T Nation

Ryan Howard and 61 Homers

I’ve been hearing a lot of (sports) talking-heads saying that when/if Ryan Howard of the Phillies hits 62 homeruns this year, it should be considered the record because Bonds, Sosa, McGwire were all using (the proverbial) ‘performance enhancers’. Anyone have an opinion on it?

Here’s mine: It shouldn’t be considered the record. First and foremost because steroids were not a banned substance in MLB at the time these records were set.

Also, I have a hard time with baseball “purists” telling me about these “performance enhancers”. They are so out of touch with training and supplementation that they don’t understand the difference between dianabol and creatine.

Who is to say WHERE they draw the line? Isn’t anything a performance enhancer? If it were not, why would anyone use it? Creatine? Performance enhancer. Glutamine? Performance enhancer. Protein supplementation? Performance enhancer.

If you are a ballplayer, isn’t working out a perfomance enhancer? Yet they throw around the term like there’s no tomorrow.

Baseball is not and never has been the model of purity that these people like to imagine. Ruth played hung-over. Cobb conspired to fix/throw games for money. Corked bats. Scuffed balls. Infields manicured to suit the home team. Amphetamines. Steroids. It’s all cheating, right? Or no? Is steroids something so much worse?

Not in my view. In my view, if you ain’t cheatin’, you ain’t tryin’!

[quote]Hack Wilson wrote:
I’ve been hearing a lot of (sports) talking-heads saying that when/if Ryan Howard of the Phillies hits 62 homeruns this year, it should be considered the record because Bonds, Sosa, McGwire were all using (the proverbial) ‘performance enhancers’. Anyone have an opinion on it?

Here’s mine: It shouldn’t be considered the record. First and foremost because steroids were not a banned substance in MLB at the time these records were set.

Also, I have a hard time with baseball “purists” telling me about these “performance enhancers”. They are so out of touch with training and supplementation that they don’t understand the difference between dianabol and creatine.

Who is to say WHERE they draw the line? Isn’t anything a performance enhancer? If it were not, why would anyone use it? Creatine? Performance enhancer. Glutamine? Performance enhancer. Protein supplementation? Performance enhancer.

If you are a ballplayer, isn’t working out a perfomance enhancer? Yet they throw around the term like there’s no tomorrow.

Baseball is not and never has been the model of purity that these people like to imagine. Ruth played hung-over. Cobb conspired to fix/throw games for money. Corked bats. Scuffed balls. Infields manicured to suit the home team. Amphetamines. Steroids. It’s all cheating, right? Or no? Is steroids something so much worse?

Not in my view. In my view, if you ain’t cheatin’, you ain’t tryin’!

[/quote]

The people that broke the records did not break any MLB rules. Their records stand.

no idea who ryan howard is, but how do we know he’s not juicing?

The thing is, I have a hard time believing Ryan Howard (or any of the big power guys) never used steroids at some point during their career. Either in HS, college, minors, pros, whatever. The fact of the matter is, during the time they used steroids they were able to improve at a much faster rate than they would have without steroids. So just because they are “off” now doesn’t mean they aren’t still getting a benefit.

And you can’t convince me that these guys are 100% clean anyways. So in my opinion the record is 73.

[quote]hockechamp14 wrote:
no idea who ryan howard is, but how do we know he’s not juicing?[/quote]

Because the MLB bigwigs say so.

Right. I don’t know that anyone is clean. I hear commentators say he doesn’t have ‘the look’. Well, that again shows they are clueless. There is no look. Your look depends on your training, your diet, the type of drugs you are on, your physiology, etc.

I will say that guys like Ryan Howard are damned if they do and damned if they don’t. Hit a bunch of homers and somone will accuse of using. Be 6’4 and 250 and DON’T hit a bunch of homers and you’re a bum.

The baseball admins draw the line wherever it seems to fit. It’s very arbitrary, obviously, but how else do you do it? You play by baseball’s rules, fair or not. If steroids are legal, use them. If creatine is not, don’t use it.

And Ryan Howard is the man. If the Phillies get to the playoffs, he gets MVP. In an incomplete rookie season he got rookie of the year. First full season he wins the home run derby, potentially leads the majors in home runs and RBI’s, could lead a club to the playoffs after a 12 year drought and wins MVP in the process? That wouldn’t be a bad start to a career.

Go Phillies!

