T Nation

Post Your Oral Only Cycles

In order to clear up some of the “clutter” on here lately I have opened this thread up so ALL oral only cycles can go here. I’ll open the floor to some of the more wise contributors to tell you why its not the greatest. (It would be great if mods could help us out?)

Can anyone chime in on the most ideal first oral cycle here?

Stats for this person:
29 years old
Impeccable nutrition
Impeccable training
5 10
Good lean physique
Gym : long enough.

Injectables are out of the question. This person would love do do test E only for his first. For more than ten solid reasons. Not going to fit the bill tho.

Any suggestions on ones with most or least sides. Persons not looking for a laid out plan here just basic suggestions to conversate about.

Having done 2 oral only cycles in my younger years, I will regretably chime in on this. My first oral only was Dbol at 30mg/day for 4 weeks, I was 20 at the time, didn’t know any better, and def wasn’t lurking on a quality forum like this. I gained some strength for sure, probably gained 10lbs of mass, kept minimal, although it was easier to gain that weight back in the future as I had already been that weight. Dbol gave me a great pump, watered look, but still were mild gains compared to what I expected. Workouts were definately better, adding weight all the time.

My second was 70mg/day of Tbol, again being naive and thinking that orals were safer, never did research to back up my dumb thoughts. Tbol definately gave me a vascular look that I liked, but never the results I thought steroids should give me.

After quite a few years away from AAS I started researching religiously, that brought me to Tnation. Just reading the first few forum posts, not even the stickys I realized there was SO much I didn’t know. I then proceded to plan my first real cycle. I ended up deciding on a 12 week cycle of Test E 500mg/week, and EQ 400mg/week. Added in Adex at .25mg EOD and HCG 250iu week 3-12 with a proper 40/40/20/20 Nolvadex PCT. This cycle couldn’t compare to my oral only cycle, it was mind boggling actually. The gains, the feeling of being on, it was exactly what I expected. Made me want more, and made me research more and more. Also made me thankful that I came across this site and listened to what the vets were preaching. At the time Bonz and BBB were prolifically posting, making NOOBs seem like idiots. We were idiots, coming to this site with an open mind, blew my mind.

For those of you that want to do an oral only cycle, listen to the vets, they preach because theyve been there. They have the experience to talk the way they do. They don’t bash you because they think they’re better, they do it because they know better from first hand experience.

A friend of mine did a Anavar only cycle, he did about 60mg a day for about 5 months. He had the impression it was very mild, well his gains were mild but it shut him down hard none the less. He was taking 40mg of cialis just to hammer on his gf, that aint right. Hes about 6 months off now and after countless doctor visits and blood tests he’s getting back to normal. Mild or not being shutdown is being shutdown.

From my experience, I will not do an oral only cycle again, Test will be a base in all my future cycles. I used to be fairly concerned with needles, proper researche has vastly changed that opinion.

[quote]smalsh wrote:
Having done 2 oral only cycles in my younger years, I will regretably chime in on this. My first oral only was Dbol at 30mg/day for 4 weeks, I was 20 at the time, didn’t know any better, and def wasn’t lurking on a quality forum like this. I gained some strength for sure, probably gained 10lbs of mass, kept minimal, although it was easier to gain that weight back in the future as I had already been that weight. Dbol gave me a great pump, watered look, but still were mild gains compared to what I expected. Workouts were definately better, adding weight all the time.

My second was 70mg/day of Tbol, again being naive and thinking that orals were safer, never did research to back up my dumb thoughts. Tbol definately gave me a vascular look that I liked, but never the results I thought steroids should give me.

After quite a few years away from AAS I started researching religiously, that brought me to Tnation. Just reading the first few forum posts, not even the stickys I realized there was SO much I didn’t know. I then proceded to plan my first real cycle. I ended up deciding on a 12 week cycle of Test E 500mg/week, and EQ 400mg/week. Added in Adex at .25mg EOD and HCG 250iu week 3-12 with a proper 40/40/20/20 Nolvadex PCT. This cycle couldn’t compare to my oral only cycle, it was mind boggling actually. The gains, the feeling of being on, it was exactly what I expected. Made me want more, and made me research more and more. Also made me thankful that I came across this site and listened to what the vets were preaching. At the time Bonz and BBB were prolifically posting, making NOOBs seem like idiots. We were idiots, coming to this site with an open mind, blew my mind.

