Prilepin and Undulating Wave Periodization

It will be a percentage of my current max. After each cycle (about 1 month) I will re-estimate my maxes, probably by maxing out for reps at my 90% weights, and recalculate weights for the next cycle.

It will be a percentage of my current max. After each cycle (about 1 month) I will re-estimate my maxes, probably by maxing out for reps at my 90% weights, and recalculate weights for the next cycle.

I would say that is too much volume for 90% of your 1RM. From what I understand about Prilepins Chart, those numbers were for the olympic lifts(fast lift and essentially no eccentric component). For the big 3, I would stay closer to 4 lifts above 90%, especially if you’re hitting a max. The numbers under 90% are pretty spot on though in my experience.

[quote]DjSm28 wrote:
I would say that is too much volume for 90% of your 1RM. From what I understand about Prilepins Chart, those numbers were for the olympic lifts(fast lift and essentially no eccentric component). For the big 3, I would stay closer to 4 lifts above 90%, especially if you’re hitting a max. The numbers under 90% are pretty spot on though in my experience.[/quote]

I have to agree here.

A couple thoughts are the reps for each percentage seem a bit off. You didn’t mention how you intend to progress but generally multiple singles at a “true” 90% may be a better approach. 5-6 singles is what I’d suggest from my experience, though some may be able to maintain strength better at that percentage you may or may not. Meanwhile 5x5 @ 75% is easily doable and IMO more productive. Then your 4x6@60%…having not looked at prilepin’s table in a while I’m not sure about the percentage but I’d think 65-70% would be a better percent at that rep range. Honestly 4x6@70% is pretty easy and I’d go no lower than 65% for 6’s.

Just my opinion do with it what you will.

Basing the whole of your training on Prilepin’s Chart might not be a great idea. As DjSm28 said, Prilepin’s Chart was developed for the Olympic lifts. It’s only really useful for a powerlifter in setting up dynamic effort training, to develop power.

Daily undulating periodization is more than just heavy, medium, light. One day should be focused on developing maximal strength, one on power and one on hypertrophy. Basically ME, DE and RE. A Prilepin’s Chart based protocol would be fine for the power day, but wouldn’t be effective for the strength and hypertrophy days.

Thanks for all the replies! So maybe this looks better:

Heavy 5x1 @90%
Medium 5x5@75%
Light 3x10@65%

What do you think?

[quote]DjSm28 wrote:
I would say that is too much volume for 90% of your 1RM. From what I understand about Prilepins Chart, those numbers were for the olympic lifts(fast lift and essentially no eccentric component). For the big 3, I would stay closer to 4 lifts above 90%, especially if you’re hitting a max. The numbers under 90% are pretty spot on though in my experience.[/quote]

Sound advice. Louie Simmons says the same thing, and the man’s a huge advocate of Prilepin’s chart:

“We have adjusted the number of 90% and above lifts in one workout to 3-5 lifts. The reasoning behind this is that the special exercises for powerlifting are much heavier compared to the Olympic lifts that Prilepin’s data were based on.”

I’d personally do something more like:

Medium - 5x5 @ 75%

Light - 8 sets of 2 reps @ 65% or something similar.

Heavy - Work up to 1, 2 or 3 reps at an RPE of about 9, rotate the rep ranges every few weeks.

try this…

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:
I’d personally do something more like:

Medium - 5x5 @ 75%

Light - 8 sets of 2 reps @ 65% or something similar.

Heavy - Work up to 1, 2 or 3 reps at an RPE of about 9, rotate the rep ranges every few weeks.[/quote]

8 sets of 2 reps at 65%? That seems strange. How did you come up with this?

[quote]RampantBadger wrote:
try this…

That looks interesting but I want to try something where the rep ranges rotate more quickly.

[quote]professor1 wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:
I’d personally do something more like:

Medium - 5x5 @ 75%

Light - 8 sets of 2 reps @ 65% or something similar.

Heavy - Work up to 1, 2 or 3 reps at an RPE of about 9, rotate the rep ranges every few weeks.[/quote]

8 sets of 2 reps at 65%? That seems strange. How did you come up with this?[/quote]

That’s a pretty standard dynamic effort rep range and percentage, based on Prilepin’s chart but slightly lower volume for the reasons other people mentioned above.