[quote]Hack Wilson wrote:
Who is to say WHERE they draw the line? Isn’t anything a performance enhancer? If it were not, why would anyone use it? Creatine? Performance enhancer. Glutamine? Performance enhancer. Protein supplementation? Performance enhancer.
[/quote]

“Right. I don’t know that anyone is clean. I hear commentators say he doesn’t have ‘the look’.”

Agreed, most of the guys that have been busted so far have been smaller.

I tend to agree with Jose Canseco’s assesment that 80% of the players are using.

And the Ty Cobb thing was thrown out. He did jump into stands to attack a disabled heckler, though. I just find it hard to believe someone with his competitive drive would conspire to throw a game.

Well. The evidence was pretty compelling. From what I’ve read the whole thing against Cobb and the other players was overlooked because of potential damage to the game. This was pre-1919.

Read ‘Cobb’ by Al Stump. Great book about a very intersting person.

Also, Hal Chase was known to have thrown games thoughout his big league career.

Baseball and cheating are synonimous.

Seroids weren’t banned when the records were broken, so the records will stay no matter how bad a taste it leaves in the mouth of the purists.

B.

[quote]Hack Wilson wrote:
Well. The evidence was pretty compelling. From what I’ve read the whole thing against Cobb and the other players was overlooked because of potential damage to the game. This was pre-1919.

Read ‘Cobb’ by Al Stump. Great book about a very intersting person.

Also, Hal Chase was known to have thrown games thoughout his big league career. [/quote]

Cobb was, however, a Detroit Tiger. Thus exonerated from any misgivings or underhanded debauchery therof.

B.

The steroid testing in baseball is a joke. Not to mention that they don’t test for GH.

Dutch Leonard was bitter about being let go from organized baseball in what he felt was a conspiracy by managers Tris Speaker and Cobb. He used the game-fixing charges as a way to retaliate.

True or not, I don’t know. It doesn’t seem to fit into the Cobb profile. This was, after all, the same man who sprung to his feet, screamed “You cost me runs!” and began pummeling an 80-year-old former catcher at a Hall of Fame dinner who had let slip that he used to “air tag” Cobb and then trot back to the dugout to fool the umpires into believing he had actually tagged out a home-sliding Cobb and that the inning was over.

I’ve read that about Leonard. That may be the case as well.

If that 80-year old asshole did, in fact, cost Ty runs, he probably needed to have his ass whupped a little bit.

I have to check this to make sure, but I’m pretty sure that Ryan Howard is a direct descendent of Jesus Christ.

The drought’s endin this year baby!

… er, as soon as we can get closer than 1.5 games to the Padres.

[quote]jtrinsey wrote:
I have to check this to make sure, but I’m pretty sure that Ryan Howard is a direct descendent of Jesus Christ.

The drought’s endin this year baby!

… er, as soon as we can get closer than 1.5 games to the Padres.[/quote]

Sorry, the Giants are taking the WC unless the win they west.

Last I checked, Bonds never failed a drug test, correct?

Lance Armstrong never failed a drug test either, right?

So, regardless of how phenomenal the performances of either of these athletes are, there’s no proof of them cheating, so leave them alone.

I don’t care how much of a jerk Bonds is. He hit the home runs. It’s his record, and I think it’s absolute bullshit that people try to discredit his baseball accomplishments just because they don’t like him as a person.

[quote]Bauer97 wrote:
Last I checked, Bonds never failed a drug test, correct?

Lance Armstrong never failed a drug test either, right?

So, regardless of how phenomenal the performances of either of these athletes are, there’s no proof of them cheating, so leave them alone.

I don’t care how much of a jerk Bonds is. He hit the home runs. It’s his record, and I think it’s absolute bullshit that people try to discredit his baseball accomplishments just because they don’t like him as a person.[/quote]

My thoughts exactly.

[quote]PGA200X wrote:
jtrinsey wrote:
I have to check this to make sure, but I’m pretty sure that Ryan Howard is a direct descendent of Jesus Christ.

The drought’s endin this year baby!

… er, as soon as we can get closer than 1.5 games to the Padres.

Sorry, the Giants are taking the WC unless the win they west.[/quote]

C’mon man, let me hope!

Baseball records are the most revered and least pure of all sports.

They don’t even have a uniform field size.

Can you imagine if some football teams played on an 80 yard field? Would their TD stats count the same?