For those of you that want to do an oral only cycle, listen to the vets, they preach because theyve been there. They have the experience to talk the way they do. They don’t bash you because they think they’re better, they do it because they know better from first hand experience.

A friend of mine did a Anavar only cycle, he did about 60mg a day for about 5 months. He had the impression it was very mild, well his gains were mild but it shut him down hard none the less. He was taking 40mg of cialis just to hammer on his gf, that aint right. Hes about 6 months off now and after countless doctor visits and blood tests he’s getting back to normal. Mild or not being shutdown is being shutdown.

From my experience, I will not do an oral only cycle again, Test will be a base in all my future cycles. I used to be fairly concerned with needles, proper researche has vastly changed that opinion. [/quote]

Smash, thanks a lot for that quality info. Much appreciated.
I got another question to throw out there. And not trying to beat a dead horse either. Let’s say Jectionss for the guy is totally out of the question. Not cause he’s afraid of it. It’s just minuses from the equation due to certain circumstances period.
What would be the ideal oral to take. Taking into account side effects. Strength. Gains.

And on a second note , are orals only so bad to the point if you can’t do jects that you should not do gear period for that extra edge.

[quote]GymTimeNYC wrote:

[quote]smalsh wrote:
Having done 2 oral only cycles in my younger years, I will regretably chime in on this. My first oral only was Dbol at 30mg/day for 4 weeks, I was 20 at the time, didn’t know any better, and def wasn’t lurking on a quality forum like this. I gained some strength for sure, probably gained 10lbs of mass, kept minimal, although it was easier to gain that weight back in the future as I had already been that weight. Dbol gave me a great pump, watered look, but still were mild gains compared to what I expected. Workouts were definately better, adding weight all the time.

My second was 70mg/day of Tbol, again being naive and thinking that orals were safer, never did research to back up my dumb thoughts. Tbol definately gave me a vascular look that I liked, but never the results I thought steroids should give me.

After quite a few years away from AAS I started researching religiously, that brought me to Tnation. Just reading the first few forum posts, not even the stickys I realized there was SO much I didn’t know. I then proceded to plan my first real cycle. I ended up deciding on a 12 week cycle of Test E 500mg/week, and EQ 400mg/week. Added in Adex at .25mg EOD and HCG 250iu week 3-12 with a proper 40/40/20/20 Nolvadex PCT. This cycle couldn’t compare to my oral only cycle, it was mind boggling actually. The gains, the feeling of being on, it was exactly what I expected. Made me want more, and made me research more and more. Also made me thankful that I came across this site and listened to what the vets were preaching. At the time Bonz and BBB were prolifically posting, making NOOBs seem like idiots. We were idiots, coming to this site with an open mind, blew my mind.

For those of you that want to do an oral only cycle, listen to the vets, they preach because theyve been there. They have the experience to talk the way they do. They don’t bash you because they think they’re better, they do it because they know better from first hand experience.

A friend of mine did a Anavar only cycle, he did about 60mg a day for about 5 months. He had the impression it was very mild, well his gains were mild but it shut him down hard none the less. He was taking 40mg of cialis just to hammer on his gf, that aint right. Hes about 6 months off now and after countless doctor visits and blood tests he’s getting back to normal. Mild or not being shutdown is being shutdown.

From my experience, I will not do an oral only cycle again, Test will be a base in all my future cycles. I used to be fairly concerned with needles, proper researche has vastly changed that opinion. [/quote]

Smash, thanks a lot for that quality info. Much appreciated.
I got another question to throw out there. And not trying to beat a dead horse either. Let’s say Jectionss for the guy is totally out of the question. Not cause he’s afraid of it. It’s just minuses from the equation due to certain circumstances period.
What would be the ideal oral to take. Taking into account side effects. Strength. Gains.

And on a second note , are orals only so bad to the point if you can’t do jects that you should not do gear period for that extra edge.

[/quote]

I just find it hard to believe there’s not a semi quality stack out there. But I don’t even know close to enough to say that as well. So I’ll totally be listening

Theres no doubt that orals work, pound per mg Dbol and Anadrol are possibly the stongest steroids available in terms of mass and strength. Quality mass is a different story as especially Anadrol produces a huge amount of water retention. For the average joe that does a random cycle of dbol or anadrol because their buddies gave them some pills, the results will be blinding. Some could gain upwards of 30lbs of mass in 4-6 weeks. To them it will be heaven in a pill.

