T Nation

Posterior Pelvic Tilt/Swayback Posture Help


#1

So I made a thread a few months ago (jacked up scapula, need help) and got a ton of amazing feedback which leads me to creating this post. One person noticed I was extremely extended because of my toned up rhomboids and other extensor muscles and pointed me to the direction of an online mobility specialist. I took countless pictures and videos and he said the overall theme I was having is hyperlordosis with a loss of kyphosis( anterior pelvic tilt) which I was then given a list of things to do and no progress was made.

So I further looked into it and got a second opinion from another coach and he actually noticed I have swayback posture, no hyperlordosis/anterior pelvic tilt (the complete opposite actually). From my sitting view you can see I actually have a posterior pelvic tilt and my upper body leans back to keep me upright (very easily mistaken for anterior pelvic tilt). Reason I’m positing for a solution is I’ve been having headaches for a long time now trying to correct upper body posture with little improvements so I looked into it further and saw my pelvis is the root cause.

I play high level volleyball which is definitely something I think is the root cause and the fact that I almost always do a terrible stretching routine before playing. I’m also a phys Ed graduate so I know most anatomy and researched posterior pelvic tipping and from my understanding it’s from too much hip extension, i.e. my glutes/hamstrings are too tight.

This is extremely accurate in my case I’m extremely inflexible with my hammies and glutes so I’m starting to really stretch them both daily but my question is can this tilt be caused soley of my muscles not being flexible or is it a muscular imbalance of my hip flexors/quads/ lower back(even though I’m very hypertrophied in each). Again I stress I play high level volleyball and have pretty massive quads, no homo. Thanks for the help everyone! Really need to figure out how to attack this aggressively.

The photos below show the pelvic tilt sitting down with my rectus being tight as well.


#2

Posting a single picture of your resting posture from the side (standing) will put the posterior/ anterior pelvic tilt issue to bed very quickly. You can’t tell much of anything from the picture you posted above.


#3

Yeah I actually posted a picture from the side in the original post, must not have made it…


#4

[quote]TrevorLPT wrote:
Posting a single picture of your resting posture from the side (standing) will put the posterior/ anterior pelvic tilt issue to bed very quickly. You can’t tell much of anything from the picture you posted above. [/quote]

This one was suppose to load idk why it didn’t


#5

Looks like a classic extended posture to me. I don’t see anything indicating a swayback or posterior tilt.


#6

That left rib flair is extremely telling, though.


#7

Here, this is you: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hBvVSDHc7Hw


#8

That def does seem like me, so this isn’t a muscle imbalance it’s my breathing being messed up and having accessory muscles kick in too much causing neck tension? And ways to fixing this pattern is by breathing exercises if I’m not mistaken? Thanks again for all your help so far man I do appreciate it.


#9

[quote]TrevorLPT wrote:
Here, this is you: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hBvVSDHc7Hw[/quote]

I understand that twisting mechanism of the lev slightly, does that make it could be a rotation issue that might be at the root cause? Like volleyball I’m crazy one sided and always twisting to my right side And his focus at the end seemed to want to bring back the left scap or something, I’m just spit balling w that ha


#10

[quote]Ntvolleyball16 wrote:
That def does seem like me, so this isn’t a muscle imbalance it’s my breathing being messed up and having accessory muscles kick in too much causing neck tension? And ways to fixing this pattern is by breathing exercises if I’m not mistaken? Thanks again for all your help so far man I do appreciate it.
[/quote]

Breathing and biomechanics are intimately linked. That said, I would definitely advise that you stop chasing “muscular imbalances” as the cause of your issues. Priority #1 would be to restore the relationship between your lower rib cage and diaphragm (Zone Of Apposition) so that your diaphragm can fulfill it’s respiratory functions properly.

A 90:90 Hip lift is one powerful tool for doing this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GoqjoEXaAw

An assessment would be needed by a PRI certified professional to assure that you receive the proper exercises. What exercises did Lance tell you to do and how often did you do them? Are you confident that you did them properly?


