Replacing Upright Row

Widening the grip negates some of the potential shoulder issues, as does stopping parallel to the shoulder itself.


Internal rotation isn’t necessarily bad. It’s like a normal function of your shoulders. Sometimes as you get Muscle Bound or old you lose your internal rotation ROM.

Your shoulders go into internal rotation during the upright row. If you have the ROM/flexibility, it’s no problem. If you lack that ability to move into internal rotation, and do upright rows, you can grind your shoulders up.

Swapping out moves is totally cool, but don’t neglect your internal rotation. You don’t want lose it!

As for replacements, do forget about Lu Raises and rear delt rows.


IMO you need more rear delt work and direct trap work - I like rear delt flyes and cable-face pulls for these, respectively. you’ve got DB press and Military press, which target primarily the same muscles and is a bit unnecessary for hypertrophy.

Most trainers would recommend keeping some of those “riskier” exercises isn’t a problem so long as you aren’t in pain from it. If Lat Pulldowns behind the neck aren’t hurting your shoulders - there is no reason not to do them… I believe this thinking should apply to your upright row as well.

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Wide Grip Upright Rows have an almost steroid like effect on the traps. If you want big traps then you have to do these man. They are awesome


I’ve tried incorporating these into my regimen a few times and it never really felt right… I watched the CT video and read the article, it just never felt like it had enough stimulation with explosives - and doing them with hypertrophy style has me using some ridiculously low weight.

Do you perform yours explosive or more hypertrophy style? if the latter, do you recall your weights being quite light when you first started?

basically you dont have a problem… you created one because others had it?


Yeah @Andrewgen_Receptors mate my weight was light however reps were 20+

Not a big deal man. Going to failure gets those bad boys jacked.

The weight has shot up since doing 350 method .


maybe its just me with my shit genetics and “nothing matters” approach because i might not know what im doing, but… do people really notice visible growth if they switch the exercises in the “correct” manner?
Cuz i dont… i believe my body doesnt give a fuck if i train rear this or side that, or upper/lower chest or inner thigh or smth…
I have never seen an exercise make a difference. At all.

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I get this with behind the neck press. A load of people told me to stop as it would hurt my shoulders. I decided to stop - if / when it started to hurt my shoulder. For now I’m good.

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If an exercise is common to cause people issues and could potentially be a poor choice for a joint, and it doesn’t matter what exercise you choose for said muscle… then why wouldn’t you swap to something else


eh I think it’s a bit of semantics with a bit of immeasurable ‘by feel’ sprinkled on top.

I’ve been educating myself on different training methods quite a bit since I started here and have a few conflicting opinions that I haven’t sorted out just yet. Was going to go more into detail but I don’t think it’s necessary… I can say that for ME, certain movements provide better results than others. They typically align with general concensus on ‘best movements for x muscle’ but differ sometimes.

I think the answer to your question would change from one person to the next - it appears exercise selection doesn’t do much for you and thats great! For me (example), I see no results with flat bench whatsoever - so I do incline and have reasonably well developed pecs. I wanted to see the separation between the upper pecs and rest of the muscle, so I did reverse-grip bench for a few weeks - and I saw the separation.
In these ways, it seems very individualized.

DC Training kind of aligns with your beliefs (to my understanding) that the exercise is kind of irrelevant as long as youre moving some heavy ass weight and beating the logbook.

EDIT: +1 to what @wanna_be said. I didn’t consider injuries, but yes - some exercises are incredibly injury prone while others are far safer versions.

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Seeing that I don’t switch. Here is why:

  • Because its not causing me any issues.
  • Because the risk reward is worth it

If its not broke, do not fix it.


I had to quit upright rows due to forearm pain more so than shoulder pain.

When I tried John Parrillo’s routine he incorporated what he called a strap pull on the seated long pull (rowing) machine, where you pulled the straps to your face. But with your legs braced you could move a lot of weight. It was the second shoulder exercise after the press. If only a rope was available I used wrist straps to hold the rope at its ends.

Yeah its cool, i just wanted to know if you really see the difference.
I dont suppose you can show pics before and after a certain exercise, so i could also see the difference?
It doesnt matter much - its all good, i just said that i cant really show anyone a pic of “see my arms are waaay smaller because i didnt do this exercise before”.

Yea, sure, i agree.
Its just that i said those two things you quoted as a reply to different ideas/topics.
But when you combine what i said - yea, i guess it also makes sense and i have nothing against that way of thinking.

Its just that i am more for this :

Exactly how i think about everything in life, haha :smiley:

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I wish I had them lol. This was years ago when I was lean (with some muscle) and even then, it probably wouldn’t be noticable to others the way it was for me.

It’s like bros with a pump at the gym. They can tell their bros how sick their pump is and take pictures, yet to everyone else they look no different. IME, we will all notice impeccably small improvements in ourselves and no one else would be able to see a difference.

This is what i am going by.
I dont take shit serious if im the only one seeing it. Just as i hate tattoos which need to be explained : “this is a soul of my dead grandmother leaving this world and entering a new one” - no, its a fucking butterfly on your ass. If the tattoo is not readable its shit.
Same is with “results” and all this stuff we are talking about. If no one can really say : “whoa dude it looks like do a lot of incline, and less flat bench” then it doesnt matter which one you do.
And i have never seen anyone be able to tell by the persons body, which exercises they do more.

p.s - im not arguing, im just talking and expressing what I think, thats all :slight_smile:



Agreed. I think it’s entirely anecdotal and non-quantifiable which exercises work best - I know I went by what “felt right” for years and did pretty well with that alone so all I can do is speak for myself :slightly_smiling_face:

@hankthetank89 bringing the pain as usual


a) this shouders in a bottle no uprights needed…

(do once a week)

b) any special reason you’re training shoulders every time you’re in the gym? -that likely to irritate shoulders more than anything -ie try look at some other 3 day templates


I work 3 days a week and each time full body routine

Here my latest routine please comment on it