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Questions about HCG and Gyno, Please Help!


#1

hi guys,

so i'm running a test e cycle at 400mg pw atm, this is my first cycle.. i'm just about to finish the second week.

my questions are,

  1. currently i'm using 500ius of hcg pw ( taken in shots of 250ius with my test e shots on mon / thurs) how long should i use each vial for before ditching them? I have another two 5000ius available and i got them because i heard HCG loses potency after 30 days.. but how long would you guys continue to use it after this period?

  2. I think i might be starting to get some gyno, although i'm not 100% sure. I've read heaps of different things on the internet.. can't say they've felt painful, but they look more puffy.. and i'm pretty sure i can feel a lump on both sides but i'm not sure whether its a gland or its gyno.. and since i've been playing with my nips checking frequently i think i've adjitated it so for the brief moment where it felt slightly sore i think it could be due to that..

anyway i've been running arimidex 0.25mg eod since my first injection, i definitely have felt that its been working because my joints have felt a little sore.. so basically i'm just looking for some advice.

should I increase the dose of arimidex? should I start running some nolva? (have 20mg caps) what should i do?

thanks in advance!


#2

1mg anastrozole per week for every 100mg T per week seems to hold for doses we see with TRT guys.

You are taking enough anastrozole to manage 100mg T per week.
That is the problem.

When TRT guys get dry hCG and reconstitute and refrigerate, we see 10,000iu vials lasting 80 days at 250iu SC EOD with no problems.
The expiry dates are not based on knowledge that the product degrades. In any case, the date indicated that the advertised potency is there at 30 days.

"anyway i’ve been running arimidex 0.25mg eod since my first injection, i definitely have felt that its been working because my joints have felt a little sore… so basically i’m just looking for some advice. "
So you stating that your E2 may be high enough to cause gyno but may also be in the single digits [<10pg/ml] because your joints ache.
That is conflicting information. So you can take more anastrozole and see what happens.

You should have been more knowledgeable about these issues before you started.
What are you going to do for PCT? Understand and have items on hand.

Take 20mg Nolvadex per day and note how tissues respond. EOD may also be adequate. Again we have conflicting E2 evidence.

Read this and see if that helps: http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/the_pct_serm_dosing_in_this_forum_is_wrong

There are other things in this forum that you should read.


#3

[quote]KSman wrote:
1mg anastrozole per week for every 100mg T per week seems to hold for doses we see with TRT guys.

You are taking enough anastrozole to manage 100mg T per week.
That is the problem.

When TRT guys get dry hCG and reconstitute and refrigerate, we see 10,000iu vials lasting 80 days at 250iu SC EOD with no problems.
The expiry dates are not based on knowledge that the product degrades. In any case, the date indicated that the advertised potency is there at 30 days.

"anyway i’ve been running arimidex 0.25mg eod since my first injection, i definitely have felt that its been working because my joints have felt a little sore… so basically i’m just looking for some advice. "
So you stating that your E2 may be high enough to cause gyno but may also be in the single digits [<10pg/ml] because your joints ache.
That is conflicting information. So you can take more anastrozole and see what happens.

You should have been more knowledgeable about these issues before you started.
What are you going to do for PCT? Understand and have items on hand.

Take 20mg Nolvadex per day and note how tissues respond. EOD may also be adequate. Again we have conflicting E2 evidence.

Read this and see if that helps: http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/the_pct_serm_dosing_in_this_forum_is_wrong

There are other things in this forum that you should read.
[/quote]

Do you have a ballpark for exemestane dosage ratio? I was definitely an over-responder to anastrozole and to be honest at a cruise of 250mg Test-E a week I take very little, 2.5 mg/day and my E2 was on the lower end for sure after bloodwork. Am I a low metabolizer of Test or does an over-responder to this drug exist too? I feel like others take much more.


#4

Do not have that info. Some take 10mg Aromasin/exemestane EOD. Really need labs if fine tuning.

With 250mg T/week, a normal responder might take 2.5mg/week not 2.5mg/DAY !!!


#5

[quote]KSman wrote:
Do not have that info. Some take 10mg Aromasin/exemestane EOD. Really need labs if fine tuning.

With 250mg T/week, a normal responder might take 2.5mg/week not 2.5mg/DAY !!!

[/quote]

Wow. Glad I asked. I think most guys start out at 12.5mg/day with a 500mg/wk Test cycle so it seemed to me that I was being conservative. I am currently also using the 20mg EOD Nolva based on some of your recent posts. I feel pretty amazing right now. I am letting everything settle in then getting some bloodwork done to fine tune. I know Nolva hasn’t been studied for long term use so I can’t ride that train forever.


#6

Be careful using hCG if you are already experiencing gyno. The testes will produce a little testosterone but will also produce a few other things like progesterone and estrogen. I feel that in high T environments there would be a greater conversion toE2. I would hold off on the hCG until the puffiness and tingling/itchiness goes away. Then try 125 units/wk and see if the nips still recede.

E2 is a sneaky prick. One day its fine and libido is great, the next its out of control. Definitely keep it under control. Use aromasin 12.5mg eod AND arimidex 0.25-0.5 EOD.

good luck.


#7

I experience similar symptoms with hCG and typically inject 250 IU’s once per week. When you say 125 units/wk, you’re referring to IU’s correct? Do you feel that’s enough to keep the testes from going into atrophy?


#8

Yeah IU is always written units because it can cause confusion amongst professionals.

125units/wk will not likely reverse atrophy at 500mg of gear but it will prevent full cessation of testicular activity. The more hCG used, the more T E2 and Progesterone. Which are all fine if you arent already taking a mess of aromatizing drugs and experiencing gyno symtpoms.

It takes a long time to clear E2 and sometimes the cause is missed because the buildup was over a long period. Dbol is a bad one for E2 and I think its important to consider the conversion of everything u take while factoring in your current bodyfat(more fat usually = more T->E2 conversion).