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:
Basing the whole of your training on Prilepin’s Chart might not be a great idea. As DjSm28 said, Prilepin’s Chart was developed for the Olympic lifts. It’s only really useful for a powerlifter in setting up dynamic effort training, to develop power.

Daily undulating periodization is more than just heavy, medium, light. One day should be focused on developing maximal strength, one on power and one on hypertrophy. Basically ME, DE and RE. A Prilepin’s Chart based protocol would be fine for the power day, but wouldn’t be effective for the strength and hypertrophy days.[/quote]

Ya sheiko is a terrible approach to building strength.

[quote]clutz15 wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:
Basing the whole of your training on Prilepin’s Chart might not be a great idea. As DjSm28 said, Prilepin’s Chart was developed for the Olympic lifts. It’s only really useful for a powerlifter in setting up dynamic effort training, to develop power.

Daily undulating periodization is more than just heavy, medium, light. One day should be focused on developing maximal strength, one on power and one on hypertrophy. Basically ME, DE and RE. A Prilepin’s Chart based protocol would be fine for the power day, but wouldn’t be effective for the strength and hypertrophy days.[/quote]

Ya sheiko is a terrible approach to building strength.[/quote]

The volumes in Sheiko programmes, even 29, are WAY above the ranges given in Prilepin’s Chart. ‘If’ Sheiko is influenced by Prilepin’s Chart, it’s only very loosely influenced by it.

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:

[quote]clutz15 wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:
Basing the whole of your training on Prilepin’s Chart might not be a great idea. As DjSm28 said, Prilepin’s Chart was developed for the Olympic lifts. It’s only really useful for a powerlifter in setting up dynamic effort training, to develop power.

Daily undulating periodization is more than just heavy, medium, light. One day should be focused on developing maximal strength, one on power and one on hypertrophy. Basically ME, DE and RE. A Prilepin’s Chart based protocol would be fine for the power day, but wouldn’t be effective for the strength and hypertrophy days.[/quote]

Ya sheiko is a terrible approach to building strength.[/quote]

The volumes in Sheiko programmes, even 29, are WAY above the ranges given in Prilepin’s Chart. ‘If’ Sheiko is influenced by Prilepin’s Chart, it’s only very loosely influenced by it.[/quote]
what are you talking about. last time I checked, doing 6 triples at 80% is in the range of Prilepins chart.

[quote]budreiser wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:

[quote]clutz15 wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:
Basing the whole of your training on Prilepin’s Chart might not be a great idea. As DjSm28 said, Prilepin’s Chart was developed for the Olympic lifts. It’s only really useful for a powerlifter in setting up dynamic effort training, to develop power.

Daily undulating periodization is more than just heavy, medium, light. One day should be focused on developing maximal strength, one on power and one on hypertrophy. Basically ME, DE and RE. A Prilepin’s Chart based protocol would be fine for the power day, but wouldn’t be effective for the strength and hypertrophy days.[/quote]

Ya sheiko is a terrible approach to building strength.[/quote]

The volumes in Sheiko programmes, even 29, are WAY above the ranges given in Prilepin’s Chart. ‘If’ Sheiko is influenced by Prilepin’s Chart, it’s only very loosely influenced by it.[/quote]
what are you talking about. last time I checked, doing 6 triples at 80% is in the range of Prilepins chart.[/quote]

Taking into account all the sets Sheiko 29 is well above the range of Prilepin’s chart

Average reps and intensity per session for Sheiko 29:
Squat 43 reps @ 66.3%
Bench 41 reps @ 67.2%
Deadlift 46 reps @ 70.9%

To back up my view, a little quote from Mike Tuchscherer: “I don’t really like the original Prelipin’s chart that much. I also don’t think Sheiko programs are based (or even heavily influenced) by the chart”. That’s good enough for me!

