T Nation

Recovery from Illness

#1

I won't go into too much detail but I'm a college athlete who plays a serious contact sport for one of the best teams in the country, HOWEVER this sport does not require drug tests. I wouldn't even be here if I hadn't had a near lethal illness which knocked me out of strength training for months and caused me to lose 25 lbs, and it wasn't all fat. A month ago I fell into the category of people who just believed what they were told about steroids. I had no understanding of steroids other than my nuts would supposedly turn into raisins, my dick would fall off, my skin would turn purple etc. After researching steroids I decided it was an acceptably low risk that I would take in order to get back to where I was athletically a half year ago. I was wondering about what cycle would be good for functional mass and strength after I spend several months preparing my body physically for the cycle. I heard that a form of testosterone, such as Sustanon, should always form the base of your cycle. I also discovered that test will shut you down quicker than a light switch. I was thinking about an 8 week D-bol 20 or 30 mg + anavar + proviron and nolvadex, followed by nolva, clomid, proviron and arimidex PCT. I'm a 6' male currently sitting around 175 lbs. What do you guys think?

#2

[quote]Rugger27 wrote:
I won’t go into too much detail but I’m a college athlete who plays a serious contact sport for one of the best teams in the country, HOWEVER this sport does not require drug tests. I wouldn’t even be here if I hadn’t had a near lethal illness which knocked me out of strength training for months and caused me to lose 25 lbs, and it wasn’t all fat. A month ago I fell into the category of people who just believed what they were told about steroids. I had no understanding of steroids other than my nuts would supposedly turn into raisins, my dick would fall off, my skin would turn purple etc. After researching steroids I decided it was an acceptably low risk that I would take in order to get back to where I was athletically a half year ago. I was wondering about what cycle would be good for functional mass and strength after I spend several months preparing my body physically for the cycle. I heard that a form of testosterone, such as Sustanon, should always form the base of your cycle. I also discovered that test will shut you down quicker than a light switch. I was thinking about an 8 week D-bol 20 or 30 mg + anavar + proviron and nolvadex, followed by nolva, clomid, proviron and arimidex PCT. I’m a 6’ male currently sitting around 175 lbs. What do you guys think? [/quote]

Not necessarily in any order

#3

[quote]Rugger27 wrote:
I won’t go into too much detail but I’m a college athlete who plays a serious contact sport for one of the best teams in the country, HOWEVER this sport does not require drug tests. I wouldn’t even be here if I hadn’t had a near lethal illness which knocked me out of strength training for months and caused me to lose 25 lbs, and it wasn’t all fat. A month ago I fell into the category of people who just believed what they were told about steroids. I had no understanding of steroids other than my nuts would supposedly turn into raisins, my dick would fall off, my skin would turn purple etc. After researching steroids I decided it was an acceptably low risk that I would take in order to get back to where I was athletically a half year ago. I was wondering about what cycle would be good for functional mass and strength after I spend several months preparing my body physically for the cycle. I heard that a form of testosterone, such as Sustanon, should always form the base of your cycle. I also discovered that test will shut you down quicker than a light switch. I was thinking about an 8 week D-bol 20 or 30 mg + anavar + proviron and nolvadex, followed by nolva, clomid, proviron and arimidex PCT. I’m a 6’ male currently sitting around 175 lbs. What do you guys think? [/quote]

Right, first off, I’m a new guy around here, so if I say anything thats not correct let the older guys tell me I’m wrong.

However I will offer some advice. First thing, do you really want to run two orals at the same same time? These will probably do some serious damage to your liver. Secondly the time frame for these, might make that liver damage ever worse. I would also say that you only need one steroid simply because your body has never seen them before, therefore smaller amount may give you a pretty good effect. Nolva on cycle is probably a good idea but I don’t know what to feedback on this - some more experienced users should comment on this.

You also don’t make it clear how much anavar, you would be taking a day, or the amount of anti-estrogen a day, if its every other day or something else. you don’t mention dosage or anything.

The above is pretty much the most I can say, because if I say more I’m likely to actually step out of my league here.

