Qs for Trump Supporters

People don’t think it wouldn’t be particularly hard for Trump to pull off the greatest betrayal in modern history?

So wait is he a brilliant mastermind or a stooge?

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These are not legitimate questions. These are liberal media talking points. Ask factual questions and you will get factual answers.

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I think Comey is a man of principle. If there is evidence and it was collected by way of that FISA warrant, I don’t expect it to disappear. I could of course be wrong. The SSCI & HIC investigations could also bear the kind of fruit that brings the whole curtain down. Media frenzies do incite outrage and destroy whole governments – that’s why there’s no free press in an autocracy.

Also, don’t forget that foreign intel has pieces of this puzzle…and, in the case of Finnish intel or the Estonian Information Board, a whole lot to lose.

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No matter how his presidency ends. This needs to be the title of a best selling biography about him.

Tump. Mastermind or Stooge?

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I prefer this one myself:

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I ask, then, that you please help me figure out which of these are just “liberal media talking points” versus legitimate, factual questions. Merely dismissing them as “liberal media talking points” does nothing to help the OP understand the other side, which I think was the point: ask someone who isn’t on Team Liberal to explain these things.

I’m not saying you’re wrong, but would like to review each and ask why these are easy to dismiss. Note that the OP wasn’t necessarily saying that each of these things are inherently good or bad, only asking for a view on each.

The Republicans are working to abolish ObamaCare, correct? There are separate discussions about the ACA on the forums, so this specific point probably can be addressed elsewhere. But I don’t think this is just a “liberal media talking point” - it was/is one of Trump’s biggest talking points throughout the entire campaign.

I have seen this waved off as alarmist hand-wringing, but among my friends who actually work for the FDA, USDA, and CDC this has been discussed as a significant concern. There is substantial feeling in the ranks that findings which may be unfavorable to certain people will be quashed or killed before they see the light of day.

Trump directly stated this in the Fox News GOP debate:

We are going to get rid are of it in almost every form. We’re going to have little tidbits left but we’re going to take a tremendous amount out.”

Again: this is not to say “demolishing the EPA” is a right or wrong policy. But it’s not just a “liberal media talking point” - again, it was a major Trump talking point during his campaign that he would dismantle the EPA. So if that’s a good idea, tell the OP why.

This is not really a disputable fact. That is not to say that the specific list of countries had no merit, but if that is the case, it seems reasonable to ask why , right? This isn’t a just liberal-media talking point (well, it is, but it’s more than just that). Why would Trump include the specific nations that he did, but exclude nations where he has business ties?

“But Obama made that list…” is not an acceptable response to this one, either. Trump is President; he can change things if he wants. Always seems peculiar when people who ripped Obama then fall back on “Hey, Trump is just doing what Obama was doing…”

Plenty of foreign-policy discussion in other threads by people who know this better than me…

Agree, that this one seems a little out there, from what I can tell. But if that’s the case, just say so.

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Well let’s start with one, the repeal of obamacare. First, the idea is not to repeal it without a replacement. It has always been repeal and replace. However, it can be just repealed, because the underlying system still exists. So repealing it without a replacement is possible and would be beneficial to a lot of people, like myself who has seen a 100% increase, actually doubled my insurance costs from 2011 until now. In reality my insurance costs have more than doubled since then. Simultaneously, my coverage has lowered from a $2500 family deductible to $5000. And post deductible my coverage was 90%, then 85% now it’s 80%.
So I am more than happy to see this monstrosity out the door. Further, obamacare, if untouched will simply crush under it’s own weight. So many companies, hospitals and doctors have pulled out, and the costs have become so unbearable, it cannot stand on it’s own. So it has to go.

The replacement is currently under construction. There are many ideas and it is being worked on, what will come out I am not yet certain.

Two things I would like to see is foreign drugs being allowed in country and interstate insurance policies. The former will lower costs significantly if we can over load the supply side of the drug market. And 90% of medical care is drugs. Go to the dr. you walk out with drugs. Go to the hospital you are treated with drugs and sent home with drugs.

The problem isn’t and never has been ‘coverage’ it’s cost. If you address cost everything else will fall into place. If you can afford medical care you don’t need ‘coverage’. So the target has to be addressing cost, as it is the root cause of the whole issue.

Standing on the right side of natural law and inherent democratic rights doesn’t make the patriots?

Wow. I haven’t seen this Marxist-flavored relativism in PWI in some time.

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I actually admire them and I’m so far right on the personal liberty spectrum I’m teetering on anarcho capitalism.

But that’s not the question. From a British perspective they were most certainly not patriotic Brits. They commited treason.

The government they formed and the concepts they founded it on are most certainly awesome, and we are damned lucky to live here vs all other places. I was merely enjoying the semantic wordplay.

I’m not sure about that. No doubt they’re trying, but I don’t think there are many ideas and it seems like they have no idea how they’re going to “replace” it.

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First, there are many on the right who are for full on repeal without a replacement. Many in congress are more in favor of replacement now since their constituents have given them an earful over an out-and-out repeal.

Second, Trump ditched his plan to negotiate Medicare drug prices during his meeting with pharma lobbyists this week. (I know your point was about foreign drugs, but this certainly impacts healthcare costs).

Lastly, regarding buying insurance across state lines, this is worth a read:

But were the British right or wrong in that perspective?

If you think insurance companies are going to drop their rates just because the ACA is repealed, you’ve never worked for an insurance company. While some companies are hurting, others are raking in cash by taking advantage of the holes in the system. I work for a health insurer now and I can tell you we won’t be dropping our rates without the government actively enforcing caps. It’s just not going to happen, if anything you’re more likely to see coverage go down to allow for a lower deductible (you never lower your rates, just pretend you’re giving the consumer more for their money) and I’ll be surprised if that happens before 10 years passes.

