Poverty and Crime - What Can Be Done?

Off Topic Politics and World Issues
21

[quote]Dr J wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:
You can plan all you want, but without intact homes you can forget it. Want to help the poor with crime, education, and multi-generational poverty? Get the fathers back, and the parents married. Otherwise, all this talk is just to make ourselves thing we care. If you care, bring back shame and guilt.[/quote]

BINGO! I don’t believe you can “legislate” this into practice, so social or “peer” pressure seems the most appropriate strategy.[/quote]

Actually you can, but it would require repealing legislation, which in this in our country would be pretty difficult.

22

[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Sterilize criminals and the poor. If they can’t reproduce, no more poverty and crime. It’s science. [/quote]

It’s also immoral and doesn’t work. They tried a similar approach with the Irish. Evil isn’t this person and not that person, evil is in the heart.

23

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Sterilize criminals and the poor. If they can’t reproduce, no more poverty and crime. It’s science. [/quote]

It’s also immoral and doesn’t work. They tried a similar approach with the Irish. Evil isn’t this person and not that person, evil is in the heart. [/quote]

I was being sarcastic. The type of population controls that would be necessary to reduce poverty over the long term, and by extension reduce crime, would be too drastic for any moral person to agree to.

But I am glad you posted the Chesterton cover. Maybe I’ll post it over on the Christian Agenda thread for the folks who still can’t understand how a communist dictatorship can be theocratic.

24

[quote]Sloth wrote:
You can plan all you want, but without intact homes you can forget it. Want to help the poor with crime, education, and multi-generational poverty? Get the fathers back, and the parents married. Otherwise, all this talk is just to make ourselves thing we care. If you care, bring back shame and guilt.[/quote]

100% agreement here, but anytime anyone suggests this even black leaders. They get railroaded and complete shunned like they have leprosy.

25

[quote]Bauber wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:
You can plan all you want, but without intact homes you can forget it. Want to help the poor with crime, education, and multi-generational poverty? Get the fathers back, and the parents married. Otherwise, all this talk is just to make ourselves thing we care. If you care, bring back shame and guilt.[/quote]

100% agreement here, but anytime anyone suggests this even black leaders. They get railroaded and complete shunned like they have leprosy. [/quote]

I understand and agree with the sentiment that a strong family is the solution to a lot of these problems but what can actually be done to make this happen? These same generic answers always come up, but I’ve never heard of actual steps to make them happen. Teenage pregnancy and deadbeat dads are already highly stigmatized in our culture but that doesn’t stop them from being commonplace. Can something actually be done? Do we have to give up on certain people?

26

[quote]CroatianRage wrote:

[quote]Bauber wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:
You can plan all you want, but without intact homes you can forget it. Want to help the poor with crime, education, and multi-generational poverty? Get the fathers back, and the parents married. Otherwise, all this talk is just to make ourselves thing we care. If you care, bring back shame and guilt.[/quote]

100% agreement here, but anytime anyone suggests this even black leaders. They get railroaded and complete shunned like they have leprosy. [/quote]

I understand and agree with the sentiment that a strong family is the solution to a lot of these problems but what can actually be done to make this happen? These same generic answers always come up, but I’ve never heard of actual steps to make them happen. Teenage pregnancy and deadbeat dads are already highly stigmatized in our culture but that doesn’t stop them from being commonplace. Can something actually be done? Do we have to give up on certain people?
[/quote]

It is socially stigmatized in some cultures, not so much in others. However, when you subsidize a behavior…it has a tendency to increase. Back in the day, if a woman was pregnant with no husband to help, she went to the Church and they would help her, but they wouldn’t enable her. With our current system, we just enable her and ultimately take away her autonomy.

