T Nation

Second Cycle. 6'7", 245

So i did a cycle 2 years ago. It was 350mg of test a week for 12 weeks. Used an AI during. Also used HCG after last pin for 2 weeks. Then PCT with nolvadex and clomid. Everything went smoothly. Gained 7lbs.

Currently I’m 6’7 245lbs. 26 years old. Not sure my bf% but you can see my ab lines just a small layer of fat over. By cutting carbs I can get rid of that. Do it every summer.

So I’m wondering should I treat this like my first cycle since it’s been 2 years.
I’m considering 3 different cycles
700mg eq with 250 test 14 weeks. New to eq
500mg test for 10-12 weeks pinning 2 times a week
600mg 12 weeks pinning every 3 days
All with HCG and AI on cycle

Being 6’7 245 lbs are these good options?

Will run proper PCT. that’s not even a question.

Well what’s your goal? Are you looking to add some more mass? If so then you should have good results going with test again, at a dose somewhere in that 500mg range.

I applaud your sensible dose on the first cycle, however with your size I think you went too light of a dose. Remember UGL stuff might say 250mgs per ml but it’s really 210 or something like that. You said you gained 7 lbs, I dont know if that was the total net after PCT or is that was how much the scale moved by the end of the cycle. Either way, especially given your size, I think you should run the next cycle as just test but at a much higher dose. For a guy around 180-200 lbs then 350mgs of test per week is a good ratio of mgs to lbs, for you not so much. I think a good next step for you is just double the dosage of just test. Remember with UGLs even if you double the “350” to 700 chances are you will be around 500-600. I think you should try at a minimum 2 mgs per lbs then round up a little for the under dosed UGL product.

A first cycle should see some significant gains because your body and receptors are fresh. Guys see gains like 20 lbs on early cycles. With your size I would think 25-30 lbs would be a very easily attainable goal on a good early cycle. I think you should see what dosage you need to see gains like that. Otherwise if you follow the low end dose protocols and start adding in compounds I don’t think you will all of a sudden see significant gains unless you just find that one compound your body loves. I have a feeling you are one of the those guys that just needs more mgs then on top of that you have your size. Remember those dosages are based off of a ratio of mgs to kgs or lbs and you have a lot more natural lbs to dose before you have enough to get cycle level results. So find out where your dosage level needs to be to get cycle level results with the simplest, most affordable compound out there, testosterone. Plus testosterone doesn’t get enough praise it literally can get the majority of guys all the results they ever wanted and for the rest of the guys test can get them 90% of what they want.

That’s my 2 cents.

I agree with most everything you post it usually solid info but I have to disagree largely with this. The few ugls I have used which tend to be the popular ones that a lot of people have or had used tend to overdose thier gear. Most ugls have independent lab test results you can find and it will generally show close to 100% accurate or over dosed by 5-20mg/ml.

By explanation the ugls claim when cooking it is very hard to get the dose spot on with finished product and by adding a little extra raw they can atleast guarantee it will not be under dosed.

Now I understand not all ugls are reputable but if ordering from a reputable source i wouldn’t plan my cycle around the ugl being off by 200mg/ml on 700mg. I mean that’s 50+ mg/mL if ugl gear is ever underdosed and it’s more than 10mg/ml they run the risk of losing major customers.

Looking to gain muscle mass but I am a active person. So the endurance aspect of eq is interesting. I’ve heard it’s an underrated mass builder. I guess I’m also wondering. Since I’m so tall and weight 245 is under dosing a real thing? I’d like to get more out of it compared to my first cycle. And I’m about 15lbs bigger and leaner since my first cycle. I learned how to eat right. Now I’m ready for round 2

I’m also prone to acne. Which I know what happens if you play with fire. I’ve just heard eq sides are mild for most. Not all… I do know it could give me acne. Won’t know unless I try. But this is the lest of my worries. If I get it it’s what it is.

Does size actually have an impact on the effectiveness of exogenous testosterone? I have a feeling that if someone with a more average stature were to post this same question, the answers would be 7lb gained on cycle means diet and or training wasn’t up to par.

Not trying to be sarcastic. Never thought about the impact that natural stature would have on test levels.

I dont know how bro sciency this explanation is but how I have heard it explained is once you hit your genetic potential then you stop gaining as much per cycle.

So you might gain 10lbs lean first couple cycles then by your 7/8th cycle you will be lucky to gain a couple pounds.

Again I have no idea how accurate this is I’m just repeating what I have heard in the gym.

Also in your case 6’7 245 isn’t all that big unless your really really low body fat. If you gained 7 lbs lean after cycle as in after the water weight dropped and you pct and you gained and kept a solid 7 then that’s great.

