Saddam Executed Soon

Off Topic Politics and World Issues
21

You know whats really funny about this?
Everyone everywhere seems to have a problem with his execution. In India, US, the European countries, Blair/ UK , a lot of european hot shots , and of course islamic countries. Some of them condem his execution, while some of them hate the style, while some of them hate the timing…

But (at least from what see on the CNN) the guys who should really be weeping -the Iraqis- are having a blast!

Those of you feel human rights have been violated all i can say is just try to get your hands on video tapes /news releases of public executions, his war fare against neighbouring countries, chemical warfare and of course how he dealt with his own people.
I remember seeing some documentries about chemical warfare - Hassan ‘Chemical’ Ali. I still remember the stuff man. Sucks.

22

[quote]harris447 wrote:
Well, thank gosh that’s over!

I’m sure Shia and Sunni will be embracing one another now and we shoulod expect the troops home by New Year’s!

Mission accomplished.
[/quote]

Naaaah!
But at least 1 guy less to worry about.

23

Ding dong. The wicked witch is dead.

Now the forest will be safe for all the little boys and girls to play in.

I wonder, did the networks make a lot of money on commercials that day?

I don’t really care either way - but maybe it will mean something to the Iraqi people.

24

[quote]Azrael wrote:

Ahaa! so u really shouldnt have a problem with Saddams death. He was a menace.
[/quote]

I understand there may be a difference in culture between you and me so I won’t come at you negatively. On a personal level, I could care less whether Saddam was hanged, shot, drowned, or made to watch Brittany Spears videos until he passed out.

My issue is with the way society is now turning the act of putting someone to death into a huge media frenzy. My issue is also that it doesn’t make much difference when it is all said and done. Today is no different than yesterday in terms of Saddam being alive or dead.

The world has not suddenly become a utopia and birds aren’t singing in my window getting ready to perform Disney-like musical numbers.

[quote]

Tell me truthfully- u do say that in a way u r not unhappy that he is hanged.
But u hated the media attention and all… so how according to you this should have been dealt with?
Life time imprisonment? or a silent hidden execution? etc etc just want to know ur views.[/quote]

I didn’t say I was unhappy he was hanged. I am questioning the basic principal of the death penalty in cases where the person can do no further harm (not specifically in this case as Saddam was one hateful fucker). I am also questioning the way the public seems to want second by second footage leading up to a man’s execution.

I find that to be pretty fucking evil. Again, I wouldn’t be writing this if it were handled with more privacy and finesse.

25

Does anyone else think that pro life christians believing in the death penalty is somewhat odd?

Hmmmmmmm.

26

[quote]bigflamer wrote:
Does anyone else think that pro life christians believing in the death penalty is somewhat odd?

Hmmmmmmm.[/quote]

I sure as hell do. It is like the “Conservative Christians” are the main ones cheering on frying someone in a chair until their eyeballs pop out.

And yes, I do have a problem with people being executed for crimes committed in excess of 10 years ago…much like that Tookie Williams case. While some may argue whether individuals can truly change or not, it is amazing that so many “christians” seem to be against forgiveness.

27

Saddam is dead and I will not mourn him. Just as I would not have mourned Hitler had he been pulled from his bunker by the Allies and made to stand trial at Nueremburg, ultimately hanging with those who carried out his genocide. I also will not rejoice the death of another human being. To do that, in my view, would reduce me to a place nearer to Saddam himself.

Ultimately, the death of this killer will resonate with the left in this country. It’ll become more fuel for the anti-war/anti-Bush rhetoric and hatred. For these liberals, Saddam will become a new Che Guevara.

Just like Che and Castro the only thing that seperated Saddam from the likes of Hitler, Mao and Stalin is the polical and military might to kill beyond his relatively limited geographical scope. If only more of those ‘Scuds’ could have reached Tel Aviv, eh?

