T Nation

Sample TRT Template Question


#1

This is what I was sent as a sample protocol from my TRT doctor. After reading most of the stickies and browsing this forum for a bit I can see this is not similar to most recommended templates (EOD, E2D, E3D, etc…). The reason I’m not starting with my labs is because I really have no starting point off of that if all I can do is a sample that isn’t custom to my needs.

So my question is, is this (by any reasonable leap of faith) a good “starter” template? Also if I needed to make adjustments based on my current health or goals what information should I post to assist in this?

Thanks guys


#2

If you read the stickies you would know the answer to this question.

Firstly, 1ml tells us nothing. 1ml for me means 210mg of test cyp. which is too much. 1ml could mean 100mg but we don’t know.

Anastrozole infused with T IMO is a really bad idea. Chances are you’re going to have to adjust your AI dose. I started out with 1mg per week, which crashed my E2 and had me feeling terrible. I then started a very small dose, did more labs and self assessment. Then adjusted up again. Then went off it all together. A dosage infused means you’re stuck, which is a bad idea.

The best starter template is the one in the sticky.


#3

You see the issue, It doesn’t tell me much either. I want to do very small doses too, pretty sure I will mimic something like that.


#4

Find out what concentration your test cyp is. Mine is 200mg/ml. Yours could possibly be 100mg/ml. Common trt here is as follows:

100mg test cyp per week but split into 2 doses per week

250u hcg EOD

.5mg anastrozole with each 50mg test injection.

Blood work (TT, FT & E2) in 4 weeks and adjust from there


#5

Am I interpreting this correctly?


#6

All AI is correct except for the first one that says .25mg. The HCG is every other day so Sun, Tues, Thurs, Sat, Mon, Wed, Fri, Sun, Tues etc.

Test Sunday 8am and Thursday 8pm so it’s 3.5 days apart if that makes sense. Doing it like this is kind of a pain in the ass, that’s why I just do everything EOD


#7

Oops it seems your HCG was correct. Unless you edited it. Now if you want to run everything EOD it would be 28.57mg test, 250u hcg and .28 mg anastrozole EOD. But that’s a little harder to figure out


#8

I was really honestly hoping to cut down injections significantly. I wanted the OP template the doctor sent to be The One just because of it’s simplicity.

Also, whats with this dilution in water business?


#9

Yea, im not sure I can figure out that specific amount so precisely.

I sort of want to make it E3D just because of convenience. I’m not sure I can make it happen without adverse side effects.


#10

Ok then E3D would be 50mg test cyp, .5mg Anastrozole and 440-450u HCG. Sunday AM and Thursday PM or Sunday PM and Thursday AM. The only problem with that is taking 440-450u hcg at once.


#11

Once per week test injections suck because you feel the high and then you feel the low. Around day 5 or 6 you’ll start to crash. E3D or EOD makes it more stable.

hCG comes as a powder. You injected the bac water into it.


#12

Yea, that’s sort of ridiculous of that much hCG at one time.


#13

Yeah it is. Not sure why your doc recommend only 50u though. Common protocol is 250u EOD which is about 850 per week.


#14

I think I have this down in a way…

I read earlier that oil/water injections obviously dont mix and therefore cannot combine them in the same injection. So really 2 injections every other day?


#15

Lol yeah. That’s what I’m doing. Instead of keeping track of which days to inject, I just do even days. Depending how many days are in a month, some months will switch over to odd days, know what I mean?

Use 29g insulin syringes. It’s really not that bad. I’m currently doing test intramuscular and hcg subcutaneous. Test takes a while to draw out since the needle is 29g but it’s way better than poking yourself with a 25g or 23g needle every 2 days lol.


#16

Am I able to procure these 29g syringes easily? I really have no idea if I can get them without a prescription. I’m afraid I am not being supplied with them, rather the 1 1/2" needles.


#17

I don’t see why not? Where do you live? I buy 100 packs online really cheap, along with alcohol pads.


#18

Most USA/Canadian jurisdictions have allowed sale of insulin syringes without an Rx. However the scourge if IV opiate abuse is changing things. You can ask doc to Rx the change in syringes or perhaps pharmacist will assist in that. But some docs and others may think that its physically impossible…

You need to know more than what to ask for.
Objective is E2=22pg/ml which seems optimal for almost all guys, but a few need higher levels for reasons unknown. Some are anastrozole over-responders who will crash E2 on suggested dosing and they need to stop anastrozole for 5-6 days then resume at 1/4th the expected dose.

You need to know more than your doctor(s) because most have very poor knowledge and judgements.

Please read the stickies found here: About the T Replacement Category

  • advice for new guys - need more info about you
  • things that damage your hormones
  • protocol for injections
  • finding a TRT doc

Evaluate your overall thyroid function by checking oral body temperatures as per the thyroid basics sticky. Thyroid hormone fT3 is what gets the job done and it regulates mitochondrial activity, the source of ATP which is the universal currency of cellular energy. This is part of the body’s temperature control loop. This can get messed up if you are iodine deficient. In many countries, you need to be using iodized salt. Other countries add iodine to dairy or bread.


#19

My Estradiol (Roche ECLIA methodology) result is 28.7 pg/mL with a reference interval of 7.6 - 42.6
T4, Free (direct) is 1.34 ng/dL with a reference interval of 0.82 - 1.77
TSH Rfx on Abnormal to Free T4 is 5.440 (high) uIU/mL with a reference of 0.450 - 4.500
Testosterone Serum is 550 ng/dL (Adult make reference interval is based on a population of lean males up to 40 years old)

I am 31 Years old, male (obviously), not sure what I need to do to get my E2 to equal 22pg/mL based on the recommended template and the bullshit one the doctor sent me in the OP.

I guess 100mg of test a week is normal?


#20

TSH=5.44 is horrible. Should be closer to 1.0
Thyroid ranges are stupid wrong.
What other thyroid labs?

  • fT4
  • fT3 - this is the active hormone
  • thyroid autoimmune panel

The best outcome would be if this was caused by your not using iodize salt, which can be fixed, but there can be complications from high TSH+years.

With this thyroid problem, you will not feel well even if TRT is otherwise perfect.

Read all of the thyroid basics sticky.

Evaluate your overall thyroid function by checking oral body temperatures as per the thyroid basics sticky. Thyroid hormone fT3 is what gets the job done and it regulates mitochondrial activity, the source of ATP which is the universal currency of cellular energy. This is part of the body’s temperature control loop. This can get messed up if you are iodine deficient. In many countries, you need to be using iodized salt. Other countries add iodine to dairy or bread.