T Nation

Rev. Phelps Protests Soldiers Funerals!

[quote]rainjack wrote:
I’m trying to figure out exactly how this nut-job is all that much different than the Sheehan version.[/quote]

If you’re still trying to figure that out, well, you’re a bit slow RJ.

You can turn anything into some kind of attack on the left, can’t you?

[quote]deanosumo wrote:
rainjack wrote:
I’m trying to figure out exactly how this nut-job is all that much different than the Sheehan version.

If you’re still trying to figure that out, well, you’re a bit slow RJ.

You can turn anything into some kind of attack on the left, can’t you?

[/quote]

Did somebody break the lefties’ sarcasm detector? Shit. You guys need to go to the damn store, pool your pocket change together, and buy a freaking sense of humor. I promise you that they are not that expensive - and they will go quite a ways in helping you deal.

You can do better than that, deano. You are starting to sound like the resident half-wits harryass6969 and mmg69 - or whatever the hell their names are. I respect you too much not to tell you when you wander to close to the idiot ray.

[quote]Kuz wrote:
harris447 wrote:
rainjack wrote:
I’m trying to figure out exactly how this nut-job is all that much different than the Sheehan version.

Maybe because the “nut-job” Sheehan has the moral standing of having LOST HER SON IN THE WAR YOU LOVE SO MUCH.

You pathetic shithead.

That gives her moral standing? The fact her son made a choice she disagreed with? We can all feel for her loss, but it doesn’t make her any less of a kook.[/quote]

Exactly. Her sun signed up to make war. He signed up to be in the army. He didn’t sign up for a weekend hiking trip and George Bush didn’t shanghia him off the street. He wanted to fight and he did. Every service man and woman has imperiled themselves when they sign up. While it is always tragic when they die in the line of duty it is hardly surprising.

As far as Phelps’ ilk, I hope I would be willing to go to jail for beating down those losers.

What an asshole. I don’t think anyone should be allowed to desecrate a person’s funeral. I’m not speaking just for the soldiers who died and are having their ceremony shit all over, but also their families who have to go thru the pain of losing a loved one and also have some jackass making a spectacle of the whole thing. As big a fan of freedom of speech as I may be, shit like this never would’ve happened in 1945, round up a little mob and invoke some mob justice.

[quote]conorh wrote:
Exactly. Her sun signed up to make war. He signed up to be in the army. He didn’t sign up for a weekend hiking trip and George Bush didn’t shanghia him off the street. He wanted to fight and he did. Every service man and woman has imperiled themselves when they sign up. While it is always tragic when they die in the line of duty it is hardly surprising.

As far as Phelps’ ilk, I hope I would be willing to go to jail for beating down those losers.
[/quote]

I truly hate this kind of logic or lack of any sense of true respect when it comes to the lives of servicemen. Because a soldier pledges to uphold the Constitution does NOT mean that he agrees with every decision made by politicians that put his/her life in danger. It also doesn’t mean that his life then becomes invaluable and disposable. While “fighting” may be part of the job, that is not the basis of any military man’s obligation. The Constitution is. Tillman also didn’t agree with the current war we are in. Should his family decide to become more vocal about that aspect, they shouldn’t be called “kooks” or any other negative stereotype simply because they disagree with the sentiments of a certain political affiliation.

[quote]slimjim wrote:
What an asshole. I don’t think anyone should be allowed to desecrate a person’s funeral. I’m not speaking just for the soldiers who died and are having their ceremony shit all over, but also their families who have to go thru the pain of losing a loved one and also have some jackass making a spectacle of the whole thing. As big a fan of freedom of speech as I may be, shit like this never would’ve happened in 1945, round up a little mob and invoke some mob justice.[/quote]

I agree with this completely. There should be a certain level of respect simply because someone died. Using that time as a chance to voice a political opinion should allow you to be shot at.

[quote]PhxCliff wrote:

Next you know, he’ll be barricading himself and his followers in a compound somewhere…[/quote]

Please, God.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
slimjim wrote:
What an asshole. I don’t think anyone should be allowed to desecrate a person’s funeral. I’m not speaking just for the soldiers who died and are having their ceremony shit all over, but also their families who have to go thru the pain of losing a loved one and also have some jackass making a spectacle of the whole thing. As big a fan of freedom of speech as I may be, shit like this never would’ve happened in 1945, round up a little mob and invoke some mob justice.