The stories told by the amateur lifter taking these drugs is that they are so amazing, obviously them having little knowledge. My one friend told me when I was researching prior to my last cyle, “you’re always going to lose the weight you gain” I laughed and laughed and laughed, and responded, people like you will yes.

When you think about gaining and losing weight in terms of time, it takes a good amount of time to gain quality muscle, and lose only fat, regardless if you’re using AAS or not. Theres a reason why pro bodybuilders natural or not take a good amount of time dieting down and slowly losing fat, keeping muscle before a comp. It isn’t done in 4 weeks. The same goes for gaining muscle, it takes time.

Any quick fixes don’t generally last, that works with pretty much everything in life. People that take water cutters can lose 5-10lbs of water, depending on body type, in a short time. Guess what happens when they stop, it all comes back. If you gain majority water weight, you will lose the water weight quickly after as well.

Due to the liver toxicity of Dbol and Anadrol (really the only 2 big oral mass builders) you can only run them for 4-6 weeks. Your body doesn’t have time to build say 75% muscle of mass gained. To me I think of them as a fake high, obviously your lifts on them are real, but they don’t seem to last, unless you’re supplementing with Test for a longer time after as well, with a proper PCT and AI. Dbol and Adrol are used best as kick starts to a good mass building cycle.

As for orals like Anavar or TBol, they seem to work great for at the end of a cycle to help tighten up your gains. Say drop some water while adding muscle prior to pct, or a bridge into PCT. These compounds alone, will make you a little more vascular, little harder, and give you a good pump in the gym, but won’t make you gain substantially at all, and really whats the point of being shutdown for a few pounds of mass.

If someone has the issue of not being able to use needles, for god knows why, I would generally say there is no point in cycling at all. There are plenty of natural lifters that look amazing compared a most NOOB steroid users. I can see certain athletes in this situation still wanting an edge and using maybe anavar or tbol to help with their workouts etc, IMO though you’re a cheater in that case, regardless of if you get away with it, which most do.

People will always endorse oral onlys, because naive people just like me assume they are safer and will get decent results. Tons of NOOBs start that way and hopefully some by coming to forums like this will rethink what they’ve heard from their friends. I will always run Test in my cycle, even if it’s a replacement dose like in my upcoming Tren cycle. My injectable will also be my highest mg steroid. I don’t know the science behind why orals alone don’t seem to work, but have experience them first hand. Hopefully another vet that knows the science side can chime in with some good knowledge. Fuck this is got long lol.

[quote]smalsh wrote:
Theres no doubt that orals work, pound per mg Dbol and Anadrol are possibly the stongest steroids available in terms of mass and strength. Quality mass is a different story as especially Anadrol produces a huge amount of water retention. For the average joe that does a random cycle of dbol or anadrol because their buddies gave them some pills, the results will be blinding. Some could gain upwards of 30lbs of mass in 4-6 weeks. To them it will be heaven in a pill.

The stories told by the amateur lifter taking these drugs is that they are so amazing, obviously them having little knowledge. My one friend told me when I was researching prior to my last cyle, “you’re always going to lose the weight you gain” I laughed and laughed and laughed, and responded, people like you will yes.

When you think about gaining and losing weight in terms of time, it takes a good amount of time to gain quality muscle, and lose only fat, regardless if you’re using AAS or not. Theres a reason why pro bodybuilders natural or not take a good amount of time dieting down and slowly losing fat, keeping muscle before a comp. It isn’t done in 4 weeks. The same goes for gaining muscle, it takes time.

Any quick fixes don’t generally last, that works with pretty much everything in life. People that take water cutters can lose 5-10lbs of water, depending on body type, in a short time. Guess what happens when they stop, it all comes back. If you gain majority water weight, you will lose the water weight quickly after as well.

Due to the liver toxicity of Dbol and Anadrol (really the only 2 big oral mass builders) you can only run them for 4-6 weeks. Your body doesn’t have time to build say 75% muscle of mass gained. To me I think of them as a fake high, obviously your lifts on them are real, but they don’t seem to last, unless you’re supplementing with Test for a longer time after as well, with a proper PCT and AI. Dbol and Adrol are used best as kick starts to a good mass building cycle.

