Anyone supplementing DHEA oral or transdermal?
Would you cut Adex to 0.5mg per week? That’s not technically easy to do. If anyone has a good research chem place could you please PM me. Also, still wondering if low E2 is an issue since SHBG is low?
Still thinking thyroid is an issue although my doctors are T4 only guys. Anyone think T3 would be a good thing?
Really interested in hearing constructive opinions on DHEA, my thyroid and whether or not my low E2 is an issue since my SHBG is so low…
I’ve been looking for papers and it seems like DHEA is mostly converted to DHEA-S when taken orally and the body can not convert DHEA-S back to DHEA. I’ve read some articles on using transdermal creams to avoid first pass in the liver.
I’ve read the thyroid stickies and get plenty of iodozed salt etc. I still think I may benefit from some T3 but thyroid to me has a little voodoo mixed in there and isn’t as straight forward as my other issues. I’m going to start measuring body temps.
I’ve also read that low DHEA can cause low thyroid hormones and testosterone so I’m wondering if DHEA supplementation is the most logical place to start and see if it has an effect on my thyroid numbers?
Your T4 is too low and T3 is low too, perhaps some T4–>T3 conversion issues.
Get T4 mid range.
Any iodine in your salt or vitamins?
Check your body temps and report, could be low as you are still hypo
No need to repeat LH/FSH
Clomid can make some feel horrible, nolvadex would not have done that.
Great weight loss and fat loss is higher than the numbers indicate as you have gained muscle.
Take T, Anastrozole and hCG at the same time to some extent, make life simpler.
DHEA-S is the active form in the body, so no concern about that.
Reduce anastrozole by a factor of 12.8/22 to approach E2=22pg/ml.
Lipid response is fantastic! If eating low fat, make sure that you still get health fats. Fish oil is always helpful.
[quote]KSman wrote:
Lipid response is fantastic! If eating low fat, make sure that you still get health fats. Fish oil is always helpful.
[/quote]
Thanks KSman…nope that is a low carb + high fat diet with most fats coming from olive oil and fish. Amazing how evil those carbs really can be…
I’m feeling good but not great and my tT was 500 (240-950), fT 18 (8.7-25.1) and E2 12.8 (7-42). Physically I feel good but mood/energy while improved over where I was at a tT of 150 are not great. Also, libido is off now as is the quality of my erections - although I can still perform fine. I know my low E2 is likely playing a major role here.
Labs were 3 days after injection and since test cyp peaks 24-72 hours after injection doesn’t this mean this is pretty close to my peak? Thinking besides adjusting my AI with lower dose and I’m also going to switching to aromasin. Needed take about half the dose of adex I was taking (0.5mg week instead of 1.0mg per week) so I’m planning on starting aromasin at 12mg per week (instead of 25mg).
What do you think about bumping test to 125mg per week + switching to aromasin at a lower equivalent dose than adex to see if that gets me from feeling good to great?
Seems the pathophysiogy of obesity induced hypogonadism is not E2 related. Recent evidence points to high carb diets having a direction suppressive effect on testosterone. It looks like it’s not the adiposity that causes low T rather the poor high carb diet that is driving both obesity and hypogonadism independently. Also explains why most people never actual show high E2.
Mogri M, Dhindsa S, Quattrin T, Ghanim H, Dandona P. Testosterone Concentrations In Young Pubertal And Post-Pubertal Obese Males. Clinical Endocrinology. Testosterone Concentrations In Young Pubertal And Post-Pubertal Obese Males - Mogri - Clinical Endocrinology - Wiley Online Library
Objective Obesity in adult males is associated with hypogonadotropic hypogonadism. We evaluated the effect of obesity on plasma testosterone concentrations in pubertal and post pubertal young males.
Design And Methods Morning fasting blood samples were obtained from 25 obese (BMI>95th percentile) and 25 lean(BMI<85th percentile) males between the ages 14-20 years with Tanner staging >4. Total and free testosterone and estradiol concentrations were measured by liquid chromatography tandem mass spectrometry and equilibrium dialysis. Free testosterone was also calculated using SHBG and albumin. C-reactive protein (CRP), insulin and glucose concentrations were measured and homeostasis model of insulin resistance (HOMA-IR) was calculated.
Results After controlling for age and Tanner staging, obese males had a significantly lower total testosterone(10.5 vs 21.44nmol/l), free testosterone(0.22 vs 0.39nmol/l) and calculated free testosterone(0.26 vs 0.44nmol/l) concentrations as compared to lean males(p<0.001 for all). Obese males had higher CRP concentrations (2.8 vs 0.8mg/l; p<0.001), and HOMA-IR (3.8 vs 1.1; p<0.001) than lean males. Free testosterone concentrations were positively related to age and negatively to BMI, HOMA-IR and CRP concentrations. Total and free estradiol concentrations were significantly lower in males with subnormal testosterone in concentrations.
Conclusion Testosterone concentrations of young obese pubertal and post pubertal males are 40-50% lower than those with normal BMI. Obesity in young males is associated with low testosterone concentrations which are not secondary to an increase in estradiol concentrations. Our results need to be confirmed in a larger number of subjects.