Quads Without Squats

For years, my challenge is to bring up my quads despite the fact that my knees are beaten up.
I squatted for too long through the pain, believing that one couldn’t have impressive quads without squats. Now I know that’s bullshit: a beginner should squat, but if you’re not built for them, go to leg presses before you ruin your hips and knees. I got my biggest quad size with leg presses after ditching the squat. A bodybuilder who wants to stay in shape as long as possible doesn’t need squats.
Insights from BODYBUILDERS please?

Obviously you do things that won’t lead to your lifting career being cut short.

No. You don’t need squats to build a big leg. There are lots of other lifts and lifting techniques that will get you where you want to be.

[quote]TheRealMcKenzie wrote:

Insights from BODYBUILDERS please?[/quote]

First, we must ask ourselves “what is a bodybuilder?”…

[quote]roybot wrote:

[quote]TheRealMcKenzie wrote:

Insights from BODYBUILDERS please?[/quote]

First, we must ask ourselves “what is a bodybuilder?”…[/quote]

I really have to explain that??
Well, a bodybuilder trains for hypertrophy, not for performance.
A bodybuilder just wants to look good naked. Lifting heavy weights is a tool, not a goal.

"It’s funny, because years ago a young man told me: ‘Squats hurt my knees.’ I asked him to demonstrate his squat. He did and I said: “Squats don’t hurt your knees; whatever you are doing there hurts your knees.” "

Courtesy of Coach Dan John: I will just share this with you, part of one of my new books. » Dan John

The squat is a natural movement. If it hurts, you need to fix something, somewhere, in your body.

Truly ground-breaking.

And there we go again! “Dan John says everyone should squat, blablabla”. Bullshit! I agree that every beginner should squat. But not everybody is built for HEAVY squatting (over 300lb). Squat is not more of a natural movement then let’s say upright rows. Still everybody agrees that upright rows could wreck your shouders. Idem for Neck Presses (shoulders), Skull crushers (triceps) etc.
Everybody is built in a different way. Problem is that bodybuilding evolved from weightlifting, a sport for short people. Tall (long limbed) people should not train like short (limbed) people.
I recommend bodybuilders to squat as long as possible, but when it starts hurting, spreading the hips or not producing any more results: ditch it! NO top bodybuilder is still squatting. They did it before to build a foundation, but then proceeded to mainly leg presses.

[quote]TheRealMcKenzie wrote:

[quote]roybot wrote:

[quote]TheRealMcKenzie wrote:

Insights from BODYBUILDERS please?[/quote]

First, we must ask ourselves “what is a bodybuilder?”…[/quote]

I really have to explain that??
Well, a bodybuilder trains for hypertrophy, not for performance.
A bodybuilder just wants to look good naked. Lifting heavy weights is a tool, not a goal.[/quote]

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding/what_is_bodybuilding_to_tnation?id=5225378&pageNo=0

Happy reading and welcome to T-Nation…

I’m not gonna start discussing training philosophy or training for tall/short people with you. I only have this one, well meaning, question:

If this is a bodybuilder only thread why not post it in the bodybuilding forum section?

There you are right: I posted in the wrong section. This is the “deadlift for arms” section.

[quote]TheRealMcKenzie wrote:
And there we go again! “Dan John says everyone should squat, blablabla”. Bullshit! I agree that every beginner should squat. But not everybody is built for HEAVY squatting (over 300lb). Squat is not more of a natural movement then let’s say upright rows. Still everybody agrees that upright rows could wreck your shouders. Idem for Neck Presses (shoulders), Skull crushers (triceps) etc.
Everybody is built in a different way. Problem is that bodybuilding evolved from weightlifting, a sport for short people. Tall (long limbed) people should not train like short (limbed) people.
I recommend bodybuilders to squat as long as possible, but when it starts hurting, spreading the hips or not producing any more results: ditch it! NO top bodybuilder is still squatting. They did it before to build a foundation, but then proceeded to mainly leg presses.[/quote]

Pictures of your impressive quad development?

