlooked:

indicates to me that he has a diagnosis, or at least would be MUCH easier to attain one than your subcliniical diagnosis...

My statement stands...if you can access quality doctor care, then it is always better than going the self-medicated route...


#8

Absolutely you should alway's try to do it legally first. Im just saying don't waste to much of your life waiting for someone else to help. Another way to get it done legally is to use an HRT Clinic. Theres alot out there with some legit and some not. If you want info on the one I use you can PM me.


#9

i went to a differnt doc after first doc wouldnt treat me, and she was retarded...

didnt even turn the page to look at my t3 levels, saw t4 was normal and said i was "body dysmorphic" so i walked out

the issue was t4 was not converting, supps only made minimal increases over the course of months


#10

my last blood work was done early this year. i can dig it up but it may take a day or two...

reason for not going to a doc is that my first wanted me see if i would level out over the next few years.... not fuckin happening after several tests w/ marginal improvements

second doc... see above post

i am not being lazy. i have exhausted every available resource and am finally at my breaking point... going above 1800 calories a day/ 50 grams of carbs would result in considerable fat gain over a short amount of time

i know carbs play a role in t4 conversion and even when going on a rotation 300g carb, 100g carb, 100 g carb as a recommendation from my hollistic doc i gained a lot of fat and no improvements in blood work


#11

i did have a diagnosis and i quote my [OUR - i no longer try with them] docs words... "major hypothyroidism" yet no treatment besides supplementation

i was then sent to a nephrologist bc he said the t4 converts in the kidney and my BUN was high (high protein diet, training 5 days a week... what do you expect?)

after further research, and john meadows article confirming what i thought today, i was under the impression conversion took place in the liver...

my rt3 was elevated though out testing as well


#12

That sucks man...unfortunately dosing of thyroid meds is one of my weakest areas of knowledge, so I cant offer any advice...but I wish you the best my friend...


#13

If you had good t4 and crappy t3 I am not surprised at all that you had high RT3, as T3/RT3 are basically the only two things that come from t4.

I'm not convinced you need t3-only meds for your entire life if you can manipulate diet to increase T4->T3 conversion rate. When you went to your higher carb diet, did you keep total cals the same? I just can't believe you gained so much fat eating at caloric maintenance.

That be said, maybe it's best you reintroduced carbs more slowly. Take it from 50g/day to 75g/day for a couple weeks, then up it again. I'm 90% sure the carb starvation is what caused it.

Definitely take t3-only for now, but try to get to the point where you can eat carbs again. Without actual test results I can't say much more though.


#14

thank you i appreciate it... now go do my research for me :wink:


#15

i was trying a gradual increase in carbs before the 300/100/100/repeat recommendation. i went from 64 6 days per week (surge work out fuel) for 4 months then bumped up to 100 grams from oats for about 6 weeks, then followed the 300/100/100 on workout days only for another 4 weeks until i gained 15 lbs (over the 4 weeks) while also taking all the supps listed in my second post and adding in R-ALA and only maintaining strength - i may sound like a bitch but i was kinda devastated by that outcome and just dropped carbs during the week all together at the point

cals were the same, i just adjusted my other macros to fit in with carb intake. plus/minus 2500 on workout days and 1800 on non workout days (0 carb)

also, no added fats on high carb days aside from fish oil

i found some lab work, just trying to find some missing sheets. will have posted by the end of the night... thank you for your input!


#16

also, for what its worth, sundays have been my cheat/carb-ups then the rest of the week is <30 grams carbs and a fair amount of green veggies

on thursdays i start to reek of ammonia about 45 mins into my sessions


#17

test 1 - only including thyroid/test values
rt3 32 ng/dl 11-32
rdw 15.7% 11-15
t4, total 6.4 ug/dl 4.5-12.5
t4, free 1.2 ng/dl 0.8-1.8
t3, total 52 ng/dl 76-181
t3, free 2.1 pg/dl 2.3-4.2
total test 392 ng/dl 250-110
free test % 2.08 1.5-2.2
free test 81.5 pg/ml 35-155

... gotta go to work will post next two labs later


#18

no TSH?

There's gotta be a misprint because your FT3/RT3 ratio according to http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/rt3-ratio/ is 0.1 and healthy is over 20. That is impossibly bad.

Edit: Even if I messed up the units when I typed it in.. which I double-checked... having a T3 at the bottom of the range and RT3 at the top is very bad. It is the ratio of FT3:RT3 that matters moreso than the RT3 value itself.

As far as your original question of dosing t3-only... start with something small, wait a couple weeks or so, if you still have symptoms then up the dose (or you can keep taking blood tests and increase dose if your lab values stink, but that takes longer because you have to wait a couple weeks, then get a test, then wait for results, etc.). If you still have symptoms up the dose. Rinse, repeat.

My understanding is that you can't tell from bloodwork what your end dose will be - it is a (sometimes length) trial and error process for each person.


#19

no misprint, i confirmed it...

my bad, tsh was 0.74 mIU/L 0.5-4.30


#20

test 2
t4,total 6.2 mcg/dl 4.5-12
t4, free 1.1 ng/dl .8-1.8
t3, total 58 ng/dl 76-181
t3, free 2.2 pg/ml 2.3-4.2
rt3 30 ng/dl 11-32
tsh (3rd generation???) 2.1 mIU 0.5-4.3
total test 587 ng/dl 250-1100
free test 78.9 pg/ml 46-224
test, bioavailable 165.7 ng/dl 110-575