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Prove My Exercise-Sci Prof Wrong!

Correct me if I am wrong, but isn’t it possible to create more fat cells (hyperplasia of fat cells) but impossible to get rid of them once your body creates them. They can only get smaller? If I am wrong please correct me. If not, can you please provide some links that support that statement? Thanks…

once the amount of fat cells is dtermined, you can neither gain or lose them. They can however, shrink or expand.

I know you won’t lose them, but I think that if you get very fat that your body will actually create more.

More importantly, don’t bother getting into the “prove my instructor wrong” baloney. Find the studies that reference this and see the truth for yourself. If your instructor is not going to react poorly, then perhaps privately offer the references.

Getting into repeated pissing matches over the year is often a bad move.

Dying Fat Cells Call for Molecular Rescue
By Rosalie Marion Bliss
March 3, 2006

Scientists have known that immune cells are responsible for most of the inflammatory chemicals that are released within fat tissue–but they haven’t known why. Now a study published by Agricultural Research Service-funded scientists shows that white blood cells, called macrophages, appear to rush to dead fat cells to mop them up, the same way they surround a splinter lodged in skin.

The study, authored by physician Andrew Greenberg, cell biologist Martin Obin and colleagues, was published in the Journal of Lipid Research. Both scientists are with the Obesity and Metabolism Laboratory at the Jean Mayer USDA Human Nutrition Research Center on Aging at Tufts University in Boston, Mass.

The researchers found that as people gain weight, fat cells gradually enlarge and eventually break down and die. When obesity continues over a period of time, a cycle occurs in which new fat cells form to store the added fat, then peak in size and finally die. The study showed that more than 90 percent of the macrophages in the fatty tissue of obese mice and humans are located around these dead fat cells. In addition, as the fat cells get bigger, the prevalence of macrophages increases proportionally.

Because fat doesn’t dissolve in the blood, the authors theorize that the immune system is essentially sequestering the dead fat cells and gorging on the leftover lipids and cellular debris. During that process, the macrophages could emit potentially dangerous amounts of inflammatory chemicals.

In a scenario of molecular rescue gone awry, the new findings may explain how enlarged fat cells, as found in obesity, promote obesity-related complications such as insulin resistance, diabetes or heart disease.

You’re using the word “hypertrophy” wrongly. Hypertrophy is the increase in bulk without multiplication of parts(cells). Whether or not the body creates more fat cells, I don’t know. I do know it would not be called “hypertrophy of fat cells” if it does. Just a heads up.

You’re thinking of hyperplasia, not hypertrophy. But yes, you’re right. I wouldn’t go through the trouble proving him wrong…will most likely create more problems than they would solve, especially if he isn’t open minded.

[quote]-ck wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn’t it possible to create more fat cells (hypertrophy of fat cells) but impossible to get rid of them once your body creates them. They can only get smaller? If I am wrong please correct me. If not, can you please provide some links that support that statement? Thanks…[/quote]

You are wrong. It isn’t “impossible” to get rid of fat cells as cells can die. Blunt injury to a specific area could cause this leaving a bruise and possibly an indentation if cells that die in the area. Liposuction also makes it possible to get rid of fat cells. You have already been corrected by others on the “hypertrophy” vs “hyperplasia” issue, but the simple fact that you even made that mistake shows you need to be LESS concerned with trying to prove anyone wrong on the subject and more concerned with simply learning more.

I have no doubt you misunderstood the lesson because you read an article here. I tried to make a correction on that in the debate that followed that article.

For the most part, past pre-puberty, you are pretty much stuck with the same number of fat cells (barring the situations described above). EXTREME fat gain (like in excess of 100lbs of body fat…we are NOT referring to 20lbs gained while bulking up) may lead to the creation of new fat cells. Very few studies have actually been done on humans, however, simply observing people like bodybuilders who gain large amounts of fat in the off seasson and then manage to lose it all for a contest indicates that the number isn’t increasing much if at all but their size is simply inflating and deflating.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

Blunt injury to a specific area could cause this leaving a bruise and possibly an indentation if cells that die in the area.
[/quote]

This really makes me wonder if I could open a fat loss clinic offering an option to liposuction. I could charge outrageous fees to fat people and then just beat them with a stick until all their fat cells die from blunt force trauma. Then, to increase repeat business, I could add their names and addresses to fast food coupon mailing lists. MUAHAHAHA!!! (sorry, sleep deprivation brings out the evil genius in me).