Don’t be an idiot. The squat is one of the most basic human movement patterns. Part of the development of an infant is the squat position.

About being an idiot:

  1. Nothing natural about a BACK LOADED squat;
  2. In human movement pattern, a full range of motion squat is very rare.
    Sporters with the biggest quads, like track and field sprinters, bike sprinters and short track ice skaters, do NOT perform a full range of motion like a ATG squat.

Search for picture of biker Forstemann’s legs.

Leaving this section now for the bodybuilding section. Useless to discuss with dogmatics of “functional” training, or whatever that may mean.

This is the “off topic” section.

If the general topic of this website is physical exercise and things that relate (such as supplements, rest, nutrition) and so on, then off topic is exactly that. It’s anything that DOESN’T deal with training directly.

Besides: You really think Förstemann doesn’t squat?

Think again. I also doubt he is natural, but then again what do I know?

Good luck in the bodybuilding section.

[quote]Consul wrote:

[quote]TheRealMcKenzie wrote:
And there we go again! “Dan John says everyone should squat, blablabla”. Bullshit! I agree that every beginner should squat. But not everybody is built for HEAVY squatting (over 300lb). Squat is not more of a natural movement then let’s say upright rows. Still everybody agrees that upright rows could wreck your shouders. Idem for Neck Presses (shoulders), Skull crushers (triceps) etc.
Everybody is built in a different way. Problem is that bodybuilding evolved from weightlifting, a sport for short people. Tall (long limbed) people should not train like short (limbed) people.
I recommend bodybuilders to squat as long as possible, but when it starts hurting, spreading the hips or not producing any more results: ditch it! NO top bodybuilder is still squatting. They did it before to build a foundation, but then proceeded to mainly leg presses.[/quote]

Pictures of your impressive quad development?

Don’t be an idiot. The squat is one of the most basic human movement patterns. Part of the development of an infant is the squat position.
[/quote]

How often do you find yourself at the bottom of a deep squat, outside of the gym? Let alone with a heavy weight on top of your spine? Doesn’t seem like an effective way to accomplish most tasks in day-to-day life.

Wait, there are still people who say squats are required to build big legs? That’s stupid.

Leg press, deadlifts, RDLs, lunges, leg extensions, leg curls, hack squats, split squats. All those will hit your legs, plus there variations. Do some sprints, run hills, stairs, those will hit your legs. Im sure there are more lifts I can’t think of this second as well. There is nothing magical about the squat, it is a good lift if done correctly and if you don’t have any health problems that prevent you from doing it (bad knees/back/hips). But like any other lift it isn’t a requirement, and due to leverages it is a better lift for some people compared to others.

That’s like saying barbell benching is required for a big chest. It’s not, and for some people (due to leverages or shoulder issues) it isn’t that great at hitting the chest and might hurt them in the long run if they screw up their shoulders.

[quote]bcingu wrote:

[quote]Consul wrote:

[quote]TheRealMcKenzie wrote:
And there we go again! “Dan John says everyone should squat, blablabla”. Bullshit! I agree that every beginner should squat. But not everybody is built for HEAVY squatting (over 300lb). Squat is not more of a natural movement then let’s say upright rows. Still everybody agrees that upright rows could wreck your shouders. Idem for Neck Presses (shoulders), Skull crushers (triceps) etc.
Everybody is built in a different way. Problem is that bodybuilding evolved from weightlifting, a sport for short people. Tall (long limbed) people should not train like short (limbed) people.
I recommend bodybuilders to squat as long as possible, but when it starts hurting, spreading the hips or not producing any more results: ditch it! NO top bodybuilder is still squatting. They did it before to build a foundation, but then proceeded to mainly leg presses.[/quote]

Pictures of your impressive quad development?