So while the leftists align themselves with Saddam and his ilk in order to point out the ‘evil’ that is George Bush, condemning his execution to highlight the ‘barbarity’ of the U.S. (as opposed to the more ‘enlightened’ and ‘reasoned’ killing of our Muslim counterparts), realized that politics does indeed make strange bed-fellows.

For while you can understand the liberals desire to emulate the Soviets and their infatuation (or is it truly love?) with Castro, socialism being their common philosophy. Saddam and his regime were far from progressive. I guess there is some truth to the phrase “My enemy’s enemy is my friend”.

Finally, when the media and our democrat congressmen tell us that Saddam ‘wasn’t that bad’ and should still be drawing breath, realize that many in Iraq are celebrating his death, albeit with fewer family members alive now than would be alive had Saddam never lived at all.

28

[quote]Professor X wrote:
bigflamer wrote:
Does anyone else think that pro life christians believing in the death penalty is somewhat odd?

Hmmmmmmm.

I sure as hell do. It is like the “Conservative Christians” are the main ones cheering on frying someone in a chair until their eyeballs pop out.

And yes, I do have a problem with people being executed for crimes committed in excess of 10 years ago…much like that Tookie Williams case. While some may argue whether individuals can truly change or not, it is amazing that so many “christians” seem to be against forgiveness.[/quote]

Is it odd also that so many enlighted, liberal ‘progressives’ are out there fighting to abolish the death penalty while working to ensure that abortion can be protected, even expanded, all in the name of a ‘woman’s right to choose’?

The protection of ‘reproductive rights’? What about the child’s right to LIVE and subsequently reproduce? Forgiveness? What must we forgive this unborn child for? I must not be ‘enlightetened’ enough to understand it.

29

[quote]Azrael wrote:
Wrote stuff…just condensing.[/quote]

I dont understand the war in Iraq as I’m assuming most Americans dont either. Are we there for WMD’s? Are we there to oust Saddam? Are we there because GWB’s father hated Saddam? I don’t know.

Are we there for oil? Is the US occupation of Iraq the same as the shit Saddam did in Kuwait? These are questions I cant answer and probably never will. A lot of it comes down to someone’s stand on GWB.

You talked about Super Max Prisons and where Saddam was was not one. Az, c’mon, there was no way in hell Saddam would ever be let free or rescued. Where he was held is so far above and beyond a Super Max Prison its ridiculous.

Saddam dieing may have let him off easy for what he did. Taking away his power and taking over his country and destroying everything he built had to have been devastating to him. Letting him live and letting him see his country void of his control had to have been painful to him. I think it would have been better to keep him alive so he can see that.

Also, for anyone that believes in the bible etc. Wouldn’t the people killing Saddam go to hell also? I mean they just killed a man. Is it now somehow justified and Ok to kill a man? They weren’t killing him in self defense right? They weren’t protecting their families right? It was all about revenge correct?

I’m not going to apologize for the way I feel right now. As I said before I don’t know why but his execution just doesn’t wit well with me. I don’t see the purpose in it and how it brought any good to the world. Yay, we killed someone who would never interact with the world again. I just don’t get it. This situation is affecting me. Its made me think of the “death penalty” in a different light.

I was whole heartily for the death penalty. It could be naive on my part but this is what I feel inside and I wont go against it. This may all change tomorrow but this is how I feel right now. But the more I think about it, the more I just don’t get it.

30

[quote]bigflamer wrote:
Does anyone else think that pro life christians believing in the death penalty is somewhat odd?

Hmmmmmmm.[/quote]

Well, a valid query, but you’re omitting the discussion of guilt and innocence.

31

[quote]DS 007 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
bigflamer wrote:
Does anyone else think that pro life christians believing in the death penalty is somewhat odd?

Hmmmmmmm.

I sure as hell do. It is like the “Conservative Christians” are the main ones cheering on frying someone in a chair until their eyeballs pop out.

And yes, I do have a problem with people being executed for crimes committed in excess of 10 years ago…much like that Tookie Williams case. While some may argue whether individuals can truly change or not, it is amazing that so many “christians” seem to be against forgiveness.