#11

[quote]TrevorLPT wrote:

[quote]Ntvolleyball16 wrote:
That def does seem like me, so this isn’t a muscle imbalance it’s my breathing being messed up and having accessory muscles kick in too much causing neck tension? And ways to fixing this pattern is by breathing exercises if I’m not mistaken? Thanks again for all your help so far man I do appreciate it.
[/quote]

Breathing and biomechanics are intimately linked. That said, I would definitely advise that you stop chasing “muscular imbalances” as the cause of your issues. Priority #1 would be to restore the relationship between your lower rib cage and diaphragm (Zone Of Apposition) so that your diaphragm can fulfill it’s respiratory functions properly.

A 90:90 Hip lift is one powerful tool for doing this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GoqjoEXaAw

An assessment would be needed by a PRI certified professional to assure that you receive the proper exercises. What exercises did Lance tell you to do and how often did you do them? Are you confident that you did them properly?[/quote]

Thanks I will def try this one later! He gave me a handful of exercises, one being the rockback and a few core stability exercises but gave me the key hint of focusing on exhaling fully.
What you’re describing does seem like it really describes me but from what I’m reading on the zone and all this anatomy is this seems like more of a philosophy from somewhere, is that accurate? Once normal breathing patterns are being used will it stay as such or will faulty breathing mechanics just come right back? Thank you


#12

Yes, exhalation is key. The balloon will be very helpful in this regard.

I’m not sure what you mean when you say it seems like a philosophy from somewhere. Can you clarify?

Breathing patterns can be retrained, so permanent progress can be made.


#13

[quote]TrevorLPT wrote:
Yes, exhalation is key. The balloon will be very helpful in this regard.

I’m not sure what you mean when you say it seems like a philosophy from somewhere. Can you clarify?

Breathing patterns can be retrained, so permanent progress can be made. [/quote]

I meant isn’t this faulty breathing pattern and zoa that causes many problems more of a theory and a study rather than definite fact? More or less I just meant I’ve never heard anything about it before but now it makes a ton of sense and easily correlates to what I have going on since my breathing has been messed up since all these symptoms came about some time ago.


#14

[quote]Ntvolleyball16 wrote:

[quote]TrevorLPT wrote:
Yes, exhalation is key. The balloon will be very helpful in this regard.

I’m not sure what you mean when you say it seems like a philosophy from somewhere. Can you clarify?

Breathing patterns can be retrained, so permanent progress can be made. [/quote]

I meant isn’t this faulty breathing pattern and zoa that causes many problems more of a theory and a study rather than definite fact? More or less I just meant I’ve never heard anything about it before but now it makes a ton of sense and easily correlates to what I have going on since my breathing has been messed up since all these symptoms came about some time ago.[/quote]

Short answer: the methods used by the Postural Restoration Institute work and have been adopted by many of the best physical therapists and athletic trainers in the country. It is an evidence-based approach.

Slightly longer answer: my limited understanding as an outsider is that PRI techniques have come under criticism by certain physical therapists who are unwilling to accept that they are wrong about some fundamental truths about anatomy, neurology, and the nature of pain. It is largely a political problem within the field. As the body of evidence supporting PRI’s claims and techniques have grown, these criticisms have become less common and less credible.

My personal opinion is that the “mobilize this side of the joint and strengthen that side of the joint” approach to addressing movement issues has gained so much traction (at least within the fitness industry) because it is relatively simple to understand and, accordingly, use to position yourself as an expert on the internet. It is easy to write an article about how you should stretch your hip flexors and do glute bridges, and at the same time it makes you appear relatively knowledgable to the uninformed. I believe this is why people within the fitness industry like to write such articles, and why that school of thought has become ubiquitous.


#15

[quote]TrevorLPT wrote:

[quote]Ntvolleyball16 wrote:

[quote]TrevorLPT wrote:
Yes, exhalation is key. The balloon will be very helpful in this regard.

I’m not sure what you mean when you say it seems like a philosophy from somewhere. Can you clarify?