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:

[quote]budreiser wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:

[quote]clutz15 wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:
Basing the whole of your training on Prilepin’s Chart might not be a great idea. As DjSm28 said, Prilepin’s Chart was developed for the Olympic lifts. It’s only really useful for a powerlifter in setting up dynamic effort training, to develop power.

Daily undulating periodization is more than just heavy, medium, light. One day should be focused on developing maximal strength, one on power and one on hypertrophy. Basically ME, DE and RE. A Prilepin’s Chart based protocol would be fine for the power day, but wouldn’t be effective for the strength and hypertrophy days.[/quote]

Ya sheiko is a terrible approach to building strength.[/quote]

The volumes in Sheiko programmes, even 29, are WAY above the ranges given in Prilepin’s Chart. ‘If’ Sheiko is influenced by Prilepin’s Chart, it’s only very loosely influenced by it.[/quote]
what are you talking about. last time I checked, doing 6 triples at 80% is in the range of Prilepins chart.[/quote]

Taking into account all the sets Sheiko 29 is well above the range of Prilepin’s chart

Average reps and intensity per session for Sheiko 29:
Squat 43 reps @ 66.3%
Bench 41 reps @ 67.2%
Deadlift 46 reps @ 70.9%

To back up my view, a little quote from Mike Tuchscherer: “I don’t really like the original Prelipin’s chart that much. I also don’t think Sheiko programs are based (or even heavily influenced) by the chart”. That’s good enough for me![/quote]
the sheiko sessions were meant to be am/pm so the first session of 29 has 21 reps in the 70-75% range and the second has 16.
the next day in the week only that has competition benching only has one session. It has 20 reps in the 70-75% range and 4 in the 80% range. The upper limit of the 70-80% range is 24 reps. So far sheiko seems pretty close to prilepins chart. You cant apply average intensity to prilepins chart because prilepins chart wasn’t based on average intensity. However those average intensities do line up with where sheiko tries to keep all of his training programs. I could go and point out how you’re wrong in every single sheiko program, but I don’t have time for that.
Disclaimer in case Arramzy reads this
sheiko “programs” aren’t really programs they’re just examples of training cycles he has used for his lifters in the past.

[quote]budreiser wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:

[quote]budreiser wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:

[quote]clutz15 wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:
Basing the whole of your training on Prilepin’s Chart might not be a great idea. As DjSm28 said, Prilepin’s Chart was developed for the Olympic lifts. It’s only really useful for a powerlifter in setting up dynamic effort training, to develop power.

Daily undulating periodization is more than just heavy, medium, light. One day should be focused on developing maximal strength, one on power and one on hypertrophy. Basically ME, DE and RE. A Prilepin’s Chart based protocol would be fine for the power day, but wouldn’t be effective for the strength and hypertrophy days.[/quote]

Ya sheiko is a terrible approach to building strength.[/quote]

The volumes in Sheiko programmes, even 29, are WAY above the ranges given in Prilepin’s Chart. ‘If’ Sheiko is influenced by Prilepin’s Chart, it’s only very loosely influenced by it.[/quote]
what are you talking about. last time I checked, doing 6 triples at 80% is in the range of Prilepins chart.[/quote]

Taking into account all the sets Sheiko 29 is well above the range of Prilepin’s chart

Average reps and intensity per session for Sheiko 29:
Squat 43 reps @ 66.3%
Bench 41 reps @ 67.2%
Deadlift 46 reps @ 70.9%

To back up my view, a little quote from Mike Tuchscherer: “I don’t really like the original Prelipin’s chart that much. I also don’t think Sheiko programs are based (or even heavily influenced) by the chart”. That’s good enough for me![/quote]
the sheiko sessions were meant to be am/pm so the first session of 29 has 21 reps in the 70-75% range and the second has 16.
the next day in the week only that has competition benching only has one session. It has 20 reps in the 70-75% range and 4 in the 80% range. The upper limit of the 70-80% range is 24 reps. So far sheiko seems pretty close to prilepins chart. You cant apply average intensity to prilepins chart because prilepins chart wasn’t based on average intensity. However those average intensities do line up with where sheiko tries to keep all of his training programs. I could go and point out how you’re wrong in every single sheiko program, but I don’t have time for that.
Disclaimer in case Arramzy reads this
sheiko “programs” aren’t really programs they’re just examples of training cycles he has used for his lifters in the past.[/quote]

The purpose of the early sets in Sheiko is to build fatigue for the later sets, they are not just warm-up sets and they shouldn’t just be discounted from the total volume. Also, they are not meant to be split into am and pm sessions. The second lift is meant to be done in a fatigued state in the same session, Dave Bates confirmed this on the BMF forum.

