Can anyone think of a physiological reason that when coming off 100mg test per week (along with .5mg adex and 900IU hCG) and continuing with ONLY the hCG would result in random, migrating joint pain/muscle ache?
Estrogen issue?
What is the time frame? How long and when did joint issues start?
900iu hCG per week?
Joints can ache sometimes if E is too low. The way the sensations move about suggests that it might a condition with your nerves or CNS.
E should not be low with only hCG.
Why only 0.5mg/week adex with 100mg TRT?
so you were taking 300iu HCG EOD?, .5mg once a week, and 100mg test weekly.
now you are taking 300iu HCG EOD?
MAYBE?? if your t levels completely crashed, then you would have nothing to aromatize to estrogen. Low estrogen = joint pain. Low Test = muscles aches.
what were your blood tests while on the full treatment program, and why did you decide to change?
[quote]KSman wrote:
What is the time frame? How long and when did joint issues start?[/quote]
About 2 weeks. Caught a nasty flu bug 1 month ago, lasted two weeks, the following two weeks (these past two) I’ve had these aches and pains. At the same time, testosterone was removed from my regimen entirely at the request of my fertility doc, to see if my sperm count would bounce back (it was 11 million per mL prior to the introduction of T, less than 1 million after the introduction of T). As I removed T from the equation, I removed anastrozole until I see where my numbers are at on only hCG.
300IU 3x a week, yes.
[quote]
Joints can ache sometimes if E is too low. The way the sensations move about suggests that it might a condition with your nerves or CNS.
E should not be low with only hCG.[/quote]
Agreed, I was wondering if maybe the sudden drop off in serum T levels resulting from dropping the 100mg per week test could cause this issue.
[quote]
Why only 0.5mg/week adex with 100mg TRT?[/quote]
That’s all I needed to keep me at an E2 of 25.
[quote]PureChance wrote:
so you were taking 300iu HCG EOD?, .5mg once a week, and 100mg test weekly.
now you are taking 300iu HCG EOD?[/quote]
Not quite, almost. the .5mg was divided into 2 doses of 0.25mg. 300IU hCG Sunday. 300IU hCG/0.25mg anastrozole/50mg Test-eth Tuesday/Friday.
[quote]
MAYBE?? if your t levels completely crashed, then you would have nothing to aromatize to estrogen. Low estrogen = joint pain. Low Test = muscles aches.[/quote]
Doubt levels would completely crash as hCG is still driving testicular production, but there would obviously be a large drop off in the absence of 100mg of test per week.
My wife and I are trying to get pregnant. Prior to T, my sperm count was an already low 11 million per mL. On T, it dropped to less than 1 million per mL (even with hCG). So the RE we see worked with my T guy and decided until we get pregnant, I will be on hCG only, possibly hMG as well.
[quote]NeelyDan wrote:
About 2 weeks. Caught a nasty flu bug 1 month ago, lasted two weeks, the following two weeks (these past two) I’ve had these aches and pains. At the same time, testosterone was removed from my regimen entirely at the request of my fertility doc, to see if my sperm count would bounce back (it was 11 million per mL prior to the introduction of T, less than 1 million after the introduction of T). As I removed T from the equation, I removed anastrozole until I see where my numbers are at on only hCG.
[/quote]
Have you ruled out a possible infection related to the sickness that caused the joint aches and pains?
[quote]Substance P wrote:
[quote]NeelyDan wrote:
About 2 weeks. Caught a nasty flu bug 1 month ago, lasted two weeks, the following two weeks (these past two) I’ve had these aches and pains. At the same time, testosterone was removed from my regimen entirely at the request of my fertility doc, to see if my sperm count would bounce back (it was 11 million per mL prior to the introduction of T, less than 1 million after the introduction of T). As I removed T from the equation, I removed anastrozole until I see where my numbers are at on only hCG.
[/quote]
Have you ruled out a possible infection related to the sickness that caused the joint aches and pains? [/quote]
I was thinking the same thing, which is why I mentioned the flu. Went to see my GP today, who tested for all kinds of stuff to rule that out. Liver, muscle enzymes, iron, cbc, ana, etc.
Joint pain can be associated with low gh, low thyroid, low cortisol, or low /high estrodial, low serotonin. So these factors should be ruled out as quick as possible. 300 ius HCG may be converting too much to e2 or it could be causing other imbalance in the HPTA to surface as I can see it happen in out patients. I would like to see a full blood work up on CBC, ferrtin, CMP, and full thyroid parameters, with adrenal saliva 24 hour to rule out these potential issues.
[quote]Hardasnails wrote:
Joint pain can be associated with low gh, low thyroid, low cortisol, or low /high estrodial, low serotonin. So these factors should be ruled out as quick as possible. 300 ius HCG may be converting too much to e2 or it could be causing other imbalance in the HPTA to surface as I can see it happen in out patients. I would like to see a full blood work up on CBC, ferrtin, CMP, and full thyroid parameters, with adrenal saliva 24 hour to rule out these potential issues. [/quote]
Getting a canadian doctor to do a full thyroid when your tsh is 1.8 is nearly impossible, sadly. One day I’ll just pay for it myself, I guess.
Yes you can get it from lef or direct labs.com. It may be a good idea for KSMAN to post a sticky where labs can obtained at an econmoical price.
I would look at the natural thyroid support formula that has all the building blocks in it to help nourish the thyroid.
biotic research - thyrostim is a good one
Dr wright now has one out that is really powerful
I would recommend these before armour thyroid.
Sadly lef or directlabs don’t deal with Canadians (as far as I can tell). I can’t find any that do, to tell you the truth. Pathlabs in Australia, but…it’s Australia, lol.
Drive to USA, some Canucks do that.
Huh…how would that work? Would they mail the results to a Canadian address I wonder?
They also email a PDF. You would need to discuss that with them. They also ship other products to Canada.
First, go to labcorp.com and find lab draw stations to see if any of this makes sense.