As for orals like Anavar or TBol, they seem to work great for at the end of a cycle to help tighten up your gains. Say drop some water while adding muscle prior to pct, or a bridge into PCT. These compounds alone, will make you a little more vascular, little harder, and give you a good pump in the gym, but won’t make you gain substantially at all, and really whats the point of being shutdown for a few pounds of mass.

If someone has the issue of not being able to use needles, for god knows why, I would generally say there is no point in cycling at all. There are plenty of natural lifters that look amazing compared a most NOOB steroid users. I can see certain athletes in this situation still wanting an edge and using maybe anavar or tbol to help with their workouts etc, IMO though you’re a cheater in that case, regardless of if you get away with it, which most do.

People will always endorse oral onlys, because naive people just like me assume they are safer and will get decent results. Tons of NOOBs start that way and hopefully some by coming to forums like this will rethink what they’ve heard from their friends. I will always run Test in my cycle, even if it’s a replacement dose like in my upcoming Tren cycle. My injectable will also be my highest mg steroid. I don’t know the science behind why orals alone don’t seem to work, but have experience them first hand. Hopefully another vet that knows the science side can chime in with some good knowledge. Fuck this is got long lol.[/quote]

Smash thanks so much for all this info. Much appreciated! I got another question tho. Lol. What are the chances of running a cycle , let’s say test e only cycle, with spot on pct, of shutting down permanently. Assuming you do absolutely EVERYTHING right.

[quote]GymTimeNYC wrote:

Smash thanks so much for all this info. Much appreciated! I got another question tho. Lol. What are the chances of running a cycle , let’s say test e only cycle, with spot on pct, of shutting down permanently. Assuming you do absolutely EVERYTHING right. [/quote]

there’s always a chance

it’s unlikely tho

Now obviously going the oral only route is not the most ideal way to use AAS, but there are quality gains to be made with an oral run. The whole idea of oral only sucking generally comes from people who have used d-bol only, or another oral as a stand alone, and usually these folks are newbies to steroids, or relatively young in training experience…it also is a grandfathered idea. If a person uses orals in the short cycle method that Bll used to promote, they can get decent gains. Longer oral runs can also be effective.

The important thing is to be realistic with your goals and expectations.

8 weeks of var, or 4 weeks of d-bol is obviously not going to show the same results as 8 weeks of test and deca. But if you can`t make gains using steroids…even orals only… as an aid to enhance your training and diet, then failure is your own fault, not the choice of drugs. Stacking orals increases the benefit…stand alones are a no go if you want to go oral only. Something like drol, winny, var is a very decent stack. Of course you would keep the duration shorter, hence the leaning towards the short cycle route for those who want oral only. It is not for me, but lets be honest…it works, and some people can be happy with the results…it all boils down to your goals and expectations.

[quote]juice20jd wrote:
Now obviously going the oral only route is not the most ideal way to use AAS, but there are quality gains to be made with an oral run. The whole idea of oral only sucking generally comes from people who have used d-bol only, or another oral as a stand alone, and usually these folks are newbies to steroids, or relatively young in training experience…it also is a grandfathered idea. If a person uses orals in the short cycle method that Bll used to promote, they can get decent gains. Longer oral runs can also be effective.

The important thing is to be realistic with your goals and expectations.

8 weeks of var, or 4 weeks of d-bol is obviously not going to show the same results as 8 weeks of test and deca. But if you can`t make gains using steroids…even orals only… as an aid to enhance your training and diet, then failure is your own fault, not the choice of drugs. Stacking orals increases the benefit…stand alones are a no go if you want to go oral only. Something like drol, winny, var is a very decent stack. Of course you would keep the duration shorter, hence the leaning towards the short cycle route for those who want oral only. It is not for me, but lets be honest…it works, and some people can be happy with the results…it all boils down to your goals and expectations.[/quote]

Guys thanks a ton. Funny question but where do I start learning the basics of this stuff. I’m looking at these laid out cycles like Japanese. Any “beginner” readings you recommend. Book? E book?

[quote]GymTimeNYC wrote:

[quote]juice20jd wrote:
Now obviously going the oral only route is not the most ideal way to use AAS, but there are quality gains to be made with an oral run. The whole idea of oral only sucking generally comes from people who have used d-bol only, or another oral as a stand alone, and usually these folks are newbies to steroids, or relatively young in training experience…it also is a grandfathered idea. If a person uses orals in the short cycle method that Bll used to promote, they can get decent gains. Longer oral runs can also be effective.