Breathing patterns can be retrained, so permanent progress can be made. [/quote]

I meant isn’t this faulty breathing pattern and zoa that causes many problems more of a theory and a study rather than definite fact? More or less I just meant I’ve never heard anything about it before but now it makes a ton of sense and easily correlates to what I have going on since my breathing has been messed up since all these symptoms came about some time ago.[/quote]

Short answer: the methods used by the Postural Restoration Institute work and have been adopted by many of the best physical therapists and athletic trainers in the country. It is an evidence-based approach.

Slightly longer answer: my limited understanding as an outsider is that PRI techniques have come under criticism by certain physical therapists who are unwilling to accept that they are wrong about some fundamental truths about anatomy, neurology, and the nature of pain. It is largely a political problem within the field. As the body of evidence supporting PRI’s claims and techniques have grown, these criticisms have become less common and less credible.

My personal opinion is that the “mobilize this side of the joint and strengthen that side of the joint” approach to addressing movement issues has gained so much traction (at least within the fitness industry) because it is relatively simple to understand and, accordingly, use to position yourself as an expert on the internet. It is easy to write an article about how you should stretch your hip flexors and do glute bridges, and at the same time it makes you appear relatively knowledgable to the uninformed. I believe this is why people within the fitness industry like to write such articles, and why that school of thought has become ubiquitous. [/quote]

Very interesting, that’s really the reason I wasn’t sure this was the problem because I haven’t heard of it and have been drowning myself w muscle imbalance since it started happening with little to some result ha. It seems to make sense because symptoms/ headache get worse with physical activity then I feel better when I’m done and for a fitness freak/ volleyball nut that’s torturous. And it makes logical sense from the standpoint I can’t inhale fully because I’m starting off inhaled already and I can see how it would effect the body as a whole, so I’m really gonna try this 90-90 exercise and the one you gave me previously to get these ribs down and get my workout life back!!!


#16

I HIGHLY suggest finding yourself a PRI certified therapist to go to. This is not something I can help you with with any sort of certainty, especially over the internet. The exercises I gave you are good general starting point, but if you want it fixed you need to work with someone who can assess you and give you exercises that correspond to your individual pattern.

Get a balloon, try the 90:90 Hip Lift exactly as described for 5 sets and post any changes. You should notice an immediate change in your range of motion (a simple toe touch can be a good test here – just make sure you’re not holding your breath) and the visible appearance of your rib cage (the bottom few ribs should be no longer “sticking out”). These changes are acute but can become chronic with consistent practice.

Other points of interest: Changes in shoulder internal rotation and flexion, hip internal rotation, and resting heart rate. You can measure each before and after administering the exercise to see if there are any positive changes.


#17

[quote]TrevorLPT wrote:
I HIGHLY suggest finding yourself a PRI certified therapist to go to. This is not something I can help you with with any sort of certainty, especially over the internet. The exercises I gave you are good general starting point, but if you want it fixed you need to work with someone who can assess you and give you exercises that correspond to your individual pattern.

Get a balloon, try the 90:90 Hip Lift exactly as described for 5 sets and post any changes. You should notice an immediate change in your range of motion (a simple toe touch can be a good test here – just make sure you’re not holding your breath) and the visible appearance of your rib cage (the bottom few ribs should be no longer “sticking out”). These changes are acute but can become chronic with consistent practice.

Other points of interest: Changes in shoulder internal rotation and flexion, hip internal rotation, and resting heart rate. You can measure each before and after administering the exercise to see if there are any positive changes. [/quote]

Tried it for the first time, feel like my body can relax a bit more so it’s definitely something I’ll be doing, neck tension seemed to go down a little as well. From what I’ve been reading up on this it seems that this exercise and ones like it correct a whole list of things from shoulder impingement to neck pain, and I even saw that Nebraska girls Vball team apparently uses this method as well for shoulder/back pain. You really can’t overdue proper breathing patterns so there’s probably no limit on how many times I say this should be done right? Thank you