T Nation

Powerlifting records??

Deos anyone else think alot of the powerlifting records now are almost worthless? I read where a guy from westside recently missed a 750lb. bench , not cause he could not do it but because HIS SHIRT WAS SO TIGHT HE COULD NOT LOWER THE BAR TO HIS CHEST!! I mean come on, that means his shit could support 750lbs.!! would it realy mean anything if he had made it?

i don’t think they are worthless. and the equipment doesnt really lift the weigths, but in some cases it helps A LOT. I do agree though, somewhat and i definately am not “pro-equipment.” reminds me of this one Dr. Squat article, where he met this russian OL trainer. The guy says, “Here we call your lifts the fake lifts, because you have all that equipment doing them for you” or something like that.

the deadlift still means something but 'dats it.

This is a pretty big can of worms you opened up here… The RAW advocates agree with you because they feel that equipment inflates a lifter’s actual numbers… While this is true to an extent, the equipment advocates say that equipment is ok because a) each federation clearly states what equipment is allowed, so everyone is on a level playing field, b) equipment will only help a lift by a small margin - most PL’ers are still strong SOB’s even without equipment, and c) equipment plays a role in safety. I’ll be the first to admit that equipment is going to add to someone’s totals, but even if a squat suit added 50 lbs to someone’s squat, that would mean that several elite PL’ers could still squat 900+ lbs without equipment. I say let the RAW lifters lift RAW and let the equipment lifters lift with equipment. It’s just a preference.

I believe they are worthless as far at looking at realistic goals for the average person who wants to compare where they stand versus a pro powerlifter.

I disagree with dman in that I have read a lifting shirt can put as much as 100 pounds on a lift. Even the deadlift is helped by the body suits that ehlps on out of the bottom of the lift.

I know that a shirt can add OVER 100# to some benches, I’ve seen people add around 75-100 to a 500lb bench and when you think about it its realy based on %, the bigger the bench to start the more the shirt can add (depends on the type of bencher,ect…) can anyone imagine what Kazmier(sp?) would be doing in his prime today w/ all the new suits, drugs (GH for example). he has to be the strongest man that ever lived. a true FRRREEEEEEK (in a good way)oh, and atleast the deadlift is helped the least. peace

Keep in mind that there are different types of shirts. Single ply, double ply, triple ply, denim or polyester, velcro straps in back or no straps… More often than not the single ply poly shirts are used and accepted in feds. Some feds accept double ply and triple ply (triple ply in my opinion is a joke). I’m not sure about a 100 lb increase but if you would never see this sort of increase with a single ply anything.

I believe you are speaking about George Halbert. I do not want to spark an equipment debate but would like to make some facts known. Geroge benched in the 680’s at the arnold classic in the 198 class with a shirt. A few weeks after that he hit a 645 in the gym without any equipment. This is alittle over 40 pounds carry over. Next George decided to see what he could bench if he went up to the 220 class and did not have to worry about making weight. He went to a bench meet in Toledo, Ohio and did the 750 about 3 to 4 inches off his chest. Yes, the shirt was too tight. It was the same one he used at the classic, when he was in the 198 class. It does not matter how much you can bench if the shirt is too small, the weight will not come down! His mistake was not having a bigger shirt. Bottom line is, when George figures the shirt out your going to see some crazy numbers. Some lifters are getting over 100 pounds with their shirt but many others are not. For example Glen Chabot benched 670 without a shirt and JM Blakely and Kenny patterson are not far behind with raw benches in the 650 range. What if they got 100 pounds!

the biggest problem i have is that nowaday records are often higher than old ones. Why? sometimes because of better training/genetics, fine thats ok by me. But sometimes its because of equipment. I don’t think old records should be overwritten, just because newer guys have better equipment than old guys did.

if he did 600+ raw thats special, I have seen people add 100lbs w/ a shirt but I do not know what kind of shirt it was. even if he did do 600+ raw what you are describeing still seems wrong, if the shirt he was wearing when he could not get 750lbs down to his chest was just a tinny bit bigger how much of the first 3-4 inches off his chest would realy be him? why not just hold bench comps. in a power rack? 'cause thats realy what alot of them are doing w/ their shirts anyway. I still can’t imagine what THE KAZ would be doing today if he was born 25yrs ago, he would be like a bigger coen on steroids, oh wait… never mind;-) peace

why is it that people will complain about powerlifting equipment as unfair or inappropriate, but no one seems to mind that all other sports with the possible exception of olympic lifting and the shot put have all benefited from the use of improved equipment. from lance armstrongs insanely light bike that he won the tour on to micheal johnson’s shoes in the olympics. to say that the old records are more important or shouldn’t be overwritten because of equipment seems to be short sighted. unless people are willing to compete butt naked with no physical alterations, i.e. no shaving for swimmers, i can’t help but feel that this whole concept is moot. as dave said george has benched in the mid 600s with no shirt, no matter how you stack it he is strong. if he wants to wear a shirt to help examine what is possible, then by all means have at it. equipment is alot like drugs, if you want to use then use, but be honest.