Don’t be an idiot. The squat is one of the most basic human movement patterns. Part of the development of an infant is the squat position.
[/quote]

How often do you find yourself at the bottom of a deep squat, outside of the gym? Let alone with a heavy weight on top of your spine? Doesn’t seem like an effective way to accomplish most tasks in day-to-day life.[/quote]

I’ve never stood up with 400 pounds in my hands outside of a gym, but that doesn’t mean I shouldn’t deadlift.

Be a cyclist

[quote]Consul wrote:

[quote]bcingu wrote:

[quote]Consul wrote:

[quote]TheRealMcKenzie wrote:
And there we go again! “Dan John says everyone should squat, blablabla”. Bullshit! I agree that every beginner should squat. But not everybody is built for HEAVY squatting (over 300lb). Squat is not more of a natural movement then let’s say upright rows. Still everybody agrees that upright rows could wreck your shouders. Idem for Neck Presses (shoulders), Skull crushers (triceps) etc.
Everybody is built in a different way. Problem is that bodybuilding evolved from weightlifting, a sport for short people. Tall (long limbed) people should not train like short (limbed) people.
I recommend bodybuilders to squat as long as possible, but when it starts hurting, spreading the hips or not producing any more results: ditch it! NO top bodybuilder is still squatting. They did it before to build a foundation, but then proceeded to mainly leg presses.[/quote]

Pictures of your impressive quad development?

Don’t be an idiot. The squat is one of the most basic human movement patterns. Part of the development of an infant is the squat position.
[/quote]

How often do you find yourself at the bottom of a deep squat, outside of the gym? Let alone with a heavy weight on top of your spine? Doesn’t seem like an effective way to accomplish most tasks in day-to-day life.[/quote]

I’ve never stood up with 400 pounds in my hands outside of a gym, but that doesn’t mean I shouldn’t deadlift.
[/quote]

Dumb argument.

[quote]TheRealMcKenzie wrote:
And there we go again! “Dan John says everyone should squat, blablabla”. Bullshit! I agree that every beginner should squat. But not everybody is built for HEAVY squatting (over 300lb). Squat is not more of a natural movement then let’s say upright rows. Still everybody agrees that upright rows could wreck your shouders. Idem for Neck Presses (shoulders), Skull crushers (triceps) etc.
Everybody is built in a different way. Problem is that bodybuilding evolved from weightlifting, a sport for short people. Tall (long limbed) people should not train like short (limbed) people.
I recommend bodybuilders to squat as long as possible, but when it starts hurting, spreading the hips or not producing any more results: ditch it! NO top bodybuilder is still squatting. They did it before to build a foundation, but then proceeded to mainly leg presses.[/quote]

Actually, upright rows are a horrendously unnatural movement. They basically impinge your shoulder every time you repeat one. When you go in to see your physical therapist about a shoulder issue, the first thing he does is move your arm into the top of the upright row position to see if there’s an impingement there.

Squatting is a natural movement. We’ve been doing it since we were babies, and for some their form has progressively become worse since they were babies.

But you already knew all of this. You’re only on here to start shit and try and argue or contradict all of the advice you are on here seeking. So just get the fuck out if you aren’t going to be receptive to the advice of people who know more about this shit than you do. You should really just shut your mouth and thank everyone who is kind enough to respond with advice for you.

[quote]DBCooper wrote:
Actually, upright rows are a horrendously unnatural movement. They basically impinge your shoulder every time you repeat one. When you go in to see your physical therapist about a shoulder issue, the first thing he does is move your arm into the top of the upright row position to see if there’s an impingement there.

Squatting is a natural movement. We’ve been doing it since we were babies, and for some their form has progressively become worse since they were babies.

But you already knew all of this. You’re only on here to start shit and try and argue or contradict all of the advice you are on here seeking. So just get the fuck out if you aren’t going to be receptive to the advice of people who know more about this shit than you do. You should really just shut your mouth and thank everyone who is kind enough to respond with advice for you.[/quote]

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