T Nation

Presidential Vote: Have You Changed?


#1

It was time for a new topic; and I've thinking about this lately.

As the President was going into his final year; and as the Primary Season (and the players) began to shape up; I was more than prepared to Vote for the GOP candidate.

As the Primary advanced; I was even more convinced that Paul Ryan with a Conservative President could get some things done on the economic front. (Which was my greatest concern). So was the Middle East...but I thought that this was a struggle that ANY President was going to have; and that events there are just far too unpredictable to determine who would be "better" at handling them.

Then there was Trump...and Hillary...

I'm not as Partisan as some...but more than others...and I'm conflicted...

The "Lesser-of-two-Evils" is a TERRIBLE choice...and really not a "choice" at all...

Wow.

Where do you stand?


#2

I try to not make any decisions based on party lines. At all. I am registered "no party." Really liked Kasich, he would have had my vote. His refusal to compromise his beliefs and fall into party lines behind Trump has only furthered my respect for him.

Trump was an immediate no. His knowlege of anything policy-wise is shaky at best. I don't hate Hillary as much as many other people but I don't trust her and her record of poor judgment is a major red flag.

I will probably vote for Gary Johnson.


#3

Thanks, max.

(Just to add...I am also registered "No Party/Independent").


#4

I initially thought that Trump was a demagogue who had a read on what the base he pandered to wanted and played things out appropriately.

His actions post nomination changed my opinion on that. Now I think the man legitimately doesn't have even the basic decency to be the President.

This doesn't have anything to do with honesty or such; I don't actually expect the President to be honest, nor do I really want an honest President.

I'll be voting for Clinton this November. I am worried that a lot of the people of my generation will go and wast e their vote because Sanders didn't get the nomination. I am worried that Trump's base really is a helluva lot bigger than I think it is, and that we'll get a 70-80%'s voter participation instead of the 50-60% we usually see.

The Republicans this year seem to be saying "Never Hillary".

I say "Never Trump".


#5

Interesting points, magick.

You know what I do when I hear of Trump's "demise and Fall" day in and day out"?

I say to myself "...don't be so sure..."

I too think that Trump's base is much larger than predicted...and as I've said over and over...old metrics don't apply to this guy and his base.

Can he overcome basic Electoral College math and the HUGE deficits he has among minorities with a fired-up base?

I say..."We'll see..."


#6

I just think that there are a LOT of people who will SAY "I don't know who I'll Vote for..." (because of the crap they feel they will get for saying they are voting for Trump)...and are ready to press the touch pad for the guy faster than you can say "You're FIRED...!"

(Sort of a second "Silent Majority" maybe?)


#7

(Ooooops! My Bad, Zeb! I guess the "Moral Majority" is the correct term...)


#8

Was registered "no party affiliation."

Liked Rand Paul, he dropped out.

Changed my affiliation to vote for Cruz in the primary. (Which I didn't get to do. In NY we have to change our affiliation before the last general election in order to vote in the next primary. Although had i been a first time voter I could register two weeks before the primary and vote. Fuck this state.)

All I know is that I will not vote for Hillary under any circumstances. So I'm left with Trump or Johnson.


#9

For a while, I thought that Cruz and Ryan would make a powerful combination for economic change (IF Cruz did not get derailed by trying to repeal the ACA and "social" issues....however one wishes to define that...)


#10

Repealing the ACA is exactly the the type of economic change that Cruz and Ryan could have collaborated on. One of the largest in fact.


#11

Too bad this year could not have been Romney/Ryan it might have been an easy win. Hillary just does not have the support of all the liberals like Obama does so you'd think this year would be easier. I think the only candidate this time that might have had a chance was Rubio. I'm not sure my voting has really changed but as of now and in the future its libertarian, unless the Republican has a chance of winning. They say voting 3rd party is throwing your vote away, so is Trump this time around. So the real choices are Hillary or help support a 3rd party that at least might bring them some attention to help in later years.