Prilepin’s chart was as a result of observations of weightlifters, its recommended ranges are for developing power. Fundamentally it is about remaining fresh and quick.

Sheiko is the polar opposite, the purpose of the long grueling sessions is to practice the lifts over and over replicating lifting at higher percentages by building fatigue. Sheiko is not about being fresh and quick, it is about grinding out lifts.

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:

[quote]budreiser wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:

[quote]budreiser wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:

[quote]clutz15 wrote:

[quote]Karl Hungus wrote:
Basing the whole of your training on Prilepin’s Chart might not be a great idea. As DjSm28 said, Prilepin’s Chart was developed for the Olympic lifts. It’s only really useful for a powerlifter in setting up dynamic effort training, to develop power.

Daily undulating periodization is more than just heavy, medium, light. One day should be focused on developing maximal strength, one on power and one on hypertrophy. Basically ME, DE and RE. A Prilepin’s Chart based protocol would be fine for the power day, but wouldn’t be effective for the strength and hypertrophy days.[/quote]

Ya sheiko is a terrible approach to building strength.[/quote]

The volumes in Sheiko programmes, even 29, are WAY above the ranges given in Prilepin’s Chart. ‘If’ Sheiko is influenced by Prilepin’s Chart, it’s only very loosely influenced by it.[/quote]
what are you talking about. last time I checked, doing 6 triples at 80% is in the range of Prilepins chart.[/quote]

Taking into account all the sets Sheiko 29 is well above the range of Prilepin’s chart

Average reps and intensity per session for Sheiko 29:
Squat 43 reps @ 66.3%
Bench 41 reps @ 67.2%
Deadlift 46 reps @ 70.9%

To back up my view, a little quote from Mike Tuchscherer: “I don’t really like the original Prelipin’s chart that much. I also don’t think Sheiko programs are based (or even heavily influenced) by the chart”. That’s good enough for me![/quote]
the sheiko sessions were meant to be am/pm so the first session of 29 has 21 reps in the 70-75% range and the second has 16.
the next day in the week only that has competition benching only has one session. It has 20 reps in the 70-75% range and 4 in the 80% range. The upper limit of the 70-80% range is 24 reps. So far sheiko seems pretty close to prilepins chart. You cant apply average intensity to prilepins chart because prilepins chart wasn’t based on average intensity. However those average intensities do line up with where sheiko tries to keep all of his training programs. I could go and point out how you’re wrong in every single sheiko program, but I don’t have time for that.
Disclaimer in case Arramzy reads this
sheiko “programs” aren’t really programs they’re just examples of training cycles he has used for his lifters in the past.[/quote]

The purpose of the early sets in Sheiko is to build fatigue for the later sets, they are not just warm-up sets and they shouldn’t just be discounted from the total volume. Also, they are not meant to be split into am and pm sessions. The second lift is meant to be done in a fatigued state in the same session, Dave Bates confirmed this on the BMF forum.

Prilepin’s chart was as a result of observations of weightlifters, its recommended ranges are for developing power. Fundamentally it is about remaining fresh and quick.

Sheiko is the polar opposite, the purpose of the long grueling sessions is to practice the lifts over and over replicating lifting at higher percentages by building fatigue. Sheiko is not about being fresh and quick, it is about grinding out lifts.
[/quote]
if you’re grinding through a sheiko session, you’re doing it wrong. the early sets do matter but they are in separate percent ranges on prilepin’s table, and they tend to stay towards the bottom or below the recommended range. so it wouldn’t really affect the later sets. At least it has never done that for me.
I’m done here though, because this is retarded and I’m done adding to what makes this site shitty