T Nation

Press Lockouts

Quick question for the experienced guys out there and I think PL’s are probably the most experienced with partials.

I decided to do a 12 week program based around the progressive distance training style. My experience with partials up to this point left me with this impression 1/4 squats seemed pretty useless. Getting out of the hole was my problem. Not wearing a gear shirt it was ditto for bench lockouts. I fell in love with low rack pulls and think them awesome.

However with the whole PDT thing you start out at lockout distances with weights well, well above your full ROM 1RM for a handful of reps. Each workout (for me that meant each week on on Bench, Squat, Deads, and I added press to break up the hip exercises)I lower the pins a little and increase ROM. Slow cook but plenty of heavy stimulus.

Here’s the ‘problem’ or more likely ‘revelation’–my presses from a dead stop moving about 2.5-3" was crazy low. I OH Press 165 and clean and push 173 at about 180. Not jaw dropping numbers but you get my point.

Only in the press was I this back assward. And my erectors contracted like jumping pythons. The shoulder exercise felt more like a total body movement done this way then clean & press ever did.

Is this common? Is this an effect of me having short arms? Was my form just so naturally (and unnoticed) loose that my press dead-stop lockout was less than my press?

I hit 155 for a tough max rested 60 seconds and cranked out 95lbs for 6 reps and my shoulders were fried like no other workout ever.

This familiar to anyone at all or was I just getting some humble pie? With short arms I’m used to pushing with little effort and pulling like a window licker.

If I understand your question, you’re just saying that your push press is higher than your dead-stop press from pins somewhere above your head. Naturally, if you get the pins high enough your dead stop press will be higher than your push press. However, I expect that the pins would be pretty high for this to be the case. I don’t think what you are experiencing is really all that odd.

My push press has 45lbs on my strict OHP (215 vs. 170). They’re both from the bar sitting on top of my delts and the hardest part of the OHP is the part before I get my head through, but 45lbs is still a big difference.

I’ve never heard of someone using ROM on the press. I feel like it would be hard to make this work, at least for me, since the feel of the lift changes so much once I get my head through.

I either clean & push-press or do my press from shoulder height (clavicles) off pins on a flip flop rotation. This time I set the pins WAY up above my head, literally (I didn’t measure with a ruler) I’d guess the ROM was <3". I was hoping to get 185 for stop n go reps and then slowly lower the pins.

But man, arms almost fully extended, bar directly above my head, was the weakest part of my move. I’m just confused as this whole Progressive Distance Training concept kind of depends on your lockout beginnings being much heavier and I’ve blown it right out of the gate.

This isn’t true with 1/4 squats, rack pulls from above the knees, or even bench lockouts (though again that motion is tougher than the the other 2)–but the press I was actually stronger from a dead stop at shoulder height than top end lockout.

I’m just curious if this is a not uncommon phenom or if maybe I’m doing something really simple and stupid wrong.

I agree with you; from everything I’ve read I should be pushing more not less at that partial ROM. So I’m clueless why this would be. I guess (non-technical term usage warning coming up) the triceps “tie-in” right at the elbow are my weak point? Delts actually feel pretty well worked today–but it doesn’t explain the math of my low lockout.

Hope that made sense.

Now I have actually done this before. Overhead pin press lockouts (from a standing position, not seated). I was able to lockout probably 15% more than I could actually strict press. Here’s the thing though, it had little to do with my triceps or shoulders. I found that stabilizing my core and base to press from a dead stop was extremely difficult. So anyway, it could be a function of core strength and stability; just food for thought!

no–that clicked.

Like I said in my 1st post my spinal erectors were squeezing so hard it was like a spasm. And as I think about it I did find it harder to “set up” my stance for the press then when I pushed off pins from the bottom.

I guess I’ll just stay at this ROM for a bit longer 'til I catch on–could be a by-accident all around improvement for me. I do front squats frequently–but I was still shaking hard on this.

Good call. I just need to eat humble pie for a bit.

Thanks guys