Thanks. Yes the 7lbs was the net gain after pct and at peak of cycle. I never really lost any from that cycle. Didn’t experience estrogen side effects. (Water retention, puffy nipples, mood change) Actually pretty tame cycle from what I’ve read on some of the forums. 7lbs is pretty good for me though. I was pleased with the results. I would just like to to see if I could take it a little further this next one. I think I’ll try the higher Test and see where that gets me. Thanks. Oh and I’m using local home brew that gets tested. Just for friends and family type deal.

Oh I agree. I was very happy with my first cycle. I’m just wondering what to do for my next.

I’m probably the wrong person to ask that. My beliefs are very different from most of the guys here on the site who suggest using testosterone only for you first 5 cycles.

My personal belief is that testosterone is cheap and unless your doing a test only blast then test should be kept to a minimum and other compounds should be blasted. Which compounds is up to you.

This, so on 110mg/wk (test E, pharm grade) my TT was measured at something like 15-16nmol, on 200mg (UGL)… 55.8nmol…

Talk about an overdosed product!!!

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Has anyone tired EQ?

I have seen the independent tests online, I just can’t bring myself to trust them. I know there is a pretty popular site that regularly tests the different labs they carry. To believe the tests you have to believe they actually randomly pull bottles through anonymous purchases and test them. I don’t see the site doing that. I see the site saying hey it’s time to test so send us your latest batch. If the labs know the batch is getting tested then yes that batch is on point. Maybe they do make anonymous purchases and then test idk. What I do know is I used one of their top brands with numerous testings and that stuff doesn’t hold a candle to the home brew I measure out myself. If you can find the real old tests from this site you will see the lab name and you can Google the name…I could never find a lab with that name.

I do believe that most UGLs do try to put out as good of product as possible but there are just too many factors that come into play working against a consistent product. What happens if the raw powder producer has issues? Go look at producers websites, a number of them acknowledge that shitty batches have made it out the door but they “fired” the people responsible.

If you are familiar with the history of muscle cars then you know of the 1964 GTO. Well basically the guys at Pontiac decided that sense everyone was wanting faster cars then why not put their big car engine into their small mid size car. The outside of the engine was the same size, the cylinders and stroke were larger. So in 63 the mid size only could go as big as 326 I think, in 64 they let the mid size get the 389. When it came time for car and driver to do the write up the guys knew the car needed to perform so they thought well the outside size of the 389 is the same size as the 421. No one from car and driver was going to go and look at the casting numbers so they would think it was the 389. So the night before the review they put a 421 into the test car only that was not enough insurance for them, they wanted the car to melt the tires so everyone in the country would want one. They preped the 421 so it wasn’t even a regular 421. The prep kit they came up with was later sold as a package via royal Pontiac I think, if you have a true royal Pontiac preped GTO today it’s just about priceless. Obviously the car and driver review went well because today we all still know about the GTO. Now if one of the largest corporations in America is willing to intentionally deceive the entire country to sell cars and that’s with knowing if they get caught there would be hell to pay, what would a UGL be willing to do? The truth about the 1964 GTO car and driver review was a secret until the late 90s.

I know there are legit UGLs out there and they do their best to provide a quality product. The problem with that is once they have a good name then other people make knock off of their stuff.

Just be aware of how greedy people can be. After a couple of cycles you should be able to tell if your bottle is a good batch or possibly a fake or just a fucked up batch because someone didn’t measure or heat it properly.

The specific place I’m talking about is not tested like that. It’s up to the forum members to send in a sealed vial that is then sent to the official tester (I can’t name the name here) and there have been numerous ugls busted for selling under dosed or completely different gear then what they say is int he bottle. So it is random altho it’s completely up to us to send the sample to get tested if we don’t then who knows what’s in it. Every once in a while the forum admins will buy some bottles or pills and send them in. Needles to say a lot of people get busted out for selling fake or underdosed var. But there is a few ugls who have been operating for years with near perfect test.

This is the go to excuse for ugl labs when test results come back fucked up. “oh it must be our raws” unfortunately that’s not a good excuse when your running what could essentially be a 6 figure business you better make sure you get your raws tested if you want to keep customers and the good dealers do exactly that. Some even posting the raws test.

Yes Im by no means saying that ugls are great or your gonna get a quality product. Actually I would tell someone unless you know how to look and where to look there is a good chance what your getting is over dosed or under dosed or completely fake.

But it’s not hard to find a good quality ugl if you are resourceful with the internet are willing to spend some time doing your homework then buying amazing quality ugl is not difficult. Problem is people don’t want to do that they Google shit like “where to buy steroids” click on the first link and place a order and hope for the best.

And Ya I would never ever trust a site that in any way shape or form let’s a seller know that a product is about to be tested.