Ready For First Cycle? (Test C, Bloodwork, TRT, Lots Of Research, Lots Of Details)

Sounds to me like you need to still figure out your diet. Sounds like you do one extreme or the other. Or potentially training and diet. I don’t know your coach, but anyone can call themselves a body building coach and still lack some knowledge in certain areas. Without knowing the macros he suggested to you, and the training, it’s hard to really say. 18% BF isn’t awful for trying to aggressively add size. For a hard gainer, your carbs look much too low, IMO.

I would try to figure these things out before running a cycle. If you don’t, what’s to say after your cycle if you try to cut, you won’t lose all the muscle you gained on cycle?

Other than stopping my cut and resuming maintenance calories + bulking without a cycle for a few months, does anyone else have something to add?

My maintenance calories are roughly 2800 - 180g Protein, 300g Carbs, 100g Fat. This will obviously change if I try Keto.

It is also possible that the DexaScan was off, and my muscle loss was minimal. Or that the muscle loss was mainly glycogen stores and water weight.

Any other comments, advice, concerns, etc.?

Would I start injecting 200mg per dose all at once, or taper up? Does it really matter either way?

why do you want to try keto? pick something and stick with it for a few months, do you want to gain? if so increase cals when your weight stops moving up, if you want to lose weight then decrease cals when your weight stops decreasing. my macros are 220g protein, 265g carbs and 55g fats and I am prepping for a show for reference, I think you need more carbs.

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I was down to 158.8 Pounds as of yesterday. I am trying to get as lean as possible before going back to maintenance calories / lean bulking. I estimate I am still 15%ish BF or so (slight ab definition when flexing / holding stomach in - I have a slightly defined 4 pack and a slight amount of fat where I think final 2 abs are at, just above groin).

I want to try Keto because apparently it helps people get super lean. I am still researching it, and wouldn’t start it until Feb or March. If I could drop the final 1-3 or so pounds of fat on my stomach, I would be set.

I WON’T run my first cycle until I decide if Keto is right for me or not, AND until I am at least back at maintenance calories. I want to lean out fully first. I estimate I will be cycle ready in April or May 2020, but I realize it might take a bit longer than that.

I don’t think you can be 15% bodyfat at that weight and height, I think you must just be skinny. Can you upload a picture? trim it si we don’t see your face. Joe Delaney recently put up a video on what to do if you’re skinny fat, give it a watch.

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Why on the world are you cutting?! You’re 158lbs and 5’11, if you can’t see your abs, then you have very little muscle to begin with and cutting is not going to help you. 158 and 5’11 isn’t good. You think you’ll be happy at 5’11 and 150?

Put on muscle, more muscle = higher TDEE = more calories burned.

Sounds like you don’t stick with anything long enough.

Please post a photo. I can’t wrap my head around your stats. Not in a bad way at all, it will honestly help us have an idea of how to help you.


Firstly, you shouldn’t run a cycle at 5’11’’ and 160 pounds. I was that weight before I even set foot in the gym and I’m an inch shorter. Let your TRT work, get your diet in check, and build muscle naturally.

Second, if you are going to cycle, don’t do keto! You want to get the most out of your first cycle. Keto is far from ideal for building muscle.

You just got your TRT dose figured out last month. Stop messing around and have patience. I know you want your Hollywood dream body tomorrow, but you will never get there if you keep changing your mind every minute.

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Lastly, you’re a self proclaimed ectomorph. You NEED carbs to grow. Keto is the dumbest thing you could possibly do. You need to EAT, not diet.

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I figured out how to upload the Dexa Scan to my first post - that has been completed. I will upload a few Pictures in a few hours after I get home from work.

The bodybuilding coach (I chose not to renew his services effective Jan 1st) said that the #'s on the Dexa Scan were for sure off, and that there is no way I lost that much muscle. IDK who is right.

You can gain 20lbs minimum of muscle the first year of TRT alone. You won’t even be recognizable. The more muscle you gain the more calories you burn naturally and the easier it’ll get to lean up.


That’s tough, but yes, I do believe your dexa scan could be accurate. Depending on the intensity of your workouts, duration of workouts, cardio, sleep/recovery, and given your macros you listed, I for one would lose a good amount of muscle in 8 weeks if I did that.

“Cutting” is very difficult to do “properly” and with minimal muscle loss.

Listen, everything takes time. Switching from bulking to cutting every 8 weeks is not effective. Stick with a healthy diet, good workout routine; and enough calories, and you’ll build muscle and lose some fat.


