Protein Digestion

[quote]captaincalvert wrote:

[quote]No more protein synthesis occurs OR the rate of protein synthesis doesnt increase past a certain point?

Its getting ridiculous how often this shit gets butchered. The protein you eat doesnt vanish into thin air after a certain point. [/quote]

Hey. Don’t shoot the messenger. I’m just telling you what I learned back then. I’m not even 100% sure that it’s right. I did not claim that it disappears into thin air by the way. Actually surplus amino acids that are not usefd for energy productiob gets processed by the kidneys and then excreted with the urine, which explains why people who eat large amounts of protein produce more urine than average people.
[/quote]

Come on. Whats the point of posting information if you dont even know if its right or not?

Find a pro bodybuilder or high level powerlifter or 250+ lbs strongman that eats 1.8 grams protein per kg of bodyweight, then we’ll talk.

I have reservations about lots of things concerning both training and nutrition. It doesn’t stop me from saying that these scientists and those coaches say so and so. That’s why I chose to give the source of my information rather than beating my chest and say: “I know this to be true and you are all morons if you say otherwise”. It’s just the official version I think is taught at most sports medicine schools, and like I said, you’d expect these people to know what they’re talking about. However, sometimes authorities turn out to be wrong, so I choose to thread carefully.

You know, just because everybody does something it doesn’t necessarily make it right. For a couple of decades doctors and everybody in the fitness industry promoted high carb / low fat diets to prevent coronary disease. It didn’t make it right. Still, it’s hard to see beyond ones own beliefs, so I try to keep an open mind about this. Maybe the BBs are right. Maybe the scientist have overlooked some hidden factor. Maybe rate of protein synthesis isn’t dependent on nitrogen balance to the extent they think. I freely admit it’s way beyond my capabilities to decide. But it’s still an interesting issue.

[quote]captaincalvert wrote:
and like I said, you’d expect these people to know what they’re talking about.

[/quote]

For what reason? Because they wear a lab coat?

Because they base their wievs on actual research instead of things like strong feelings, anecdotal evidence and this and that coach’s personal conviction that extreme protein doses are better.

Why not just eat more protein and be done with it? Is it really killing you to get that extra 100 grams of protein in a day, up from 200? Seriously though.

[quote]captaincalvert wrote:

Because they base their wievs on actual research instead of things like strong feelings, anecdotal evidence and this and that coach’s personal conviction that extreme protein doses are better.[/quote]

LOL @ thinking research > anecdotal evidence.

You do know these scientists have never done testing on bodybuilders right?

Having strong feelings about something can be a good or a bad thing. In your case it’s a bad thing because your feelings are holding you back from recognizing what’s important and what’s not.

[quote]LOL @ thinking research > anecdotal evidence.

You do know these scientists have never done testing on bodybuilders right?

Having strong feelings about something can be a good or a bad thing. In your case it’s a bad thing because your feelings are holding you back from recognizing what’s important and what’s not. [/quote]

What does my feelings have to do with anything? Me feelings aren’t holding me back from anything. Scientists have tested plenty of muscle building athletes over the years. Why should they be any different from BBs? I asked a professor once if he thought pro BBs on drugs would need more protein than other athletes because of their hormone levels. He said that on the contrary they would build effeciently on less, precisely because of their bodies’ extreme ability to make use of the amino acids present.

Anyways. What does it all matter? There doesn’t seem to be any danger in consuming an excess of protein, why not eat a little more than the recommendations to be on the safe side. I do. Even though I freely admit that I don’t know if it really has any effect.

[quote]captaincalvert wrote:
I asked a professor once if he thought pro BBs on drugs would need more protein than other athletes because of their hormone levels. He said that on the contrary they would build effeciently on less, precisely because of their bodies’ extreme ability to make use of the amino acids present.
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[quote]captaincalvert wrote:

I asked a professor once if he thought pro BBs on drugs would need more protein than other athletes because of their hormone levels. He said that on the contrary they would build effeciently on less, precisely because of their bodies’ extreme ability to make use of the amino acids present.

[/quote]

Oh my god. Was he a professor of macrame or soemthing like that?

One of the main benefits of using anabolic steroids is that nitrogen retention is improved. Protein sythesis increases. SIGNIFICANTLY. More AAs can be used to build muscle. I wont go as far to say that increase is limitless but consuming huge quantities of protein while using AAS is far more effective than consuming huge amounts of protein while natural. This does not mean Im saying that naturals should consume small amounts of protein, just not extreme amounts like 2.5g/lb for example.

Do you think 250+ lb bodybuilders on AAS consume upwards of 500g of protein because they think it’s fun or something?

It was this guy:

http://www.nih.no/templates/EmployeePresentation____210.aspx

He is responsible for courses in physiological adaptations to strength training and for nutrition in relation to physical activity. He also teaches human physiology and sports physiology.

He has a doctorate on the topic of restitution in relation to adaptations in strength training, and he serves as a nutrition consultant for our national centre for olympic athletes.

He is considered to be leading in my country in the field of protein research.

But of course he’s no match for your intellect.

Aw, not this again.

[quote]captaincalvert wrote:
It was this guy:

http://www.nih.no/templates/EmployeePresentation____210.aspx

He is responsible for courses in physiological adaptations to strength training and for nutrition in relation to physical activity. He also teaches human physiology and sports physiology.

He has a doctorate on the topic of restitution in relation to adaptations in strength training, and he serves as a nutrition consultant for our national centre for olympic athletes.

He is considered to be leading in my country in the field of protein research.

But of course he’s no match for your intellect.[/quote]

Has he used steroids before?

You’d had to ask him that, but I doubt it. If anyone got wind of that, he’d get fired before he could say deca durabolin. Does that really matter though? He doesn’t base what he says on personal experiences. He’s a scientist for God’s sake.

[quote]captaincalvert wrote:
You’d had to ask him that, but I doubt it. If anyone got wind of that, he’d get fired before he could say deca durabolin. Does that really matter though? He doesn’t base what he says on personal experiences. He’s a scientist for God’s sake.[/quote]

Fair enough then. He can listen to what he sees on a piece of paper or a computer screen and I’ll listen to the dozens of bodybuilders who have actual experience with this stuff. Unlike you and him I base what part of what I say on real life experience.

The less protein while on AAS is still mind boggling though. People use AAS partly because they allow you to eat more protein to build more muscle. Or maybe he wouldnt disagree with that and meant that you could use AAS and eat less protein than a natural but still make the same gains as them (using identical twins of course)? I hadnt considered that possibility earlier

I’m willing to guess that something got lost in translation between what the doctor said to you and what has been posted on this forum; either some specific context that was omitted or extra information which changes the initial premise. Would be more logical.

[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
Aw, not this again.

[/quote]

again? does it ever really stop?

my two cents: go ahead and do the bare minimum. eat as little protein as you think it takes to build muscle and train as little as you think it takes to get a training effect. it works out better for the rest of us. more cow and less people in the squat rack. but dont cry about bare minimum results.