Is it odd also that so many enlighted, liberal ‘progressives’ are out there fighting to abolish the death penalty while working to ensure that abortion can be protected, even expanded, all in the name of a ‘woman’s right to choose’?

The protection of ‘reproductive rights’? What about the child’s right to LIVE and subsequently reproduce? Forgiveness? What must we forgive this unborn child for? I must not be ‘enlightetened’ enough to understand it.[/quote]

Poor argument for the simple reason that those who are for the right to choose often also question at what point “life” of a newborn begins and at what point it becomes a “baby”. Considering there is not some universal accepted stance on when that is, you can’t then assume that anyone but you would consider an early abortion “murder”.

However, since your stance is that abortion equals murder, you could also be considered a hypocrite if you were for murdering others for crimes long past.

32

Our government just opened Pandora’s Box. Iraq is bad enough as it is.

Saddam will now be a martyr for millions of Muslims

Dustin

33

[quote]Dustin wrote:
Our government just opened Pandora’s Box. Iraq is bad enough as it is.

Saddam will now be a martyr for millions of Muslims

Dustin[/quote]

I do agree with this. I think our children will be screwed over this for decades to come.

34

Nice to see that yet another thread is quickly devolving into a jab at “fundamentalist” Christians (as if that is the only group making a distinction between abortion and capital punishment). As Thunder has pointed out, what isn’t being taken into account is the question of guilt.

There is a huge difference between taking the life of an innocent human being (whether you agree or not, most Christians believe the unborn are every bit as human as you and me) and taking the life of a human being responsible for the deaths of thousands. One is murder, the other is not (in the eyes of most Christians). I don’t see why that distinction is so strange…

35

[quote]LBRTRN wrote:
Nice to see that yet another thread is quickly devolving into a jab at “fundamentalist” Christians (as if that is the only group making a distinction between abortion and capital punishment). As Thunder has pointed out, what isn’t being taken into account is the question of guilt.

There is a huge difference between taking the life of an innocent human being (whether you agree or not, most Christians believe the unborn are every bit as human as you and me) and taking the life of a human being responsible for the deaths of thousands. One is murder, the other is not (in the eyes of most Christians). I don’t see why that distinction is so strange…[/quote]

I think the answer is in part something Prof X wrote above:

You either believe that people can change or you don`t.

I do not care either way, but as a Christian you MUST believe that people can change, call it “finding Jesus” if you must…

To rob someone of that chance by killing him before his time, you rob him of his chance of redemption and therefore endanger his eternal soul.

In a way it could be argued that it is worse to execute a guilty man than killing an innocent child, because the soul is more important than the flesh, and the child?s soul goes straight up to heaven anyway.

36

[quote]Professor X wrote:

I do agree with this. I think our children will be screwed over this for decades to come.[/quote]

As you alluded to earlier, I just don’t see how Saddam’s execution is going to help the U.S.

Just wait until the internet gets hold of the execution footage.

Dustin

37

[quote]Dustin wrote:
Our government just opened Pandora’s Box. Iraq is bad enough as it is.

Saddam will now be a martyr for millions of Muslims

Dustin[/quote]

“Our” government didn’t do anything except hand over a once dictator to the current Iraqi government. I could be wrong, but I think you’re mistaken about Saddam’s “martyrdom.”

Seriously, why is everyone so up in arms over this? The present media frenzy (I would hardly call it that, BTW) over a public execution isn’t something new–nor is the execution of a so-called national leader. We may have more access to media than ever before, but such public spectacle, insofar a technology has allowed, has always been with us.

Saddam was a grade “A” dictator, he deserved death, and the people he tormented deserve to see him put to death. It’s closure to a half century of fear, anguish, and terror. Wether or not our actions in Iraq2 are justified (and I don’t know that they are) Saddam’s death is a good thing. Until you’ve had to watch your wife raped and killed by your own government, I suggest you withhold your moral indignation.