[quote]Professor X wrote:
-ck wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn’t it possible to create more fat cells (hypertrophy of fat cells) but impossible to get rid of them once your body creates them. They can only get smaller? If I am wrong please correct me. If not, can you please provide some links that support that statement? Thanks…

You are wrong. It isn’t “impossible” to get rid of fat cells as cells can die. Blunt injury to a specific area could cause this leaving a bruise and possibly an indentation if cells that die in the area. Liposuction also makes it possible to get rid of fat cells. You have already been corrected by others on the “hypertrophy” vs “hyperplasia” issue, but the simple fact that you even made that mistake shows you need to be LESS concerned with trying to prove anyone wrong on the subject and more concerned with simply learning more.

I have no doubt you misunderstood the lesson because you read an article here. I tried to make a correction on that in the debate that followed that article.

For the most part, past pre-puberty, you are pretty much stuck with the same number of fat cells (barring the situations described above). EXTREME fat gain (like in excess of 100lbs of body fat…we are NOT referring to 20lbs gained while bulking up) may lead to the creation of new fat cells. Very few studies have actually been done on humans, however, simply observing people like bodybuilders who gain large amounts of fat in the off seasson and then manage to lose it all for a contest indicates that the number isn’t increasing much if at all but their size is simply inflating and deflating.[/quote]

good info and a great point.

Why is everyone out to prove their teacher wrong after reading one article or post on this or any site. When words are used in a question that clearly shows lack of understanding of the subject being questioned, it loses all credibility.

Even the above cited study is but ONE study, that if you read through is like a legal paper. Appear. May…

[quote]DK wrote:
You’re thinking of hyperplasia, not hypertrophy. But yes, you’re right. I wouldn’t go through the trouble proving him wrong…will most likely create more problems than they would solve, especially if he isn’t open minded.[/quote]

Thanks. I did mean hyperplasia.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

You are wrong. It isn’t “impossible” to get rid of fat cells as cells can die. Blunt injury to a specific area could cause this leaving a bruise and possibly an indentation if cells that die in the area. Liposuction also makes it possible to get rid of fat cells. You have already been corrected by others on the “hypertrophy” vs “hyperplasia” issue, but the simple fact that you even made that mistake shows you need to be LESS concerned with trying to prove anyone wrong on the subject and more concerned with simply learning more.

I have no doubt you misunderstood the lesson because you read an article here. I tried to make a correction on that in the debate that followed that article.

For the most part, past pre-puberty, you are pretty much stuck with the same number of fat cells (barring the situations described above). EXTREME fat gain (like in excess of 100lbs of body fat…we are NOT referring to 20lbs gained while bulking up) may lead to the creation of new fat cells. Very few studies have actually been done on humans, however, simply observing people like bodybuilders who gain large amounts of fat in the off seasson and then manage to lose it all for a contest indicates that the number isn’t increasing much if at all but their size is simply inflating and deflating.[/quote]

Thanks. I know I read it somewhere but I wasn’t sure where. I was thinking it was in the NSCA Essentials of Strength and Conditioning Text but I am not sure. Thanks for the info. My reason for wanting to prove him wrong was a test question that he counted wrong but none of the answers where right.

If you increased your fat cell count above normal due to becoming a fatass, then dieted down, after time fat cells would die (as do all cells in the body) why would they be replaced if a high fat cell count was no longer necessary, would your body just return to your natural base level of fat cells or lower? Does anyone know the average lifespan of a adipocyte?

