T Nation

Replace the Flat Bench with Floor Press?


#1

I have bicep tendonitis and can’t do BB Flat bench. I can however do Floor press. I have short arms so the floor press is pretty much full range for me. Can i train the floor press exclusevly and get my strenght to say 400 pounds and switch to BB bench and be able to press similar weight? How much carry over does it have for T rex arm lifters in your experience?


#2

Are you a powerlifter?


#3

I have tried this, and I use floor presses (plus mini bands and or chains) as my main pressing strength exercise now. The problem is that you loose your strength off the chest, basically holding the stretch reflex, and it takes a few workouts to get it back, but for long term pure strength building it works.

You also may lose a little of your setup.

I tend to pair them with dumbell presses or chest dips to keep the stretch reflex upgraded, and I might practice setting up with light weights, or with reverse band rows to keep my setup tight, but the truth is that both the stretch reflex and setup come back pretty quickly, maybe 1-2 workouts.

Floor presses with mini bands are awesome.

Do you come to a full pause at the bottom, and also do you relax the pressing muscles at the bottom for a second, or not?


#4

I’m not a powerlifter by defenition, but i will compete in mabye 1-2 years and switch to a Flat bench once my shoulder heals.


#5

I don’t really relax at the buttom, is this something you’d recommend for building starting strenght?


#6

there is no such thing as a mandatory exercise, one that you must do in your programs. Rather there are mandatory movement patterns.

What’s the difference?

A movement pattern is a general action that is fundamental to the proper functioning of the body. To quote Dr.Rusin:

  • Squatting pattern
  • Hip hinge pattern
  • Pressing pattern
  • Pulling pattern
  • Lunging/single leg pattern
  • Carrying pattern

Note that pressing and pulling could themselves be divided into horizontal and vertical pressing/pulling.

Exercises are drills that can be done to overload those basic movement patterns to make them stronger.

So for horizontal pressing you have:

Pressing pattern (horizontal)
Bench press
DB bench press pronated
DB bench press neutral grip
Close-grip bench press
Reverse-grip bench press
Low incline (15-30 degrees) bench press
Low incline close-grip bench press
Low-incline DB press pronated
Low-incline DB press neutral
Floor press
Bench press from pins (various positions)
Close-grip bench press from pins (various positions)
Trap bar bench press
Trap bar floor press
Football/Swiss bar bench press
Football/Swiss bar floor press
Football/Swiss bar from pins (various positions)
Decline bench press
Decline close-grip bench press
Decline DB press pronated
Decline DB press neutral grip
Board press (1. 2. 3, 4 boards)
Close-grip board press (1,2,3,4 boards)
Etc.

Not everybody is capable to doing every exercise optimally, either due to physical limitations, bad levers, etc. What is important is to train these basic movement patterns and become stronger at them. To do so it is perfectly fine to pick the exercise that suits your body, level of development and skill level.


#7

This is a very helpful list! Is there a more comprehensive list of exercises out there somewhere for all movement patterns?

It would really help me to find pain free movements for my spouse. Christian, you are a terrific person! Thank you very much for all you do. My partner is 65 with adhesive capsulitis. I’ve used many of your techniques and suggestions to reduce her pain and help maintain and in some cases increase her strength during rehab. Keep up the exceptional work! I sincerely hope you feel the greatest of joy knowing you have touched so many lives in such a positive way. I wish there were an army of guys like you.

Be well! :muscle::heart::+1:


#8

It’s pretty comprehensive if you ask me! Of course I don’t include machine exercises and only cover the essential movement patterns. For example a biceps curl or a lateral raise doesn’t cover an essential/basic movement pattern. But they can still be useful to target a specific musle.


#9

What I meant was a separate list of exercises for each movement pattern. You listed 24 different exercises for the horizontal pressing pattern. I know it’s a lot to ask, but a list like that for each upper body movement pattern would be awesome. We have tried over 75 different exercises to find just a handful of pain free options. We are determined but running out of ideas.


