T Nation

Repeating the Same Cycle on Deadlifts

I made a mistake today on my deadlifts with the form on the final working set (The 1RM). I was looking down and did not push my chest up, so my lower back rounded although the rest of my setup was good. I usually have a visual cue but I was in another gym and forgot. Looking at my videos, this was a one off.

Should I repeat the cycle? And are there any negative implications long term (lets say if this happens again and i need to work on form)?

I am not lifting that much at the moment, my 1RM lift today was the 142.5kg Deadlift , I just really want to get to 4 plates.

One bad rep isn’t going doesn’t negate all the hard work you put in for the first 3 weeks. Assuming this really is a one-time thing, I wouldn’t worry about it. If ever there was a time for your form to go out the window, it would be halfway through a 1RM. (Not saying your form SHOULD disappear when you go heavy, but if you’re truly maxing out, it’s understandable if you mess up a little bit.) As long as you got all your reps for this deadlift cycle, I’d say just increase your TM by 10lbs and start a new cycle.

What part of the 5/3/1 program were you doing exactly? Rarely is there a 1RM lift unless its just something extra you add which wouldn’t matter if you got it cleanly or failed miserably.

Week 3, set 3. https://www.t-nation.com/workouts/531-how-to-build-pure-strength

Here is my form check video for reference. Is it worth revisiting this weight or moving on to the next weight?

It’s not a 1rm it’s 95% of your TM max for a 1+ PR set.

Your training max should be no more than 90% so it’s actually an 85% set.

Think you need to read the book

Yeah, that is what I did, the 95% of the TM max.

I’m on boring but big so I did not push out any more than 1 rep.

Move on,don’t be a slave to perfect form.
The longer you lift and the stronger you get , this will happen.
Eventually you will reset and probably repeat this weight or close to it.
When that happens, get your mind right and crush it.

1 Like

Look, it could have been prettier but it wasn’t awful and your bar speed was reasonable. Increase your TM, practice staying tight (do your core work), keep doing your mobility work and you’ll be fine.

I would also say it is worth getting your set up right. Bending over and wasting time/energy fidgeting and shaking your ass like you’re trying to attract a mate is not going to do you any favours when you’ve worked your way up to 242.5kg on the bar.

Read the whole article bro. Good on ya for going heavy but your not actually following the program you linked to which is 531.
If the weight you pulled is a true 1 RM for you then you need to multiply 142.5 x .85 = Training Max ™
This will give you your training max. So next time you get to “week 3 set 3” then at that point you will be lifting 95% of your TM which would be about 115KG. You should be able to smash that set!

If 142.5 is not a true 1RM for you then I suggest finding your 4RM and using that for your TM.

If you understand what 531 is. You are using 95% of your training max (85-90% of your 1RM). Then quit worrying about it and work harder. If that set was correct you should have gone for at LEAST 3 reps if not 5. 5+ 3+ 1+ means go balls out! You’re not in danger of really hurting yourself until you get to a minimum of double body weight… Your form is fine, you need more effort to get to 4 plates

I don’t think that is right. I calculated based on 90% of my 1rm when I started as Wendler advises, this was a while back.
"You aren’t just picking a weight to lift five times or three times or one time per set. You’re using a specific percentage of your one-rep max. And not your full 1RM. The calculations are based on 90% of it.

So if your 1RM in the bench press is 315 pounds, you use 285 (90%) as the base number for your training-weight calculations. "

I wanted to start light so that I can use the programme longer term and get used to it. When I started I was lifting 5 reps of 120kg on the week 1 cycle. I can’t remember what the 90% calculation of my 1rm was that I used to calculate the cycles, the spreadsheet pretty much did it for me.

I could lift 6 reps of 140kg before the programme, that will take me 3 months to get back to, but for me it is worth it as I have been working a lot on form when I have the time. My 1rm was a conservative estimate, my real 1rm would be 165kg given that I could do 140kg for 6 reps. Going lighter has felt beneficial for me personally.
Also, the boring but big way of approaching hypertrophy has been a lot better for me in terms of simplicity.

When I started a while back the first cycle or two felt pretty easy because I was lifting less than I normally would. I am going to stick at this programme for the mid-long term so I don’t view all the form work and starting lighter as wasted time.

Good deal. Then what I said as the 3rd “if” is the advice I would give. On your 5+, 3+ and 1+ sets push them harder. Especially on your 1+ sets, crank out as many as possible

1 Like

I noticed 2 things in the video:

  1. You’re starting the lift in a dynamic fashion, as opposed to a static fashion.

  2. You started the lift with your chest parallel to the floor.

I don’t think either of these is necessarily a bad thing. Everyone has their own style and their own unique form that works for them. Eddie Hall (deadlift world record holder) plays with the bar a little by rolling it back and forth before he begins his lift. If you continue practicing this style, it will work for you. Overall, this is not really an issue, but it does tie into my next point.

Starting with your chest parallel to the floor isn’t inherently dangerous. However, it appears that your legs are stronger than your back (as is the case with 99.99% of humans). When combining a chest that is parallel to the floor with a back that can’t adequately compensate for that starting position, it leads to a rounding of the lower back which actually can be dangerous if you start lifting enough weight. You know, herniated discs and all that.

Now, my advice:

For now, I would focus on trying to sink your hips and keep your chest up. Be proud of the chest you’re building in the gym and show that thing off! In all seriousness though, sinking your hips and keeping your chest up puts your back in a much safer and stronger position to begin your deadlift.

One good cue that I’ve heard from Layne Norton is “wrap the bar around your shins.” This will do two things for you: first, it will help you show even more of your chest. Second, it will engage your rear delts, lats, scaps, and traps. This is crucial to keeping a neutral (safe) spine position.

The first time I deadlifted using this cue, my upper back was incredibly sore the next day, which is proof that it works in engaging the upper back muscles. My final tip is this: start from a static position. No, I’m not purposely contradicting myself, but as Jim states in his original 5/3/1 article, the point of 5/3/1 is to take 2 steps back, and 10 steps forward. It’s easier to focus on perfecting your form with a more simple set up.

You’re lifting a good amount of weight, man. You’re doing the right thing by coming to the forums for advice. Good luck on your deadlifting!

1 Like

I think the programme has been excellent, I have been eating more and while there is a little fat, I have just accepted that I needed to eat more than I have been in order to add mass, I have definitely added more muscle. It can be a tough programme if you don’t eat enough.

My end goal is to be stronger, have great conditioning (this needs more work) and to have a more powerful physique. So far I have been happier with the programme than a classic bodybuilding split.