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Routine to Cut On: Madcow or 5/3/1?

Hey Guys,
My current lifts are:
S: 264x5
B: 200x5
D: 308x5

I’m going a good cut till about 8% bf, what would be a good routine to follow during that cut? Would want to keep as much muscle as possible.

I was thinking of Madcow but it does seem too hard for a cut. 5/3/1 sounds better but I don’t think my lifts are good enough for it. Was looking to train 3-4d per week.

Thank you

[quote]Quantikz wrote:
Hey Guys,
My current lifts are:
S: 264x5
B: 200x5
D: 308x5

I’m going a good cut till about 8% bf, what would be a good routine to follow during that cut? Would want to keep as much muscle as possible.

I was thinking of Madcow but it does seem too hard for a cut. 5/3/1 sounds better but I don’t think my lifts are good enough for it. Was looking to train 3-4d per week.

Thank you[/quote]

i dont think you should be cutting to 8% if those are your lifts, no offense.

Ignore ryan.b_96, if you want to cut then go for it.

I think your biggest concern is not the programming, but recovery. You’ll need to be careful about overall volume and stress on you CNS.

I can’t comment on Madcow because I haven’t done it. 5/3/1 will probably work fine if you minimize the accessory work, imo.

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Ignore ryan.b_96, if you want to cut then go for it.

I think your biggest concern is not the programming, but recovery. You’ll need to be careful about overall volume and stress on you CNS.

I can’t comment on Madcow because I haven’t done it. 5/3/1 will probably work fine if you minimize the accessory work, imo.
[/quote]

with a 200lb im guessing he has little muscle mass, why the fuck would cutting to 8% be a good idea?

[quote]ryan.b_96 wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Ignore ryan.b_96, if you want to cut then go for it.

I think your biggest concern is not the programming, but recovery. You’ll need to be careful about overall volume and stress on you CNS.

I can’t comment on Madcow because I haven’t done it. 5/3/1 will probably work fine if you minimize the accessory work, imo.
[/quote]

with a 200lb bench im guessing he has little muscle mass, why the fuck would cutting to 8% be a good idea? [/quote]

Maybe he’s 300lbs.

^ It’s also personal preference. Maybe he doesn’t care how strong he is or how “built” he is. This isn’t the bodybuilding or powerlifting forum. He probably wants to look good with his shirt off. It’s his body.

okay op, if you feel like limiting your progress just so you can cut down to 8% then by all means do it. its your body and your choice.

[quote]ryan.b_96 wrote:

i dont think you should be cutting to 8% if those are your lifts, no offense.[/quote]

None taken man. I appreciate your concern and I know what you mean but I’m happy with my size. My lifts were higher some months ago but then I messed around with routines and ended up nowhere. Also, I haven’t done bench in while, always used DBs and incline stuff. Haven’t benched with a BB in quick some time.

I just want to cut some fat and then bulk after summer. Pure vanity I know.

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Ignore ryan.b_96, if you want to cut then go for it.

I think your biggest concern is not the programming, but recovery. You’ll need to be careful about overall volume and stress on you CNS.

I can’t comment on Madcow because I haven’t done it. 5/3/1 will probably work fine if you minimize the accessory work, imo.
[/quote]

Thanks man! 5/3/1 looks really good for a cut since the progress is slow, thing is, my lifts are kinda shitty for it imo. Dunno… Will wait for more feedback. Thank you once again

[quote]Quantikz wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Ignore ryan.b_96, if you want to cut then go for it.

I think your biggest concern is not the programming, but recovery. You’ll need to be careful about overall volume and stress on you CNS.

I can’t comment on Madcow because I haven’t done it. 5/3/1 will probably work fine if you minimize the accessory work, imo.
[/quote]

Thanks man! 5/3/1 looks really good for a cut since the progress is slow, thing is, my lifts are kinda shitty for it imo. Dunno… Will wait for more feedback. Thank you once again[/quote]

90% of 1rm = 90% of 1rm whether that’s 400lbs or 198. If you are gonna cut you’re goal should be to maintain strength if not improve it slightly as well as maintain what muscle you do have. If you don’t think you’re in a good spot (ie you are weaker than you want or weigh like 130 lbs) to cut, than don’t. That’s entirely up to you. Gaining 20lbs of LBM will make you look way differnt if you weigh 130lbs than cutting a couple bf% points, imo.

How much do you weigh and how fat do you think you are? A pic would be good.

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]Quantikz wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Ignore ryan.b_96, if you want to cut then go for it.

I think your biggest concern is not the programming, but recovery. You’ll need to be careful about overall volume and stress on you CNS.

I can’t comment on Madcow because I haven’t done it. 5/3/1 will probably work fine if you minimize the accessory work, imo.
[/quote]

Thanks man! 5/3/1 looks really good for a cut since the progress is slow, thing is, my lifts are kinda shitty for it imo. Dunno… Will wait for more feedback. Thank you once again[/quote]

90% of 1rm = 90% of 1rm whether that’s 400lbs or 198. If you are gonna cut you’re goal should be to maintain strength if not improve it slightly as well as maintain what muscle you do have. If you don’t think you’re in a good spot (ie you are weaker than you want or weigh like 130 lbs) to cut, than don’t. That’s entirely up to you. Gaining 20lbs of LBM will make you look way differnt if you weigh 130lbs than cutting a couple bf% points, imo.