#10

This was on Thib’s personal website

10 THINGS I LEARNED FROM SOME OF TODAY’S BEST EXPERTS

Articles / 28 June, 2017 /
By Christian Thibaudeau

Squatting pattern

Low bar back squat

High bar back squat

Front squat

Frankenstein squat

Goblet squat

Lumberjack squat

High box squat

Low box squat

High box front squat

Low box front squat

Safety bar squat

Safety bar box squat

Dumbbell squat (DBs by your side)

Dumbbell squat (DBs on your shoulders)

Overhead squat

Overhead squat with dumbbells

Trap bar squat (like a deadlift but with more of a squat pattern instead of a hinge)

Barbell hack squat

And of course, these can be done with various stances.

Hip hinge pattern

KB swing

Romanian deadlift

Romanian deadlift with dumbbells

Goodmorning

Goodmorning from pins

Conventional deadlift (note that the Sumo deadlift is more of an hybrid that a true hip hinge)

Power clean (hang, floor, blocks)

Power snatch (hang, floor, blocks)

Single-leg RDL with one dumbbell

Single-leg RDL with two dumbbells

Single-leg RDL with a barbell

Single-leg goodmorning with a barbell

Suitcase deadlift with barbell

Suitcase deadlift with dumbbell

Deadlift from pins

Etc.

Pressing pattern (horizontal)

Bench press

DB bench press pronated

DB bench press neutral grip

Close-grip bench press

Reverse-grip bench press

Low incline (15-30 degrees) bench press

Low incline close-grip bench press

Low-incline DB press pronated

Low-incline DB press neutral

Floor press

Bench press from pins (various positions)

Close-grip bench press from pins (various positions)

Trap bar bench press

Trap bar floor press

Football/Swiss bar bench press

Football/Swiss bar floor press

Football/Swiss bar from pins (various positions)

Decline bench press

Decline close-grip bench press

Decline DB press pronated

Decline DB press neutral grip

Board press (1. 2. 3, 4 boards)

Close-grip board press (1,2,3,4 boards)

Etc.

Pressing (vertical)

Military press

High incline (45-75 degrees) press

Behind the neck press

Standing DB press pronated grip

Standing DB press neutral grip

Standing single arm DB press pronated

Standing single arm DB press neutral

Standing see-saw DB press (alternating arms)

Push press

Seated shoulder press

Seated DB shoulder press pronated grip

Seated DB shoulder press neutral grip

Seated single arm DB press pronated

Seated single arm DB press neutral

Seated see-saw DB press (alternating arms)

Half-kneeling single arm DB press pronated

Half-kneeling single arm DB press neutral

Z-press (barbell overhead press, seated on the floor with extended legs)

Dumbbell Z-press pronated

Dumbbell Z-press neutral

Dumbbell single-arm Z-press pronated

Dumbbell single-arm Z-press neutral

Dumbbell see-saw Z-press

Strip the rack shoulder press

Strip the rack reverse grip shoulder press

Strip the rack behind the neck press

Strip the rack Z-press

Trap bar shoulder press

Shoulder press from pins (various positions)

Pulling (horizontal)

Bent over barbell row pronated

Bent over barbell row supinated

Bent over football/Swiss bar row

Bent over DB row pronated

Bent over DB row supinated

Bent over DB row neutral grip

Bent over single-arm DB row pronated

Bent over single-arm DB row supinated

Bent over single-arm DB row neutral

Bent over see-saw DB row

Knee on bench single-arm row (lawnmower) pronated

Knee on bench single-arm row (lawnmower) supinated

Knee on bench single-arm row (lawnmower) neutral

Seal row pronated

Seal row supinated

Seal row neutral grip

DB incline chest supported row pronated

DB incline chest supported row supinated

DB incline chest supported row neutral

Seated cable row pronated

Seated cable row supinated

Seated cable row neutral grip

Low pulley bent over row pronated

Low pulley bent over row supinated

Low pulley bent over row neutral grip

Horizontal row/fat man pull-ups

Ring/TRX row

Etc.

