Scrutinize me!

I have great respect for the various participants of this forum, esp. Professor X, Nate Dawg, Whopper, etc. and that is why I would like to ask a couple of questions here. First I’d like to know if andro along with Tribulus can be taken by 17-year olds, as I’ve been considering it lately. Also I’d like to post the new workout regiment that I devised for myself so that you can tell me what you think; am I overtraining or undertraining or what? here goes:
Day 1: close grip benches 2 waves of 7-5-3; Incline benches 3 sets 5-9 reps; slight decline benches 3* 6-11; lying triceps extensions 3 * 8-10 Day 2: standing curls 5 * 8-12; reverse curls 3 * 8-12; hang cleans w/o front squat 4 * 6-10; behind the neck presses 3 * 8-10; Day 3: Bent Rows 5 * 10; Day 4: Ass-to-grass squats @ 503 tempo 3 * 10; Deadlifts 3 * 10; bent-knee deadlifts 3 * 10-12; Day 5 Rest; Thats all. As is apparent, I am employing a hypertrophy workout plan. Day 3 is relatively easy, as I’m only doing Bent Rows. I also do ab work on random days, really, whenever I feel like it. My goal is to get bigger by about 20 lbs. Please tell me what you think. THanks.

how big are you now?

6ft, 151 (and soaring), bf 5.8% (and soaring)

OK at 17 I don’t see the need for andro…but I tend to be conservative. Tribex should be fine. As far as your workout…it aint bad, I do question doing your rows the day after your biceps…I think your shortchanging your back a bit there. Also something you might want to consirer is that a lot of people tend to be doing better with the 5x5’s or GVT which kinda indicates to me that more sets of one particular movement are more effective then the old weider 3 sets of this…three sets of that…but again, everyone is different, if you grow from it…what does our opinion matter!! LOL! Good luck!

I like the fact that you are sticking to the basics and working hard. I am curious, are you trying to get more of an arm workout? Because you do your close-grip benches first in the workout and curls first in another workout. If you’re trying to maximize size, then I would put them toward the end of the workout and work the bigger lifts first. Also, you are doing rows for your back, but what about chins/pullups? I like Ian King’s way of dividing the body. And I make sure that I hit all the body parts and focus on working imbalances. That’s why deadlifts and rows are first in my workout and first in the week. As for Tribex and Andro, I don’t think you need it. First of all, you’re 17 and should have plenty of “T” flowing. So you probably won’t get much out of those products. I would personally stick to plenty of good food, protein supplments and Surge. That’s basically all I spend my money on. Plenty of good food, basic supplements (muliti-vitamin, vit C&E, fish oils, ZMA, Grow and Surge). I’ve tried Andro and Nandro, and I’ve used Tribex. Those products didn’t do a whole lot for me. So I would rather stick to nutritional products. That and plenty of hard work is the real key to success. Remember, you can grow on any program if you train hard and eat right.

Thanks guys for responding. The reason that I refrain from any pull-up routine is because compound nature of the pull-up interferes with other muscle groups that I have worked a previous day and it causes soreness to persist onto the next workout. For example, if I were to place behind-the-neck wide grip pull-ups on day 3 or even day 4, I wouldn’t have sufficient recovery for by tricep/chest day because triceps would already have been worked by pull-ups. I don’t know, maybe I’m being too careful.

You lost me a few places, and more importantly I didnt get a mention, so Im going into hard task master mode here (1) The workouts dont look too hard but I think 4 days out of 7 for a natural person bulking leaves just enough time to properly recover and grow (2) The volume of chest work is way out of proportion in your program (3) Ditto the arm isolations (4) If you are trying to getting bigger we are FAR more interested in your eating cause all the wave loads and rah rah in the world wont add an an ounce of muscle without proper eating - seeing as though you like X so much get to grips with his workout and eating princiles (5) Id much prefer to see some strength micro cycles in a 2-4 stage bulking program (6) Did you say what I think you did about a certain exercise working your tricep!!! and spare any other roody poo excuses for not having chins or pull downs along unless you have a dead basis 6-7 movement program. I could go on but will wrap up with this YOU ARE AN SB - REPORT TO THE SUPPORT GROUP WITH A REVISED PROGRAM, EATING PLAN AND FEEDBAG.