[quote]Maccer101 wrote:
If you increased your fat cell count above normal due to becoming a fatass, then dieted down, after time fat cells would die (as do all cells in the body) why would they be replaced if a high fat cell count was no longer necessary, would your body just return to your natural base level of fat cells or lower? Does anyone know the average lifespan of a adipocyte?[/quote]

I’d wonder the same, but because all the material out there refers to a relatively constant number that expand as they hold more fat, I’d guess they are either lasting a long time or being replaced if they die off.

If they did slowly die off, that would be great for previously fat people, as they could then “adapt” to the lighter weight.

[quote]vroom wrote:
If they did slowly die off, that would be great for previously fat people, as they could then “adapt” to the lighter weight.[/quote]
I used to be a big fat-ass (as in 100lbs overweight) and I have had no trouble ‘adapting’ to a lighter weight. I just stopped doing such fat-ass stuff - problem solved.

Well with the cell death theory, how does this relate to loose skin. I have lost around 90 lbs in the last 4 years and have some loose skin left. Does this mean that as the skin cells die off I would grown in fresh healthy skin cells??? What kind of effect is there for this?

[quote]Professor X wrote:
You have already been corrected by others on the “hypertrophy” vs “hyperplasia” issue, but the simple fact that you even made that mistake shows you need to be LESS concerned with trying to prove anyone wrong on the subject and more concerned with simply learning more.[/quote]

This is a great point, and the problem with this thread is all over T-Mag. You have people giving shitty advice everywhere you look. The site is full of people who think themselves capable of proving professors and other Ph.Ds wrong.

I read the boards purely for entertainment, as the advice most people give is worthless.

[quote]boss99er wrote:
Well with the cell death theory, how does this relate to loose skin. I have lost around 90 lbs in the last 4 years and have some loose skin left. Does this mean that as the skin cells die off I would grown in fresh healthy skin cells??? What kind of effect is there for this?[/quote]

Loss of skin elasticity. That is what happens to many people over the age of 35. It would seem to happen to most people when losing excess body fat close to the 100lbs mark. That is just an observation I have made just listening and watching people over years. You can only stretch skin out so much before it will have a hard time going back to its original appearance. This is one more reason to lift weights with an effort to gain muscle mass if the goal is to lose that much body fat. Perhaps you could decrease the amount of left over skin if this is accomplished.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Loss of skin elasticity. That is what happens to many people over the age of 35. It would seem to happen to most people when losing excess body fat close to the 100lbs mark. That is just an observation I have made just listening and watching people over years. You can only stretch skin out so much before it will have a hard time going back to its original appearance. This is one more reason to lift weights with an effort to gain muscle mass if the goal is to lose that much body fat. Perhaps you could decrease the amount of left over skin if this is accomplished.[/quote]

Well all of my weight loss came between the years of 21 and my now 25. Do you think even though the amount of weight lose was substantial that because of my age some of it could tighten back up? I am hoping you are right about the lifting thing. I figure even if it doesnt tighten up again, I could at least fill some of it back up with muscle instead of fat.

[quote]boss99er wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Loss of skin elasticity. That is what happens to many people over the age of 35. It would seem to happen to most people when losing excess body fat close to the 100lbs mark. That is just an observation I have made just listening and watching people over years. You can only stretch skin out so much before it will have a hard time going back to its original appearance. This is one more reason to lift weights with an effort to gain muscle mass if the goal is to lose that much body fat. Perhaps you could decrease the amount of left over skin if this is accomplished.

Well all of my weight loss came between the years of 21 and my now 25. Do you think even though the amount of weight lose was substantial that because of my age some of it could tighten back up? I am hoping you are right about the lifting thing. I figure even if it doesnt tighten up again, I could at least fill some of it back up with muscle instead of fat.
[/quote]

No one can predict if it will go back to the way it was. Is there a possibility? Yes, depending on how much loose skin we are talking about.

Well its not a ton, but it doesnt look like the skin of a really fit person. Dont get me wrong, I know there is still fat there, not much, but there is still some, but the skin is loser than guys who weigh the same amount of even more but were never ALOT bigger like I was. Either way, I guess my only option is to keep eating, and lifting and hope that somehow things straighten out…or at least I get big enough that muscle fills the loose skin.