#12

Fights over the ACA (and it's repeal) have proven over and over again to suck up valuable time, money and political Capital.

My feeling is that there may be "smaller" issues than the ACA...but ones that could garner more bi-partisan support.

(Wishful thinking...I know...!)


#13

It's interesting, sufiandy...

It seems like so many people were politically "off" in their timing over the past few years...

Jeb...Christie...Romney/Ryan...Rubio...

But who could have predicted in their wildest, hallucinogenic dreams...Trump?

It is all kind of surreal if you really think about it...


#14

The worst part about the primary season, Trump and Clinton are the two nominees chosen by the people of this country. How sad is that?

During the primaries, I was very hopeful for Carson, yet that went no where. I vote according to if they are pro-LIFE or not. Sure Trump claims to be for life, yet he has no plans to repeal Roe v. Wade and with no plan, he would never get my vote.

Clinton is worse than Barry and if she is elected I will be stock pilling ammo and food. Clinton scares the crap out of me. In my opinion Barry was elected because people wanted to appear they were not racist so they voted for a "black man." Clinton will get votes simply because she is a woman.

Another scary issue, the majority of Catholics voted for Barry during both elections, in 2008 and 2012. Clinton is on track to have even more Catholics voting for her! She wants to expand abortions and Catholics support her!! What the fuck!?!?

Come November I am going to vote for a person who agrees with every single issue on the table, I am writing my name in. I refuse to support anyone who supports the open slaughter of innocent children. Kneedragger79 for President!


#15

I certainly see nothing wrong with one voting their conscience and convictions, kneedragger.

Question...why would Clinton winning lead you to stockpile ammo and food?

(I'm just curious...)


#16

Pretty much exactly this.


#17

Pretty accurate description of my perspective. I liked Kasich from the beginning, didn't agree with everything he said but I liked his fiscal policies and experience governing instaed of just talking. I would've easily voted for Rubio, Fiorina, Bush, Christie, Paul, Jindal, and probably a few others I can't remember off the top of my head. Cruz probably could've convinced me solely on the fact that Paul Ryan could've gotten some good things done. Trump is an embarrasment.

If the dems would have put up a reasonable candidate I would've voted for him/her, but fiscal policies are the most important to me and Hillary/Bernie don't have any good ones from my point of view.

Gary Johnson is the only person left I can actually be ok with supporting. I hope one day the GOP can re-think some of its social stances or the libertarians can re-evaluate their isolationist attitude.


#18

Drew:

Let me add...

Because of the Trump circus...it is completely forgotten that Ryan was working HARD to "re-brand" the GOP with both his Poverty and Immigration initiatives. (As well as very sound and strong economic initiatives that he was anxious to work on with a new GOP President and a secure GOP House. Even the Senate was within reach).

Then in less than 2-3 weeks (I remember it WELL...)...Trump set the party back 50 years.


#19

In 2016 we've got two great examples of why the two-party system doesn't work.

On one side, we have a demagogue who was able to infiltrate a party and basically arrange a hostile takeover by appealing to the misdirected anger and fears and prejudices of the masses. Despite the fact that his views don't necessarily align with the party faithful, he was able to take advantage of the primary and nomination process to secure the reluctant support of many political heavyweights. Its notable that many of his ardent supporters were not previously Republicans and likely are first-time voters.

On the other side, we have a party who's hierarchy actively tried to sabotage the campaign of a very charismatic and popular candidate so their preferred candidate could be nominated. Now it depends how much of the "voter suppression" conspiracy theory you buy, but now with the leaked e-mails its pretty obvious there was at least some collusion to basically make sure the party members' voices mattered less than those in charge.

The end result? The two least-palatable candidates in modern election history. If Kasich won the GOP nomination he would be destroying Hillary right now. But this horrible process has rendered rational thought obsolete.


#20

The Press is calling it:

"... Ryan's Bummer Summer..."