Leo, I am going to go light on you because I can tell you are trying but you have made a few mistakes that you need to fix yesterday. Number one, pull downs or pull ups have nothing to do with your triceps so they shouldn’t hinder anything. If you leave out chins on ,ass program, expect to make slower progress. YOU WANT EXERCISES THAT WORK MANY MUSCLE GROUPOS AT ONCE. HOW ELSE WILL YOU GAIN SIZE? There is no need for the andro or the tribulus, especially since trib only increases testosterone back to normal levels, not above. At 17 your testosterone is already above normal so what good will it do you? The andro has a greater potential at increasing estrogen than muscle mass which leaves you to work on your eating program if the goal is size. There is nothing wrong with close grip bench press, however, for size, kickbacks should be a part of you program along with press-owns. You don’t need decline bench work, you lower chest is worked well enough with the flat bench. Your goal of 20lbs is equally reliant on how you eat than just your lifting routine. You need to lift heavier than you are comfortable with, however, your form needs to be kept under control. The last thing you want is an injury. I don’t do ass to grass squats because they aren’t necessary for leg size. Any point at or slightly below parallel is enough to get the job done. Deep squats have a greater chance of blowing up your ass way before your quads become tree trunks. If you have any more questions, ask.
Professor X

Professor X, I have read many of your posts and I have gained about 6 pounds so far after beginning to eat heavily. I will certainly modify my program and add in the pull-ups; I was perhaps uninformed. Also, I don’t have access to triceps pressdowns, since the nearest gym to me is quite far. All I have is a bunch of plates, a 45 bar, an ez bar, and an adjustable bench press bench. Granted my equipment constraints, what what you recommend for tricep mass excercises, and would you recommend doing a 5x5 routine instead? Thanks alot.

Leo, you don’t need to do the pressdowns. You have the basics so if you want triceps mass use close-grip benches, dips, and various extensions with the EZ Bar (seated french presses, skull crushers using different placement - behind the head, to the head, to the nose, etc). The close-grip benches and dips are my favorites for packing on size and strength to the triceps. Since I started doing the close-grip benches a few weeks ago, I’ve already gained strength and some pretty decent size and shape! Also, I use the 6-8 inch grip on close-grip benches. Seems to work best for me. And I keep my elbows close to my sides at all times.

Thanks alot Nate Dogg! I’m ready to get started on this thing.

Professor X what are you saying??!! Here we have a newbie actually doing rock bottom squats and you’re telling him NOT to! I know everyone has their own training theories but take it from someone who has phenomenal genetics for building a huge ass. I have been doing rock bottom squats for a little over a year now and my leg growth has been awesome, with minimal glute growth. And my ass grows when I sit down to take a shit!

Sig–If doing them that way makes you happy, then that is all that really matters. However, going below parallel brings your glutes into play more than than if you stayed above. One of the biggest determinants it seems when it comes to the growth of your quads is the number of repetitions. It seems that more growth is seen with a higher rep range(12-15), of coure still going relatively heavy, than just lifting heavy and stopping after four to six reps. Since I have reduced the weight on squats to under 405lbs and increased the reps to above ten, my quads have really responded. The issue of going below parallel can be disputed, however, you are the one with the gigantic ass. No offense.

Professor X, I think you missed my point. What I’m trying to tell you is since going rock bottom my ass has grown LESS. I’ll leave it at that. My leg development speaks for itself.

Sorry to but in on your thread here guys, but I agree with sig, go ass to the grass squat and get a full range of motion. if your ass starts to grow to big, just stop doing them (or do them occasionally) and do more of a parallel squat. Although professor X is prolly right about using the glutes to do these types of squats (it makes sense although I’m quite a newbie myself, 1 year training 165 lbs 5’9"), who is to say that our friend here has a genetically gifted ass. He is 155 or something like that at over 6 foot! Oh, by the way, you should EASILY put on the 20 lbs of muscle. A year ago I was 140lbs and I didn’t even know T-Mag existed till 5 months ago. I’m 17 and have used androsol, it put on a quick 3 or 4 pounds for me. Just eat tons of food all the time. Go to the store and buy 14 cans of tuna, do that every week eating 2 cans a day.