@liverpool_96 @aaronca

Added body pictures to first post. Basically it sounds like the BB coach lowered calories too much. Idk what to do at this point - basically feel like I wasted the last 6-8+ months of effort spent bulking for nothing and now I need to redo diet and workout routine completely.

That’s just would I would suspect given what information I have seen. How long did you bulk for and what were your macros during your bulk?

It’s never a waste though man, you’re learning your body! Once you get things keyed in, it gets better. It’s still a long process though! 6 months isn’t much in the grand scheme, don’t get down on yourself.

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thank you, you don’t need to cut. you need to lift weights and eat at maintenance at a minimum. that video I suggested really does apply to you. best of luck!


Increase food intake. Get sleep. Increase the frequency in which you hit each muscle group, but do not over do the exercises or sets, keep volume lower per workout.

Good luck man, you’ve got plenty of natural potential left! 1 year or serious weight lifting is nothing. You’re more muscular and bigger than I was when I was 1 year into lifting.


As already stated, eat more, train less.

Get in 400g+ of carbs per day, forget about protein (you’re getting enough), do push/pull/legs split or total body training 3 days a week. Come back in a year or so once you’ve gained 20lbs at TRT dose and then think about a cycle.

Well done on the research and detailed first post.




Do you mean This Video? If so, then he recommends CUTTING for skinny fat people. Or are you saying that I am just skinny (not skinny fat)? I feel my body fat is still too high, mainly on my stomach/abdomen. It’s possible I just have some body dysmorphia as well…


I bulked from February 2019 until October 2019 (6-7 months), with a 1 month break in July 2019 while I was backpacking in Peru. I did Dexa Scans every 2 months during 2019. I had the Bodybuilding Coach from September 2019 to December 2019.

My average macros were about 200g Protein, 300g Carb, 100g Fat - maintenance calories are about 3000 or so. I had chefs and/or meal delivery services from October 2018 until October 2019 or so, when I realized it wasn’t worth the money and suspected that macros weren’t accurate. I have been cooking and weighing my own food since October 2019.

I was up to 175 Pounds or so (and 18.5% Body Fat based on a Dexa Scan) when I started the cut in November 2019.

Should I do a 3 day (Push, Pull, Legs) or a 4 day (Upper, Lower, Upper, Lower) split? Do you recommend any physique bodybuilding programs? Doing a 5-6 day weekly split, one muscle group a day is probably not super effective for me.

Damn… the common thread sounds like I am being extremely impatient. I should be thankful how far I’ve come in just one year. Damn perfectionist complex…

How long have you been lifting for?


At my bulking peak (From September 2019 to October 2019) with the Bodybuilding Coach, he had my macros up to 230g Protein, 400g Carbs, 120g Fat (roughly 3600 calories). I got up to 175 Pounds, and added 2.5 Pounds of Muscle and 5 Pounds of fat roughly during that 8 week period.

I am planning to lower protein to 180g a day and starting to reverse diet my carbs + fats back up from the deep deficit I am currently in.

Should I do a 3 day (Push, Pull, Legs) or a 4 day (Upper, Lower, Upper, Lower) split? Do you recommend any physique bodybuilding programs? Doing a 5-6 day weekly split, one muscle group a day is probably not super effective for me.

Thank you - I still plan to cycle, but it sounds like I should be patient for another year or so, depending on progress.

Thank you everyone for your replies and advice!

I’ve been lifting 5-6 days a week religiously for just shy of 10 years. Picture below was maybe 6 months into doing P90x, so I was leaner than when I had started, had a nice, soft, gut but skinny everywhere else. I did everything wrong for almost 2 years without much progress. The right photo was roughly 4 years into lifting, maybe 5? Entirely natural, nothing but OTC protein, creatine, etc.

You can achieve a good amount naturally. Then resort to AAS.

You seem dedicated, well researched, and ready to do this. You’re still very early into your lifting life. You still haven’t figured out what kind of diet AND training work for YOU. I’ve done so many programs, so many different training philosophies, and still change it up as I’m not sure which ones certainly work better for me than others.


correct, that’s the video. I do believe you are just skinny, especially with your stats and you have veins in your biceps when they are relaxed. you have been given some good advice here, don’t worry about cutting.

This isn’t the norm. You had damn good genetics/insertions to begin with… wait nvm you said 6 months in… that’s normal, esp with something like p90x