The important thing is to be realistic with your goals and expectations.

8 weeks of var, or 4 weeks of d-bol is obviously not going to show the same results as 8 weeks of test and deca. But if you can`t make gains using steroids…even orals only… as an aid to enhance your training and diet, then failure is your own fault, not the choice of drugs. Stacking orals increases the benefit…stand alones are a no go if you want to go oral only. Something like drol, winny, var is a very decent stack. Of course you would keep the duration shorter, hence the leaning towards the short cycle route for those who want oral only. It is not for me, but lets be honest…it works, and some people can be happy with the results…it all boils down to your goals and expectations.[/quote]

Guys thanks a ton. Funny question but where do I start learning the basics of this stuff. I’m looking at these laid out cycles like Japanese. Any “beginner” readings you recommend. Book? E book?
[/quote]

Once again I value your answers and time, best— Gtime

[quote]GymTimeNYC wrote:

[quote]GymTimeNYC wrote:

[quote]juice20jd wrote:
Now obviously going the oral only route is not the most ideal way to use AAS, but there are quality gains to be made with an oral run. The whole idea of oral only sucking generally comes from people who have used d-bol only, or another oral as a stand alone, and usually these folks are newbies to steroids, or relatively young in training experience…it also is a grandfathered idea. If a person uses orals in the short cycle method that Bll used to promote, they can get decent gains. Longer oral runs can also be effective.

The important thing is to be realistic with your goals and expectations.

8 weeks of var, or 4 weeks of d-bol is obviously not going to show the same results as 8 weeks of test and deca. But if you can`t make gains using steroids…even orals only… as an aid to enhance your training and diet, then failure is your own fault, not the choice of drugs. Stacking orals increases the benefit…stand alones are a no go if you want to go oral only. Something like drol, winny, var is a very decent stack. Of course you would keep the duration shorter, hence the leaning towards the short cycle route for those who want oral only. It is not for me, but lets be honest…it works, and some people can be happy with the results…it all boils down to your goals and expectations.[/quote]

Guys thanks a ton. Funny question but where do I start learning the basics of this stuff. I’m looking at these laid out cycles like Japanese. Any “beginner” readings you recommend. Book? E book?
[/quote]

Once again I value your answers and time, best— Gtime
[/quote]

read stuff by dan duchaine, william llwellyn, bill roberts, Cy Willson…read steroid profiles…read about short cycle theory (which oral only generally will be). All this can be found online, and a lot through this very sites search engine. Start there. If you really want to go oral only, type that subject into the search engine…there have been threads over the years that actually talk about it beyond the traditionalbromance response of, inject or GTFO, or its shit.

Again, not the most ideal way to do things, but with proper goals and expectations you can be happy with the results. The original MAG-10 and 4ad-ec were basically oral only steroids FFS…and people used them with good success.

I personally have done cycles of 100mg Dbol and 50mg Winny stacked together with huge amounts of alcohol (not a good idea) on holiday and have returned with bloods results of only SLIGHT elevation in liver enzymes but nothing worth crying about.

I think oral only cycles can work like Juice said, it depends on your own goals and situation.

SB

[quote]juice20jd wrote:

[quote]GymTimeNYC wrote:

[quote]GymTimeNYC wrote:

[quote]juice20jd wrote:
Now obviously going the oral only route is not the most ideal way to use AAS, but there are quality gains to be made with an oral run. The whole idea of oral only sucking generally comes from people who have used d-bol only, or another oral as a stand alone, and usually these folks are newbies to steroids, or relatively young in training experience…it also is a grandfathered idea. If a person uses orals in the short cycle method that Bll used to promote, they can get decent gains. Longer oral runs can also be effective.

The important thing is to be realistic with your goals and expectations.