#4

[quote]Gcortese wrote:

[quote]Rugger27 wrote:
I won’t go into too much detail but I’m a college athlete who plays a serious contact sport for one of the best teams in the country, HOWEVER this sport does not require drug tests. I wouldn’t even be here if I hadn’t had a near lethal illness which knocked me out of strength training for months and caused me to lose 25 lbs, and it wasn’t all fat. A month ago I fell into the category of people who just believed what they were told about steroids. I had no understanding of steroids other than my nuts would supposedly turn into raisins, my dick would fall off, my skin would turn purple etc. After researching steroids I decided it was an acceptably low risk that I would take in order to get back to where I was athletically a half year ago. I was wondering about what cycle would be good for functional mass and strength after I spend several months preparing my body physically for the cycle. I heard that a form of testosterone, such as Sustanon, should always form the base of your cycle. I also discovered that test will shut you down quicker than a light switch. I was thinking about an 8 week D-bol 20 or 30 mg + anavar + proviron and nolvadex, followed by nolva, clomid, proviron and arimidex PCT. I’m a 6’ male currently sitting around 175 lbs. What do you guys think? [/quote]

Right, first off, I’m a new guy around here, so if I say anything thats not correct let the older guys tell me I’m wrong.

However I will offer some advice. First thing, do you really want to run two orals at the same same time? These will probably do some serious damage to your liver. Secondly the time frame for these, might make that liver damage ever worse. I would also say that you only need one steroid simply because your body has never seen them before, therefore smaller amount may give you a pretty good effect. Nolva on cycle is probably a good idea but I don’t know what to feedback on this - some more experienced users should comment on this.

You also don’t make it clear how much anavar, you would be taking a day, or the amount of anti-estrogen a day, if its every other day or something else. you don’t mention dosage or anything.

The above is pretty much the most I can say, because if I say more I’m likely to actually step out of my league here.
[/quote]

just curious what would be the purpose of nolva on cycle?

#5

@ RoidNoid

Like I said I’m not 100% sure, but I was just thinking along the lines of, potentially he may be gyno prone, so nolva could help on cycle rather than be reactive he could be proactive, that was my thinking.

Are you implying I’m wrong? Because if so please tell me why, I assume nolva might slow down or lesser his on cycle gains?

#6

[quote]Gcortese wrote:
@ RoidNoid

Like I said I’m not 100% sure, but I was just thinking along the lines of, potentially he may be gyno prone, so nolva could help on cycle rather than be reactive he could be proactive, that was my thinking.

Are you implying I’m wrong? Because if so please tell me why, I assume nolva might slow down or lesser his on cycle gains?[/quote]

SERM’s are not used on cycle because they actually increase estrogen circulating in the blood stream. They prohibit it from acting at the breast tissue and other preferential tissue, but do not block it elsewhere in the body so those tissues are being bombarded by the excess estrogen.

It is therefore better to eliminate the problem entirely, which an AI does by lowering the actual estrogen in the body.

SERMs do have a place as an emergency (Break Glass If Needed) if gyno symptoms appear since there may be a lag between taking an AI and subsequently reducing the estrogen–the SERM seems to be quicker in that regard.

#7

[quote]Gcortese wrote:
@ RoidNoid

Like I said I’m not 100% sure, but I was just thinking along the lines of, potentially he may be gyno prone, so nolva could help on cycle rather than be reactive he could be proactive, that was my thinking.

Are you implying I’m wrong? Because if so please tell me why, I assume nolva might slow down or lesser his on cycle gains?[/quote]

Nolva blocks estrogen from binding to breast tissue yes but doesnt do anything for estrogen, from what ive read it actually increases it and allows it to effect other parts of the body. I would only run nolva in the event gyno will not go away with an AI such as adex, aromason, or letro, in that order. I think I have read that 1mg/d adex will drop estro 50%, aromasin is in the 70’s and letro is something like 90%. Dont quote me on those numbers but they should be close, in any event to prevent gyno on cycle you run an aromatase inhibitor. Nolva is generally ran in PCT

#8

[quote]VTBalla34 wrote:

[quote]Gcortese wrote:
@ RoidNoid

Like I said I’m not 100% sure, but I was just thinking along the lines of, potentially he may be gyno prone, so nolva could help on cycle rather than be reactive he could be proactive, that was my thinking.