How much do you weigh and how fat do you think you are? A pic would be good. [/quote]

I’m not fat at all lol I’m like 12% right now, 182-184lbs. So most of it is muscle actually. I’m not very tall either so… Thing is (and I should’ve mentioned it earlier), I’ve been on Madcow for 2 weeks and I already feel exhausted. Two things that comes to my mind, maybe I should up my calories a bit on the train days, or maybe find a less tiring routine. Doing full body 3d a week on 2100kcal is not very easy for me. Dunno man, maybe I should just shut up and lift. I hate being this paranoid about body fat.

[quote]Quantikz wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]Quantikz wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Ignore ryan.b_96, if you want to cut then go for it.

I think your biggest concern is not the programming, but recovery. You’ll need to be careful about overall volume and stress on you CNS.

I can’t comment on Madcow because I haven’t done it. 5/3/1 will probably work fine if you minimize the accessory work, imo.
[/quote]

Thanks man! 5/3/1 looks really good for a cut since the progress is slow, thing is, my lifts are kinda shitty for it imo. Dunno… Will wait for more feedback. Thank you once again[/quote]

90% of 1rm = 90% of 1rm whether that’s 400lbs or 198. If you are gonna cut you’re goal should be to maintain strength if not improve it slightly as well as maintain what muscle you do have. If you don’t think you’re in a good spot (ie you are weaker than you want or weigh like 130 lbs) to cut, than don’t. That’s entirely up to you. Gaining 20lbs of LBM will make you look way differnt if you weigh 130lbs than cutting a couple bf% points, imo.

How much do you weigh and how fat do you think you are? A pic would be good. [/quote]

I’m not fat at all lol I’m like 12% right now, 182-184lbs. So most of it is muscle actually. I’m not very tall either so… Thing is (and I should’ve mentioned it earlier), I’ve been on Madcow for 2 weeks and I already feel exhausted. Two things that comes to my mind, maybe I should up my calories a bit on the train days, or maybe find a less tiring routine. Doing full body 3d a week on 2100kcal is not very easy for me. Dunno man, maybe I should just shut up and lift. I hate being this paranoid about body fat.[/quote]

Recovery is more challenging when calories are reduced. Check out some of the bb threads from like Stu/Zraw. I imagine they have written about dealing with this while cutting. Even if you’re not a bodybuilder I’m sure the info is applicable.

Will do, thanks man! Appreciate the patience :slight_smile:

Want to echo the good info you’ve received from usmc above. If you’re going to do a cut involving a deep caloric deficit, your ability to recover will be significantly affected. So whatever training protocol you use, keep the volume low, and concentrate on keeping your strength. Good luck.

[quote]EyeDentist wrote:
Want to echo the good info you’ve received from usmc above. If you’re going to do a cut involving a deep caloric deficit, your ability to recover will be significantly affected. So whatever training protocol you use, keep the volume low, and concentrate on keeping your strength. Good luck.[/quote]

Well I wouldn’t call it a deep caloric cut. I was thinking 2200kcal on training days and 2000kcal on off days. I’ve been doing 2000kcal everyday and I’m too tired so I might try that next week. In regards to the routine, madcow has me going up lifts every week and I don’t think I’ll keep up with it while cutting. 5/3/1 seems better for it actually… Feels like I’ll be able to keep more mass that way. I might be wrong tho
Thanks

Like everyone has said, you can do what you want with your body but I just thought you might appreciate some feedback from someone that was in your boat for a long time. My first year of college I got to a 180-185 lb body with 10-12% bf. I thought I could cut down for spring break and dropped into the upper single digits. For me, I was much happier with the way I looked and felt before the cut. Just kind of felt crappy and my muscles lost some of their fullness which gave me a scrawny look. Just me but you may find that you were happier with your slightly larger self. Hell, if your are naturally skinny muscular and can get your diet dialed in you can probably keep eating to grow and get bigger without really gaining any noticeable fat. Just a thought.

[quote]bpick86 wrote:
Like everyone has said, you can do what you want with your body but I just thought you might appreciate some feedback from someone that was in your boat for a long time. My first year of college I got to a 180-185 lb body with 10-12% bf. I thought I could cut down for spring break and dropped into the upper single digits. For me, I was much happier with the way I looked and felt before the cut. Just kind of felt crappy and my muscles lost some of their fullness which gave me a scrawny look. Just me but you may find that you were happier with your slightly larger self. Hell, if your are naturally skinny muscular and can get your diet dialed in you can probably keep eating to grow and get bigger without really gaining any noticeable fat. Just a thought.[/quote]

Thanks for the feed man. Last summer I was lean and imo I looked good enough, this year I’m bigger so I think it’s ok.

pic from last year (sorry, only one I have):

I still think that Madcow will destroy me at this rate so I might jump on 5/3/1 =| Another thing I could go is greyskull or SS but I dunno.

Any strength based program was really difficult for me to maintain in calorie deficit. But that’s me. I never spent any time in deficit after that first run at it and spent all my time with adjusting so that I could keep up just enough excess to add a pound or two a month. Stayed ripped by non tnationer standards kept getting bigger. As a bonus, I was tolerable to be around so I could actually get laid every now and then.

Want a good routine to use for a “cut”?

The same routine that made you gain the most muscle :slight_smile:

You might want to consider ramping during fat loss. Check CTs thread out about it. It’s simple, but let me tell ya it can be as brutal.