8 weeks of var, or 4 weeks of d-bol is obviously not going to show the same results as 8 weeks of test and deca. But if you can`t make gains using steroids…even orals only… as an aid to enhance your training and diet, then failure is your own fault, not the choice of drugs. Stacking orals increases the benefit…stand alones are a no go if you want to go oral only. Something like drol, winny, var is a very decent stack. Of course you would keep the duration shorter, hence the leaning towards the short cycle route for those who want oral only. It is not for me, but lets be honest…it works, and some people can be happy with the results…it all boils down to your goals and expectations.[/quote]

Guys thanks a ton. Funny question but where do I start learning the basics of this stuff. I’m looking at these laid out cycles like Japanese. Any “beginner” readings you recommend. Book? E book?
[/quote]

Once again I value your answers and time, best— Gtime
[/quote]

read stuff by dan duchaine, william llwellyn, bill roberts, Cy Willson…read steroid profiles…read about short cycle theory (which oral only generally will be). All this can be found online, and a lot through this very sites search engine. Start there. If you really want to go oral only, type that subject into the search engine…there have been threads over the years that actually talk about it beyond the traditionalbromance response of, inject or GTFO, or its shit.

Again, not the most ideal way to do things, but with proper goals and expectations you can be happy with the results. The original MAG-10 and 4ad-ec were basically oral only steroids FFS…and people used them with good success. [/quote]

Juiced, I see years back you wrote some stuff regarding these two:

  • 6 weeks of turinabol (30-40 mg ED) with anavar (30-40 mg ED)
  • 4 weeks of anadrol (50-100 mg ED) with winny (50-100 mg ED)
    What can he expect from either? Differences advantages
    I left out d Bol one for a couple reasons.

What would you say the major difference is with these two.

As far as his goals, there realistic. I know he’s not going to blow up like he would on test. But what can he expect. He’s not looking for a miracle. His diet and training is spot on. Injecting is out of the pic for the person of interest let’s say. This person has LEGIT reasons for this. Otherwise he prolly already be doing a test only cycle injecting as he writes this. This guy let’s say wants to run this in June when it’s beach time only.

Anyone else’s thoughts please also.

Guys thanks again
And I’m doing my own research on this amd thanks for all the reading suggestions. Reading up and up and up.

Again , He ll be at 10% Bf when running anything if that means much here

The reason why oral only cycles are bad is because you can achieve the same level of development with exercise and diet. Steroids should be reserved for athletes and bodybuilders who want to be 100lbs over their genetic limit. Guys who want to look good naked should not be encouraged to use steroids.

if you want to run orals for longer than 2-4 weeks…then yeah i would lean towards a turinabol and var stack. shorter runs in the 2 on 2 off format, or a straight 4 weeker i would lean towards drol,winny and add var in as well. dbol is a fine choice as a substitute for drol. as a stand alone it can work…read Cy willsons never ending cycle article…but, stand alones with oral only are less effective overall.

no one is promoting the use of oral only. it is less ideal than standard inj cycles. but, lets be real here, people are going to use these substances whether or not you condemn it. people have their own goals and reasons behind choosing different methods. who is anyone to judge or say what is right or wrong. that is just ridiculous. his life his body his choices his reasons. oral only is not bad…just less ideal…goals and expectations adjusted appropriately, it can be very successful. drop the broism bullshit.

Juiced thanks a lot. On another note if this person was to find a way which he hasn’t yet to do injects. Test only cycle.

Can he get some advice in Everything absolutely needed. From pins to pills.

I, doing my studying but would like to hear it through Convo with people with experimence…

Last question is it at all possible to pin once a week. Or pin fri night and Sunday a.m.

Thanks juiced!

[quote]GymTimeNYC wrote:
Juiced thanks a lot. On another note if this person was to find a way which he hasn’t yet to do injects. Test only cycle.

Can he get some advice in Everything absolutely needed. From pins to pills.

I, doing my studying but would like to hear it through Convo with people with experimence…

Last question is it at all possible to pin once a week. Or pin fri night and Sunday a.m.

[/quote]

Gymtimenyc, does whatever it is that prevents your ‘friend’ from injecting also prevent them from making an account and asking these questions themselves?

[quote]lemony2j wrote:

[quote]GymTimeNYC wrote:
Juiced thanks a lot. On another note if this person was to find a way which he hasn’t yet to do injects. Test only cycle.

Can he get some advice in Everything absolutely needed. From pins to pills.

I, doing my studying but would like to hear it through Convo with people with experimence…

Last question is it at all possible to pin once a week. Or pin fri night and Sunday a.m.

[/quote]

Gymtimenyc, does whatever it is that prevents your ‘friend’ from injecting also prevent them from making an account and asking these questions themselves?[/quote]

Well he is from the USA I believe where AAS are illegal and I think its just a way of maintaining anonymity.

SB