Are you implying I’m wrong? Because if so please tell me why, I assume nolva might slow down or lesser his on cycle gains?[/quote]

SERM’s are not used on cycle because they actually increase estrogen circulating in the blood stream. They prohibit it from acting at the breast tissue and other preferential tissue, but do not block it elsewhere in the body so those tissues are being bombarded by the excess estrogen.

It is therefore better to eliminate the problem entirely, which an AI does by lowering the actual estrogen in the body.

SERMs do have a place as an emergency (Break Glass If Needed) if gyno symptoms appear since there may be a lag between taking an AI and subsequently reducing the estrogen–the SERM seems to be quicker in that regard.[/quote]

you beat me to it! good info!

#9

@ Roid Noid and VtBall thanks for the information.

#10

Just use a form of test and d-bol. If your looking to add some size back to you you cant go wrong d-bol. Stay away from the anavar at 30mg that will just be a waste of your money for what you will get out of it. AI on cycle and SERM PCT to finish is all you need. don’t over complicate it simple is better. I would go longer than 8 weeks of test unless your going to use prop. 10 weeks is better but thats for longer esters in my oppinion.

#11

From the research I did Dbol is liver toxic while anavar has extremely low liver toxicity. Sounds like adding an aromatase inhibitor is recommended highly, I’ll go with arimidex because aromasin sounds pretty strong, like its for preventing estrogen in advanced cycles and letro sounds like its a cure more than a prevention. But, am I good to go with a 30mg Dianabol and 30mg anavar cycle for 8 weeks? And does my PCT regimen sound good?

#12

[quote]Rugger27 wrote:
From the research I did Dbol is liver toxic while anavar has extremely low liver toxicity. Sounds like adding an aromatase inhibitor is recommended highly, I’ll go with arimidex because aromasin sounds pretty strong, like its for preventing estrogen in advanced cycles and letro sounds like its a cure more than a prevention. But, am I good to go with a 30mg Dianabol and 30mg anavar cycle for 8 weeks? And does my PCT regimen sound good? [/quote]

NO! Do some of your own research! VTBalla gave you some T-Nation links to read, go read them and come back with a cycle that looks like you did some research!

#13

[quote]Rugger27 wrote:
I won’t go into too much detail but I’m a college athlete who plays a serious contact sport for one of the best teams in the country, HOWEVER this sport does not require drug tests. I wouldn’t even be here if I hadn’t had a near lethal illness which knocked me out of strength training for months and caused me to lose 25 lbs, and it wasn’t all fat. A month ago I fell into the category of people who just believed what they were told about steroids. I had no understanding of steroids other than my nuts would supposedly turn into raisins, my dick would fall off, my skin would turn purple etc. After researching steroids I decided it was an acceptably low risk that I would take in order to get back to where I was athletically a half year ago. I was wondering about what cycle would be good for functional mass and strength after I spend several months preparing my body physically for the cycle. I heard that a form of testosterone, such as Sustanon, should always form the base of your cycle. I also discovered that test will shut you down quicker than a light switch. I was thinking about an 8 week D-bol 20 or 30 mg + anavar + proviron and nolvadex, followed by nolva, clomid, proviron and arimidex PCT. I’m a 6’ male currently sitting around 175 lbs. What do you guys think? [/quote]

I’m assuming by your username that you also play rugby. I’ve run multiple cycles both in and off-season, and think I can provide a little guidance.

I’m also assuming this is your first cycle. I suggest you keep it simple and use just the test and var. My first cycle ever (playing college rugby at the time) was test e 500/wk and winstrol for the last 4 (IIRC) weeks. The winny was hell on my joints especially during contact drills. I also was not in peak condition and hence my back pumps got pretty bad until my aerobic & anaerobic capacities were built up again. I cannot advise regarding the proviron as I’ve never used it. And the rapid weight gain associated with dbol might not as advantageous as the strength gains associated with var.

In regards to your pct, read the stickies and links already provided to you.

Good luck.