I agree with this completely. There should be a certain level of respect simply because someone died. Using that time as a chance to voice a political opinion should allow you to be shot at.
[/quote]

What X said…

[quote]WMD wrote:
PhxCliff wrote:

Next you know, he’ll be barricading himself and his followers in a compound somewhere…

Please, God.[/quote]

Actually he and his band of sheep have a compound. Right smack dab in the middle of town. Topeka, Kansas where I was born and raised. We are known for two things now Him and his sheeple and being awarded the pleasure of being the Meth. capitol of the Nation.

He and his missguided group all his daughters (all of which himself included have law degrees) included have bought up a city block. They have a fence anound it and a Huge collective yard. get free swimming pools etc claiming them as Baptismals etc. They consistantly protest everything. the largest issue being homosexuals.

Anyway just thought I would share that. I have learned over the years he and his group is best just ignored. Several people have tried runniong him down qwith cars and such but that jsut gets thwemm fired up again.

So I say ignore him or END him, there is no inbetween. I do agree what they do as far as funerals is WAY out of line.

OK I am getting out of this forum area so as I dont get HOOKED into multiple threads like all you guys. LOL

Phill

[quote]harris447 wrote:
Kuz wrote:
harris447 wrote:
rainjack wrote:
I’m trying to figure out exactly how this nut-job is all that much different than the Sheehan version.

Maybe because the “nut-job” Sheehan has the moral standing of having LOST HER SON IN THE WAR YOU LOVE SO MUCH.

You pathetic shithead.

That gives her moral standing? The fact her son made a choice she disagreed with? We can all feel for her loss, but it doesn’t make her any less of a kook.

What makes her a kook?[/quote]

Um, how about the fact that she calls the Iraqi insurgents “freedom fighters”? You can call them a bunch of different names, but freedom fighters? Most of them are undoubtedly Iraqi, not foreign, but they’re a mixture of Baathists and Islamo-fascists, sadists who decapitate people on camera, blow up kids, and want to send their country back to either secular, minority dictatorship or medieval fundamentalist Islam. So I’d say calling the Iraqi rebels “freedom fighters” makes you either a kook or someone who is so lost to political partisanship that the truth is a distant memory.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
conorh wrote:
Exactly. Her sun signed up to make war. He signed up to be in the army. He didn’t sign up for a weekend hiking trip and George Bush didn’t shanghia him off the street. He wanted to fight and he did. Every service man and woman has imperiled themselves when they sign up. While it is always tragic when they die in the line of duty it is hardly surprising.

As far as Phelps’ ilk, I hope I would be willing to go to jail for beating down those losers.

I truly hate this kind of logic or lack of any sense of true respect when it comes to the lives of servicemen. Because a soldier pledges to uphold the Constitution does NOT mean that he agrees with every decision made by politicians that put his/her life in danger. It also doesn’t mean that his life then becomes invaluable and disposable. While “fighting” may be part of the job, that is not the basis of any military man’s obligation. The Constitution is. Tillman also didn’t agree with the current war we are in. Should his family decide to become more vocal about that aspect, they shouldn’t be called “kooks” or any other negative stereotype simply because they disagree with the sentiments of a certain political affiliation.[/quote]

I know quite a few marines who don’t agree with the war in Iraq. To a man, they all will go or have gone already because they understand the expectation for combat that they carry. I also understand your oath is to protect and defend the constitution, but there is also the part about taking up arms. The taking up arms part is critical. Wether you agree with the plausibility that the war your fighting is really defending the constitution or not is a side issue, my contention is that you should expect that you will see combat.

I want to add that I can not recall taking issue with any servicemen on this subject. The only folks I take issue with are the ones who seemingly deny the aspect of personal responsibility for putting yourself in harms way.

Regardless Phelps is trash and I’m all for his wanton beating.

[quote]GDollars37 wrote:
What makes her a kook?

Um, how about the fact that she calls the Iraqi insurgents “freedom fighters”? You can call them a bunch of different names, but freedom fighters? Most of them are undoubtedly Iraqi, not foreign, but they’re a mixture of Baathists and Islamo-fascists, sadists who decapitate people on camera, blow up kids, and want to send their country back to either secular, minority dictatorship or medieval fundamentalist Islam. So I’d say calling the Iraqi rebels “freedom fighters” makes you either a kook or someone who is so lost to political partisanship that the truth is a distant memory.[/quote]

Could you post the quote in its entirety, please?