I guess I’m callous or uncivilized, whatever, “The tree of liberty could not grow were it not watered with the blood of tyrants.” F*#k Saddam–I’m glad he’s dead.

38

[quote]orion wrote:
LBRTRN wrote:
Nice to see that yet another thread is quickly devolving into a jab at “fundamentalist” Christians (as if that is the only group making a distinction between abortion and capital punishment). As Thunder has pointed out, what isn’t being taken into account is the question of guilt.

There is a huge difference between taking the life of an innocent human being (whether you agree or not, most Christians believe the unborn are every bit as human as you and me) and taking the life of a human being responsible for the deaths of thousands. One is murder, the other is not (in the eyes of most Christians). I don’t see why that distinction is so strange…

I think the answer is in part something Prof X wrote above:

You either believe that people can change or you don`t.

I do not care either way, but as a Christian you MUST believe that people can change, call it “finding Jesus” if you must…[/quote]

Obviously there are going to be varying opinions on this, but in my opinion, capital punishment is the payment of a debt owed. Whether or not that person has fulfilled that part about “finding Jesus” he still has a debt to pay, and in the case of murder (particularly murder on the scale of Saddam’s record) that debt is still owed. In fact, part of a being forgiven for sin is accepting the consequences of that sin–I would argue that any murderer who has “found Jesus” the night before his execution should, with glee, accept the just punishment for his rather egregious actions.

Well, if you wanna get Biblical about it, it makes it very clear that our time is short, the hour is unknown, and your time comes when it comes…if you missed your chance, the onus is on you. Furthermore, by taking someone else’s life, not only have you cut someone else’s time short, but you potentially do so for yourself, as well.

[quote]
In a way it could be argued that it is worse to execute a guilty man than killing an innocent child, because the soul is more important than the flesh, and the child?s soul goes straight up to heaven anyway.[/quote]

It could, but not from a Biblical perspective–which is where Christians are coming from. Killing an innocent is about as bad as it gets.

Just to be clear, I’m not arguing that Christians are right in this regard (at least not at the moment) just that the position is perfectly reasonable.

There is no place for personal revenge in Christianity, but the state is a different matter. Render unto Caeser what is Caeser’s…

39

[quote]LBRTRN wrote:

“Our” government didn’t do anything except hand over a once dictator to the current Iraqi government. I could be wrong, but I think you’re mistaken about Saddam’s “martyrdom.”
[/quote]

The current “Iraqi government” is a puppet government set by our government.

Saddam can rot in hell as far as I’m concerned. I just don’t see anything positive coming out of his death. It’s going to make an already bad situation in Iraq even worse.

Looking at the chaos in Iraq now, I can see why Saddam was a grade A dictator, as you call him.

When a population wants to act like savages, they must be put in check with brute force, that is all they understand. Saddam did so quite successfully.

Not if you were a Sunni. Now American soldiers will have to deal with them and I’m sure they won’t be happy that their leader is dead.

Try telling that to a soldier in Iraq whose going to have to deal a pissed of group of already maniacal Sunnis.

Why don’t you withhold your sob-stories. I don’t give a damn about the Iraqis or their freedom. I wish our moronic president would focus some energy on the problems we have here in the states.

[quote]
I guess I’m callous or uncivilized, whatever, “The tree of liberty could not grow were it not watered with the blood of tyrants.” F*#k Saddam–I’m glad he’s dead.[/quote]

What does the tyranny of Saddam have to do with our liberty?

Dustin

40

[quote]LBRTRN wrote:

There is no place for personal revenge in Christianity, but the state is a different matter. Render unto Caeser what is Caeser’s…

[/quote]

So for a Christian it is unacceptable to kill someone for revenge or even to judge them, but to elect someone into office that does the dirty work for them is acceptable?

Democracy, it`s a whole new ballgame…

The people ARE the souvereign, i.e. Caesar…