Oh sure, you are welcome. Dont listen to me and do a balanced number of sets per body part or anything … dont have an open mind to people who would say you are such an unbelievable sb you should even consider HIT for fear of losing your already emaciated mass on any more volume than that until you work out your eating requirments for lean gains - NAH, get stuck into your 10+sets for pecs, tris, bis coupled with a measly 1 ercise 3 sets for delts and lats, just dont come crying here when your body is more messed up than when you started. The again, I guess I may be wrongly assuming you will stick with this and realise each bit of size or shape you get will relate directly to what and how much you eat.

I gotta say…I have to stick to the ass-to-grass routine. I love that feeling of the weight torturing my legs, ass, my essence as I’m fully descend’d in the movement and sweat drips like tears or streams of blood. Damn, its invigorating- and the triumph of ascending, every frittered instant of rising from the hollow pit of the ground, and finally finding yourself atop the position, its the torture of knowing that more self-degrading reps are still to come. Its not about working the quads or the glutes, its about youth, and its about torture.

Dre, I believe now I understand why I left you out of my list of recognitions, and I find it well-justified. You are one of those people…never mind, my literary lungs are already exhausted on such deep-seeted rage for ingnorance. Now, it never occured to you that I may perhaps be lagging in those areas such as pecs, bis, tris… I must say my back and my legs are very strong, legs especially, since my track-and-field times for various runs are relatively outstanding (800m 1:56, 400m 51.7 1600m 4:39). I’m brandishing my big fat penis, I know, but I’m also serving the cause of eradicating big fa…never mind. And as far as my body, I am currently 160, having already gained a good 10 pounds, and I’m easily preserving and honing the most godly abs you’ll ever see. Whatever… There is one thing I’d like to say; I smoked a cigarrete today, a Nat Sherman’s brand Black & Gold label, and it felt like, like deodorant on a smelly ass-wiped glaring shit armpit. My point is, several dayz ago, I worked out and as a PW shake, I drank 16oz. Coca-Cola while fevereshly swallowing sweet Advil pills instead of creatine. As a corrolary to this, I ran about 12 miles just for kicks. Protein was a stranger to me on that day. The next time I worked out I found myself experiencing unprecendented gains on ALL of the lifts that I had performed on that day of seeming self-estrangement. Again, my point is, is that, that, imagine yourself in a dark room, you cannot see because its dark, but you think you still have vision, when, in actuality, you’re blind. Such is life in the universal room of darkness for little wretch, who is stuck ass-smeared between two realities: one of blindness and one of a dark room. It is only until the little fuck begins to ponder the obscurity of both realities that he loses himself in yet a third one, confusion and uncertainty. Anyways, I recently got my first dose of PowerDrive and WOW!!! I could not have been more impressed with a product. I was little tearing things apart in my glorius shrine of a basement. Weights rose and egos distended as muscles seethed and got bigger. Wonderful product, one can never underestimate the neural aspects of training.

Leo! I wrote you off when everyone else did ie just after the poorly written drivel about “degrading” squats being “about youth” … now you are back and have gained 9 pounds in 2 days … you sure are something. As far as ignorance goes, the greates one on this forum to date was your comment about chins being for triceps - I am happy to remind you of this if you feel like being arrogant again. For now, Im going to be charitable about this assuming it will sink in to your unappreciative head - at “6 foot 151” your whole body is lagging big time - if you want to do well in this you need a balance of big ticket compound lifts at moderate volume ie 1-2x squat, dl, bench, military, chin, bb row, curls and squats. The last thing you need is an arm specialisation routine. While I am at it one last tip - be gracious when someone goes out of their way for you cause you come off like an real ass coming to a forum with a bad program, saying “scrutinze me”, and then having a closed mind to fair responses.

Leo, Leo, Leo…at 6’0 and what did you say 160? Sorry bro…but don’t bitch slap Dre…he is right, you are a skinny bastard, and the fact that your a fast skinny bastard with good abs doesn’t impress me (Gentlemen, a classic case of Timboitis here…please observe, the beautiful abs, the stick like arms, the well defined serratus) Dre gave you solid advice…just because he was a little harsh in how he delt it…well don’t jump his shit…last I checked…pullups dont hit the triceps any more than they hit the calves bro. He was good enough to review your post, make some comments…many I agree with, and take the time to respond to you further…while giving you a good boot in the ass…if that isn’t what you want, then go to Body for life or something whetre everyone will tell you how wonderful you are…for me…I would always prefer a good friendly kick in the ass over some fake blowing smoke up my ass…we AINT like that bro!!