T Nation

Questions on Beginner Cycle



I am 30 years old, 6 foot 190 lbs-a 13%bf. Been training for 5 years, and decided to do my first cycle. My goal is to put 5-10kg lean mass, and bring my BF down. Been reading a lot, and this is what I have come up with:

Frontload 500mg test-e, and then e4d 250 mg test-e for 8 weeks(1). Then, last 3 weeks use 50mg ED of oral winny(2).

  1. Do you think I should run this cycle 10 weeks instead of 8?
  2. Is winny neccesary? Will I be able to lower my bf in the last weeks just with diet and training?

EDIT: I will use standard nolva/comid PCT 2 weeks after last injection.


What do you consider "standard" nolva/clomid PCT? Just wondering since everyone's idea of "standard" seems to be different.

The amount of test you are running isn't very high, but do you have an AI just in case?

  1. I think you could run this for 10 weeks (250mg T e4d), or even longer, and recover quite well.
  2. I have never used winstrol, so I won't comment and let someone else take that on.

Have you had your test levels checked? At your age, your natural T levels could be high enough that what you are proposing will make very little difference. I use 250mg/week (shot 125mg twice weekly) for T replacement since I was 22. My blood tests come back in the 900-1000 range all the time. If your natural levels are around this, you might not see enough difference. Therefore, you might need to bump it to 250mg e3d to get the full benefit.


Yeah I would say 250mg e3d. I always saw people run winn for 4-6 weeks. Im not sure if 3 weeks of winn would really help much, but like you Icarus, Ive never ran winn personally.


Thanks guys, but if I run 250 e3d it's 615 mg of test a week, isn't that a little too much. Do I really need that much to grow, compared to 450mg/week (e4d)?


Just shoot less at a time.


I can't shoot less, those are ampules, not vials. I can only shoot 250 mg at a time.


I can't shoot less, those are ampules, not vials. I can only shoot 250 mg at a time.


You can leave stuff in the syringe. It's sterile in there and you be using it only a few days later. Change the needle each time and youre fine.


But every 4 days is completely fine as well. I actually do 3.5 days by taking one shot early in the day and the next in the evening/night.


I would like to keep it simple. What about injectiong every monday and thursday. Thats E3.5D at average?

What I awnt to know, is there such a big difference between E3D and E4D, because I would like to keep sides at bay?



There is a 1 day difference. Im not really sure how else you'd like someone to quantify it. No one can predict what differences (if any) you'll experience from 1 extra day between shots. Dont stress about this. If monday/thursday fits for you than do that.