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I voted for Trump because I wanted to snub the establishment of both party’s. Had Bernie not been completely screwed my decision would have been harder, but I still would have probably voted for Trump because Men are from Mars and Liberals are from Venus.

On a more serious note, my healthcare is both more expensive and almost completely useless. My deductible has doubled and so have my premiums. I also had to switch doctors.

One thing about Trump that is absolutely true is that he leads and everyone else follows.

Were they “right” to have a monarch? and to not afford us seats in parliment? And to garrison troops in our homes? No.

But from the English perspective they took up arms against their own country. The founding fathers were English citizens/subjects. If we look up the definition of patriot it is vigorously supporting your country. Which they didn’t do.

pa·tri·ot
ˈpātrēət/
noun
1.a person who vigorously supports their country and is prepared to defend it against enemies or detractors.

Thanks for the consideration, and I was just kidding around with the quote thing.

At this point I’ve just pulled back from engaging and will mostly stick to funny word play and goofing off.

On a couple of the Q’s though-

Obamacare (ACA)- Should have never happened in the first place. Now we are not only subject to the rule of law, but codified into that rule of law is an obligation to be subject to corporations and their interests.

As a statistician, I’m sure that you can understand that taking an industry that is built on statistics (insurance) and jumbling up its risk categories is going to have some predictable and expensive consequences. There is no way around the numbers and Obama&Co. shoved a big liberal dick right into them- Now they are all fucked up. This is where the unethical imposition and corporate interest combine- The solution is to raise the rates of people in the lower risk categories. They now pay more while their load on the system is still basically the same.

I wouldn’t repeal and replace. I would simply repeal it and point out to people that they are no more fucked now than they were before its implementation. Our constitution was designed to guarantee certain god given rights- Not the right to have your teeth cleaned twice a year and free diabetes medication.

Censoring Scientists- I would have to see exactly how. I claim that Obama cost me a job, because he declared war on the coal industry. Those are his words. Consol Energy then pulled the contract from the manufacturer I worked for- and my job went with it. There is a direct line of action that backs up my claim with evidence and documentation.

I want to see that from a scientist claiming to be censored.

EPA- Is one of the letter agencies that is entirely self directing, with the ability to impose fines and penalties at its own discretion. There are plenty of horror stories about over reach and targeting by them that has destroyed lives and livelihoods. They undermine property ownership with carte blanche ability to impose penalty, and remove the presumption of innocence by making an owner prove that they didn’t do as accused and without the need for a claim of damages by any individual of corporate entity. They also exist under the protection that you cannot sue the government, so any damages that occur as a result of their action are irretrievable.

Muslim Ban- Not a ban. You just need a waiver. Also doesn’t ban people from 120 some predominantly muslim countries that no one gives a shit about. Throwing the Big Business factor in just triggers activists that otherwise wouldn’t give two shits. But throw Business in there and peoples heads pop off.

Threatened China- How? Are we currently coordinating the Pacific fleet? Did we enact a trade embargo or anything else that indicates we are headed to actual war or other strategic military action?

Iran- Launch a war? I doubt it.

Invade Mexico- Not in this universe. Use our military and law enforcement agencies to aid them in the drug war as we currently do and have in the past- sure. Invade- No.

In not even two weeks- Good! He’s a different president than the last one. He is revisiting and revising policies and relationships that the previous one had, as he should, and not wasting much time in doing it.

I see foot dragging as searching for political capital and leverage. That he is not doing it is a good thing in my mind. The one piece of legislation I do see that with is the ACA, so I’m just going into wait and see mode on that.

Standard disclaimer- I could be totally wrong in a number of ways on each and every point, and probably am.

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Yeah, explain that to the people who are actually receiving preventative care for the first time in a long time. Or the people who reached their lifetime cap long ago because of a debilitating illness and who wouldn’t be insurable because of a pre-existing condition under a full repeal. It needs to be replaced (more people support the ACA now than oppose it). I have a friend whose young son needs $50k worth of medication per year to treat a rare blood disorder. With an outright repeal, his life is very much on the line.

Regarding coal, the blame for that can pretty much be laid at the feet of natural gas and, to a lesser extent, renewables. I’m sorry to hear that the coal industry’s decline has impacted you (and I am sure many people you know), but it’s being replaced by other fuels and nothing Trump does is going to change that.

Actually not true on coal. The price for met coal has gone up to $200/ton. Previously idled mines are cutting again. China has started importing coal again on top of the 4B tons they’re going to mine. The whole world is going to set production records in 2017 (forecast obv.).

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Very well said my friend. And that is what the argument used to be before Obama dragged everyone left. Now it’s how much we “owe” everyone not “if” we owe them anything.

Funny I provide for my family, my employee’s and I also donate decent sums to various charities. But that’s not enough for the left they also want me to provide for people who are either unwilling to work, or are stuck in a low income job.

When I think of the lefts position I always wonder when did it became my responsibility? How much can they punish those who have succeeded before production drops?

Okay…enough we got rid of the Socialist (I know he’s not really a socialist but it is a good narrative isn’t it?)

Hopefully Trump will do better.

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That was an anecdote to illustrate that any claim can be made, but a legitimate claim needs to be validated.

On the actual facts of the matter- No. Alternate energy and natural gas had not had that much of an impact at that point, but companies in the industry were evaluating how they would be moving forward. I had a bit of a heads up at that point that Consol would be pulling out of coal and going more into gas production, as my sister was on their strategic planning committee. The sanctions placed on the industry and the incentives to change if he was re-elected were nails in the coffin.

The impact on me was negligible. I’m not going to debate the impact his presidency had on other people though, other than to point to the election map and that giant swath of red through appalachia. He devastated entire ways of life through a whole region of our country with the stroke of a pen.