Pulling (vertical)

Active hang pronated

Active hang supinated

Active hang neutral

Active hang rings

Pull-up supinated

Pull-up pronated

Pull-up neutral

Eccentric-only pull-up supinated

Eccentric-only pull-up pronated

Eccentric-only pull-up neutral

Lat pulldown in front pronated (wide, medium, narrow grip)

Lat pulldown in front supinated (shoulder width, narrow grip)

Lat pulldown in front neutral grip (wide, medium, narrow grip)

Lat pulldown behind the neck pronated (wide, medium grip)

Lat pulldown behind the neck neutral (wide grip)

Single-arm lat pulldown neutral grip

Single-arm lat pulldown supinated grip

Etc.

Lunging/single leg pattern

Dumbbell split squat

Barbell split squat

Front rack barbell split squat

Single dumbbell split squat

Overhead split squat

Dumbbell overhead split squat

Single dumbbell overhead split squat

Dumbbell split squat back foot elevated

Barbell split squat back foot elevated

Front rack barbell split squat back foot elevated

Single dumbbell split squat back foot elevated

Overhead split squat back foot elevated

Dumbbell overhead split squat back foot elevated

Single dumbbell overhead split squat back foot elevated

Dumbbell split squat front foot elevated

Barbell split squat front foot elevated

Front rack barbell split squat front foot elevated

Single dumbbell split squat front foot elevated

Overhead split squat front foot elevated

Dumbbell overhead split squat front foot elevated

Single dumbbell overhead split squat front foot elevated

Dumbbell dynamic forward lunges

Barbell dynamic forward lunges

Front rack barbell dynamic forward lunges

Trap back dynamic forward lunges

Dumbbell dynamic reverse lunges

Barbell dynamic reverse lunges

Front rack barbell dynamic reverse lunges

Trap back dynamic reverse lunges

Dumbbell forward walking lunges

Barbell forward walking lunges

Front rack barbell forward walking lunges

Trap back forward walking lunges

Dumbbell backwards walking lunges

Barbell backwards walking lunges

Front rack barbell backwards walking lunges

Trap back backwards walking lunges

Overhead barbell forward walking lunges

Overhead dumbbell forward walking lunges

Overhead barbell backwards walking lunges

Overhead dumbbell backwards walking lunges

Dumbbell Step-up (front)

Single DB step-up (front

Barbell Step-up (front)

Front rack barbell step-up (front)

Dumbbell Step-up (sideways)

Single DB step-up (sideways)

Barbell Step-up (sideways)

Front rack barbell step-up (sideways)

Reverse-Froward lunges combo

Carrying pattern

Dumbbell farmer’s walk

Trap bar famer’s walk

Farmer’s walk with specific implements

Single dumbbell farmer’s walk

Single farmer implements farmer’s walk

Overhead barbell walk

Overhead dumbbell walk

Single arm overhead dumbbell walk

Searcher carry walk (barbell)

Zecher carry walk (log)

searcher carry walk (sandbag)

Etc.


#11

Sorry, not doing that. My plate is already full as it is. Maybe one day I’ll write an article about it. I feel like with the list I provided I did a pretty good job at answering your question.


#12

This is exactly what I meant when I asked, “Is there a more comprehensive list of exercises out there somewhere for all movement patterns?”

I read CT’s blog weekly. Don’t know how I missed this. Thank you very much, j4gga2!


#13

You already did it, Christian. I just didn’t know where to find it. By the way, really enjoying Athlete Lean, Athlete Strong. It fits my neruo type perfectly. I’m so stoked after training, I feel like I can crush anything. Love it! Having a hard time not adding sled work and hill sprints. You rock! Thanks again for all you do!:muscle:


#14

So should I do all of these in one workout? :grin:


#15

No, it’s a list of movement patterns that you should include in your program to prevent muscle imbalenses and be strong all over.


#16

He was being sarcastic


#17

Is there a list with a more comprehensive set of exercises? This is a good start though, thanks :joy:


#18

Hopefully, I mean Thibs did forget the duck-footed snatch grip fat bar deadlift from deficit. But what can you do? @Lonnie123


#19

Working on it…:wink: