T Nation

Primobolan and Anavar


#1

Is it worth it stacking these to roids together? They're both Class I so i assume it would be better to just take a higher dose of primo if possible?

Side questoin - if i was incorporating primo in a 2on 2 off cycle, would around 1000mg of primo kill libido if no test is used with the cycle? or will it raise libido like test dosE?

thanks


#2

bump


#3

buuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuump


#4

hello


#5

Crap cycle. Both are bad ideas. I think you already know why. Push the issue and expect flaming.


#6

Yeah but 1000mg a week primo depot?

I could stack var with that, but without the test, that’s the crux - why do that, I dunno - was just wondering.

I’m immue to inflammation, so inflame away :slight_smile:


#7

you won’t get much out of it and you are gonna spend a lot of money not getting much in terms of results.

some users will run low dose var or primo (at levels below the point where it is supressive or minimally supressive) to give them a little boost but if you are going to go to all that trouble i see no reason why you wouldn’t just do a proper cycle.

I tried running just var at 20, 40, and 60mg/d to see what sort of effect it would have…I started getting some suppression at 60mg/d, at that point I was up about 6 pounds and my strength was up a little bit…the results were ok but when you consider the cost it was not all that great, I could probably add that with just creatine, good diet, and hard training when in a “natural” state.

Some people might find those results worth it if they just want a little extra boost to performance but I didn’t think it was all that great.

You really can’t run primo in a 2 on 2 off cycle because it is a long ester (enth), you need shorter acting compounds for a 2 on 2 off.

you will get a lot more (with minimal sides) from a low-moderate test cycle (300-500mg/w) with an AI to control estrogen and HCG at low doses to avoid shutdown so recovery is quick and easy…it will probably cost you less money than the low dose primo and var cycle as well.


#8

Tone recently ran a high dose primo cycle so you can ask him about his experience…

I am not sure what dose of primo will start to shut you down but I am pretty sure it is below 1000mg/w…it’s propbably somewhere around 200-300mg/w but that is just a guess.

The issue you will run into with primo only is that you will shut down the majority of your natural test production so while you still have the DHT there to stimulate libido you have drastically decreased estrogen which will also give you libido issues. It won’t crash like if you run tren only but it will get pretty low depending on how high you run it.


#9

Sweet furious! Especially for this:

Though the enanthate name in the primobolan enanthate should have given that away, whoops!

Was just trying to do with less androgenic compounds because of someting i read… i know more of what i will do now

Thanks again


#10

Sounds like he’s scared of the roids aromatising!


#11

No, male pattern baldness, ahem and benign prostate hypertrophy cough and stuff


#12

So you have an issue with androgenic steroids being androgenic?

Why not use a 5-AR inhibitor when on cycle? I would say that is a much more realistic and sensible option over trying to use JUST the mildest of all the steroids.

Plus - Primobolan is considered mild etc… but i am sure that the androgenicity increases quite a lot with doses around 1g/wk. Shit - Deca would be a MUCH more preferable choice.

2-300mg Nandrolone/wk
150iu HCG EOD
1mg Cabergoline/wk
1mg Adex/wk

This will give you significantly more results than Primo AND Var. Unless you not only want to avoid androgen increases but also inhibition…

In which case i would really suggest Carbolin 19.


#13

yeah well i fucked myself on dutasteride and DHT inhibition medicine and its a long story.

i’m just gonna run 500mg test + var 2week on 2week off cycle

This is my first tentative steps into this, and OMG i’m so scared, i’ve had bad experiences fucking with my hormones, but i WANT to do this, i been training for 8 years solid and its about time…

As an aside, how effective will the HCG be in countering the shut down effects of the deca? and on what lenght of a run.


#14

I am not a fan of DHT blockers either…I took proscar for a while and found I would rather lose my hair.

I just came off a cycle of test/deca for 5 weeks and then test/mast for 5 weeks (10 weeks total on plus 2 weeks for the enth to clear).

I ran HCG at 250iu 3x/w (from week 3 until week 10 when I took my last test shot) and it kept my balls full size the whole time…they shrank a little after I stopped pinning the HCG and the test/mast were still in my system but by the end of the 2 weeks when the test/mast had tapered down to normal physiological levels my balls returned to full size quick and recovery was actually pretty smooth.

The caber is important to reduce prolactin because excess prolactin can have a negative effect on libido. You also need to keep estrogen in balance so you need to adjust your AI accordingly.

I also ran proviron at 50mg/d during the 2 weeks after my last test shot to help with SHBG while the androgens were tapering down but otherwise that was all I did and it worked well. And of course I was also on adex through the whole cycle, I am now convinced that keeping E low during recovery is crutial (I think much more important for me than using a SERM which I find if anything inhibits my recovery).

If you’re running Deca then you need to run a longer cycle (unless it is NPP then you could maybe get away with a 2 on 2 off).


#15

NPP will still need to be injected for the last time 4-5 days out from the end of the cycle IMO.

Are you running Test and Var or Nandrolone or what? It wasn’t clear in the last post.


#16

I’m wanting to run test + var. I think.

Could consider nandrolone, but i think test is overall safer, in that it’s not detectable in your system for 18months after use, and it doesn’t have the progestin side-effects which i think are even worse than oestrogen side effects.

Deca’s shut-down of HPTA seems more severe also, than test. But if HCG is pretty effective in countering this, then i guess that’s one less reason not to use it.

As you can see, i’m still in the planning stages. It will ultimately depend on the training regime i plan for the next two months.


#17

[quote]WyldFlower wrote:
I’m wanting to run test + var. I think.

Could consider nandrolone, but i think test is overall safer, in that it’s not detectable in your system for 18months after use, and it doesn’t have the progestin side-effects which i think are even worse than oestrogen side effects.

Deca’s shut-down of HPTA seems more severe also, than test. But if HCG is pretty effective in countering this, then i guess that’s one less reason not to use it.

As you can see, i’m still in the planning stages. It will ultimately depend on the training regime i plan for the next two months.[/quote]

From what i can tell ‘what you think’ is not going to help you a great deal as it is.

If talking about SAFETY then Nandrolone would clearly be the safer drug. Other than the inhibition factors, it is one of the most effective and safest drugs to use IMO.

Anyway - as testing IS now an issue… do you know if your sport/discipline/martial art test for synthetic Testosterone? (epi-test) Do they test for HCG? Do they test for SERM or AI?

Are you going to use during the event/show/match or in off-season/training only? Is there random testing and how many times a year? Do you have team mates who use or know you are using?

Var and Test Prop can be out in 3-4 weeks i think. Although as you are wanting 2on/2off cycles, you will essentailly be ruining that - as more than one of those cycles is needed for the best results, you are looking at a minimum of 10 weeks detectable time for only 4 weeks on - whereas a straight 6 week cycle would give you more time on but with the same time detectable.

JMO


#18

The safest drug to use for tested athletes are rHGH, various peptides and growth hormone releasing agents


#19

Detectable is not an issues, at the moment.

I train MMA - mainly Muay Thai and Submission Wrestling - flitting between the two disciplines at the moment.

I don’t know what they test for specifically, but i would prefer not to have a banned substance in my system that long.

As this would be my first AAS run, i would want to experiment during training ONLY, for now, and see how my body adopts and reacts to the stuff. There is no random testing, and use is widespread in my gym - but mainly among guys who only train as a “hobby” and are more into bodybuilder style training overall. Don’t know what the competitive fighters are on.

My other worry about test, it may sound faggy, but i heard test prop is very painful. LOL, that sounds wrong on screen - but i’m worried that if i inject my quad, for example, then i will be limping all day next day.

This cannot happen as i will be training 6 days a week from September, and on three of those days i will be getting in two training sessions.

I dont want shoulder, leg or any other pain while i’m training so hard, so i though i could avoid that by diong an oral only cycle, which worried me with the liver toxicity, so i thought i’d do a 2-on-2-off instead, but then add in the issues regarding androgens which i’ve suffered adversely in the past and oh god it’s so confusing!

Might just do a 8 week test enth cycle and leave it at that. hrrrmpph


#20

wait, is primo acetate considered short acting? could i do that with teh test p two on two off? It would allow me to run lower dose test to reduce androgenic sides…