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Could you post the quote in its entirety, please?
[/quote]

That’s like asking one of you guys to post the “Kerry’s a flip-flopper” quote in its entirety. She has said it many times. I’m sure if you were to try, you could find plaenty of places where she has said it. Try looking through her blog that MoveOn.org paid her to write.


http://patterico.com/2005/08/25/3505/cindy-sheehan-terrorists-are-freedom-fighters/
http://www.theconservativevoice.com/articles/article.html?id=7890

Here are some links that refer to the quote. I just pulled the first three that came up. I believe it originally aired on CBS - in the 60 Munutes interview.

Google is such a cool deal - you should try it sometime

[quote]rainjack wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Could you post the quote in its entirety, please?

That’s like asking one of you guys to post the “Kerry’s a flip-flopper” quote in its entirety. She has said it many times. I’m sure if you were to try, you could find plaenty of places where she has said it. Try looking through her blog that MoveOn.org paid her to write.
[/quote]

The point was, I am not interested in someone’s opinion of what she said. I am simply looking for the quote and I assume the following is it:

I have no intention of speaking for the woman or even supporting what she said, however, this remark doesn’t seem to flow directly with “the terrorists are freedom fighters”.

My own personal opinion is yes, we probably have increased the numbers of those who now have new reasons to hate American influence in that region. I wouldn’t call anyone bombing american soldiers “freedom fighters” because we are fighting them as an enemy. However, if this is the one statement being used to discredit everything the woman says, I would hope you all have more than this.

Sheehan is a mouthpiece currently and a way to get media coverage. That doesn’t mean I need to degrade the woman or act as if she is a “kook” and has no valid point at all just because I disagree with one term she used out of context. I would have never used the same term, but it would be dishonest to pretend as if I didn’t understand the point she was trying to make.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
conorh wrote:
Exactly. Her sun signed up to make war. He signed up to be in the army. He didn’t sign up for a weekend hiking trip and George Bush didn’t shanghia him off the street. He wanted to fight and he did. Every service man and woman has imperiled themselves when they sign up. While it is always tragic when they die in the line of duty it is hardly surprising.

As far as Phelps’ ilk, I hope I would be willing to go to jail for beating down those losers.

I truly hate this kind of logic or lack of any sense of true respect when it comes to the lives of servicemen. Because a soldier pledges to uphold the Constitution does NOT mean that he agrees with every decision made by politicians that put his/her life in danger. It also doesn’t mean that his life then becomes invaluable and disposable. While “fighting” may be part of the job, that is not the basis of any military man’s obligation. The Constitution is. Tillman also didn’t agree with the current war we are in. Should his family decide to become more vocal about that aspect, they shouldn’t be called “kooks” or any other negative stereotype simply because they disagree with the sentiments of a certain political affiliation.[/quote]

I can only speak for myself, but my point in that the son made a decision is not meant to denigrate the value of the life of our soldiers at all. So while it’s inherent in the oath a solider undertakes to defend the Constitution, it will always be the case that those higher up will make the decisions as to when that will be. I don’t think anyone should be telling any American citizen (solider, civilian, etc.) what they should think, but for soliders, they are still going to need to follow orders in the end. Or am I missing something from your post?

Hey T-Nation, sorry my first post has to be negative but, this maggot really got my blood boiling. To be fair, I did send the following to his email before I posted it on here.

Open invitation to Fred Phelps from Staff Sergeant Michael R. Kilburn, 101st Airborne Division (Air Assault).

Phelps, I got a nice seat for you aboard a C130 cargo plane that will be departing Fort Campbell, Kentucky approximately the 25th of this month (yep, day after Thanksgiving). After a brief layover somewhere in Kuwait, we will make our final departure onward to an airbase in Iraq and then travel by convoy to Baghdad.

Along the way, you will have the opportunity to converse with America’s finest sons and daughters. Obviously, you will know what they do, but they will be curious as hell to know the real Fred Phelps. Feel free to tell them about the last fallen heroes’ funeral protest you just coordinated, or how you make those attractive “Thank God for IEDS” picket signs and how you have guided eight year old minds to stomp on the very flag these soldiers wear on their uniform.