27

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]CroatianRage wrote:

[quote]Bauber wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:
You can plan all you want, but without intact homes you can forget it. Want to help the poor with crime, education, and multi-generational poverty? Get the fathers back, and the parents married. Otherwise, all this talk is just to make ourselves thing we care. If you care, bring back shame and guilt.[/quote]

100% agreement here, but anytime anyone suggests this even black leaders. They get railroaded and complete shunned like they have leprosy. [/quote]

I understand and agree with the sentiment that a strong family is the solution to a lot of these problems but what can actually be done to make this happen? These same generic answers always come up, but I’ve never heard of actual steps to make them happen. Teenage pregnancy and deadbeat dads are already highly stigmatized in our culture but that doesn’t stop them from being commonplace. Can something actually be done? Do we have to give up on certain people?
[/quote]

It is socially stigmatized in some cultures, not so much in others. However, when you subsidize a behavior…it has a tendency to increase. Back in the day, if a woman was pregnant with no husband to help, she went to the Church and they would help her, but they wouldn’t enable her. With our current system, we just enable her and ultimately take away her autonomy. [/quote]

Nailed it man. But my question is how do we fix it in its current state? The system is so broken. Do you just let them starve? Because without cutting them off I don’t see how it will ever stop. The system caters to letting people be leeches.

28

[quote]Bauber wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]CroatianRage wrote:

[quote]Bauber wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:
You can plan all you want, but without intact homes you can forget it. Want to help the poor with crime, education, and multi-generational poverty? Get the fathers back, and the parents married. Otherwise, all this talk is just to make ourselves thing we care. If you care, bring back shame and guilt.[/quote]

100% agreement here, but anytime anyone suggests this even black leaders. They get railroaded and complete shunned like they have leprosy. [/quote]

I understand and agree with the sentiment that a strong family is the solution to a lot of these problems but what can actually be done to make this happen? These same generic answers always come up, but I’ve never heard of actual steps to make them happen. Teenage pregnancy and deadbeat dads are already highly stigmatized in our culture but that doesn’t stop them from being commonplace. Can something actually be done? Do we have to give up on certain people?
[/quote]

It is socially stigmatized in some cultures, not so much in others. However, when you subsidize a behavior…it has a tendency to increase. Back in the day, if a woman was pregnant with no husband to help, she went to the Church and they would help her, but they wouldn’t enable her. With our current system, we just enable her and ultimately take away her autonomy. [/quote]

Nailed it man. But my question is how do we fix it in its current state? The system is so broken. Do you just let them starve? Because without cutting them off I don’t see how it will ever stop. The system caters to letting people be leeches. [/quote]

I don’t think they’ll starve, I think people will start to go to find work and others will step in to help out those in need until they get on their feet. Those men that don’t pay for their children will be found and will be required to support their children once the women aren’t able to just get on support.

29

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]Bauber wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]CroatianRage wrote:

[quote]Bauber wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:
You can plan all you want, but without intact homes you can forget it. Want to help the poor with crime, education, and multi-generational poverty? Get the fathers back, and the parents married. Otherwise, all this talk is just to make ourselves thing we care. If you care, bring back shame and guilt.[/quote]

100% agreement here, but anytime anyone suggests this even black leaders. They get railroaded and complete shunned like they have leprosy. [/quote]

I understand and agree with the sentiment that a strong family is the solution to a lot of these problems but what can actually be done to make this happen? These same generic answers always come up, but I’ve never heard of actual steps to make them happen. Teenage pregnancy and deadbeat dads are already highly stigmatized in our culture but that doesn’t stop them from being commonplace. Can something actually be done? Do we have to give up on certain people?
[/quote]

It is socially stigmatized in some cultures, not so much in others. However, when you subsidize a behavior…it has a tendency to increase. Back in the day, if a woman was pregnant with no husband to help, she went to the Church and they would help her, but they wouldn’t enable her. With our current system, we just enable her and ultimately take away her autonomy. [/quote]

Nailed it man. But my question is how do we fix it in its current state? The system is so broken. Do you just let them starve? Because without cutting them off I don’t see how it will ever stop. The system caters to letting people be leeches. [/quote]

I don’t think they’ll starve, I think people will start to go to find work and others will step in to help out those in need until they get on their feet. Those men that don’t pay for their children will be found and will be required to support their children once the women aren’t able to just get on support. [/quote]

Required by who though? The courts? That is a long lengthy drawn out process. Saw my aunt go through it with her deadbeat ex. Lucky for her she has a good career and could afford the legal bills.

Most of these people have zero skills, initiative, or want to find work. And don’t forget the huge outcry you would see from liberals, NAACP, etc if you ever made them actually do something.