What should you bring? Oh, pack lightly Fredrick. Once we are on the road to Baghdad we may have the heavy chance of meeting one of those improvised explosive devices you love so much. It will tear the hell out of the vehicle, may kill a few passengers, but it will for sure rip to pieces your luggage. So, leave all that at home. Be advised that if we do encounter the enemy after our unexpected attack, we will protect you until the death. If however you are captured by the insurgents, you will make the Al-Jazerra news and then the Spec Forces fellas will come rescue you before the Bad Guys cut your dome off. Yea Fred, the Special Forces, they would really love to hear all your “fantastic” stories and “enjoyable” lifestyle. And then you will fully understand what the phrase “We are not in Kansas anymore” really means! So, hop aboard Freddie! And don’t you forget that pretty lil cowboy hat either you FUCKING SCRUM SUCKING MAGGOT OF THE EARTH! SLEEP WELL TONIGHT UNDER THE BLANKET OF FREEDOM THAT MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS PROVIDE YOU SIMPLE MINDED BITCH!!!

It is the Soldier,
not the reporter, who has given us freedom of press.

It is the Soldier,
not the poet, who has given us freedom of speech.

It is the Soldier,
not the campus organizer, who gives us freedom to demonstrate.

It is the Soldier
who salutes the flag,
who serves beneath the flag,
and whose coffin is draped by the flag,
who allows the protester to burn the flag.

[quote]Kuz wrote:
Or am I missing something from your post?[/quote]

Yes…who I was responding to.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Kuz wrote:
Or am I missing something from your post?

Yes…who I was responding to.[/quote]

No, I figured you meant conorh, but he was also responding to my thought… so I thought I would toss it out there anyway.

[quote]BigSarge wrote:
Hey T-Nation, sorry my first post has to be negative but, this maggot really got my blood boiling. To be fair, I did send the following to his email before I posted it on here.

Open invitation to Fred Phelps from Staff Sergeant Michael R. Kilburn, 101st Airborne Division (Air Assault).

Phelps, I got a nice seat for you aboard a C130 cargo plane that will be departing Fort Campbell, Kentucky approximately the 25th of this month (yep, day after Thanksgiving). After a brief layover somewhere in Kuwait, we will make our final departure onward to an airbase in Iraq and then travel by convoy to Baghdad.

Along the way, you will have the opportunity to converse with America’s finest sons and daughters. Obviously, you will know what they do, but they will be curious as hell to know the real Fred Phelps. Feel free to tell them about the last fallen heroes’ funeral protest you just coordinated, or how you make those attractive “Thank God for IEDS” picket signs and how you have guided eight year old minds to stomp on the very flag these soldiers wear on their uniform.

What should you bring? Oh, pack lightly Fredrick. Once we are on the road to Baghdad we may have the heavy chance of meeting one of those improvised explosive devices you love so much. It will tear the hell out of the vehicle, may kill a few passengers, but it will for sure rip to pieces your luggage. So, leave all that at home. Be advised that if we do encounter the enemy after our unexpected attack, we will protect you until the death. If however you are captured by the insurgents, you will make the Al-Jazerra news and then the Spec Forces fellas will come rescue you before the Bad Guys cut your dome off. Yea Fred, the Special Forces, they would really love to hear all your “fantastic” stories and “enjoyable” lifestyle. And then you will fully understand what the phrase “We are not in Kansas anymore” really means! So, hop aboard Freddie! And don’t you forget that pretty lil cowboy hat either you FUCKING SCRUM SUCKING MAGGOT OF THE EARTH! SLEEP WELL TONIGHT UNDER THE BLANKET OF FREEDOM THAT MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS PROVIDE YOU SIMPLE MINDED BITCH!!!

It is the Soldier,
not the reporter, who has given us freedom of press.

It is the Soldier,
not the poet, who has given us freedom of speech.

It is the Soldier,
not the campus organizer, who gives us freedom to demonstrate.

It is the Soldier
who salutes the flag,
who serves beneath the flag,
and whose coffin is draped by the flag,
who allows the protester to burn the flag. [/quote]

I thought those rights were guaranteed by the Constitution?