T Nation

Pope: 'Pedos Not That Bad'

I can actually forgive this guy if he’s senile now, but if he’s not,
he’s got to go.

I don’t think he means what they’re trying to make it look like he means.

Yeah man, I’ll give it the small benefit of the doubt, friggin’ cacophonic faith anyway lol,
I’ve got a ton of crap I’m dealing with, no real peace right now, I hate this man made holiday
season. That, and too many financial issues to deal with, it’s front and
and center and it’s insurmountable…In other words, I’m in absolutely, positively NO
condition to be personally emailing ANYONE til this thing blows over,if it ever does. There comes a point
when one humbly asks for help for years, and at my age you almost just give up.
So, no offense dude, it is what it is at the moment.

I wanna help ya. And maybe we can help each other. I hope you change your mind and mail me.

This reads like a classic case of media (and certain individuals) taking a statement out of context.

Don’t get me wrong, I have no particular love for this pope, especially after he told Africans to avoid condoms, but everything about this story and the quotes in question seem like the words are being manipulated.

I do suspect that Pope Benedict is a man who has a tendency to over-intellectualize things, and it comes out in how he speaks/writes. This makes for a rational thinker (usually), but it gives a lot of fodder for manipulative media types.

Karado,

I can understand your frustration, just look at religion in the sense of your personal relationship with God. I hate the business and politics side of it, but there is little we can do about that.

I don’t think anyone can justify the priests who molested kids, I think the downfall of the Church was not removing these perverts immediately and allowing the good priests to preach the word.

Yeah man, I mean even if the one of the most popular Catholic Priests in America
fell and got busted with Cocaine and Women like “Father Corapi”, THEN began his own
Pseudo-Catholic sect or whatever with a menacing Wolf-like logo, then something’s amiss
in Christiandom, somthing’s wrong, the virus has infested the host, and only
God himself can fix it now because the damage is irreversable now.
And don’t get me started on the whacked out Christian Conspiracy theorists on
Youtube…what a mess, what friggin shit stained and muddy mess of followers this
Faith is attracting, it really just makes one want to just lose faith AGAIN just from the
insane people that are in it like “Jonathan Kleck” for one small example on YT, just nausiating
crap all around.
What a Tower Of Babel Christianity is now… and if there’s such a thing as
a relationship with God, why does it seem like he’s not “there” when one needs his
help big time? If he’s waiting for me to “behave” perfectly for him to “help” me, that seems like that
would be bullshit too because we have to power now never before in history to observe the
bad things that happen to good believers all over america that HAVE prayed, that have humbly asked for just
SOME kind of assistance, yet the prayers seem to go unanswered…something’s amiss,
it’s a mess…a big contaminated mess, I’m stepping back…I gotta step back.
I can’t explain it further because words would do no justice…and NO i’m not emailing
or PMing anyone…lol…no need to correspond if prayer “works”, not holding my breath on that one.

[quote]Karado wrote:
Yeah man, I mean even if the one of the most popular Catholic Priests in America
fell and got busted with Cocaine and Women like “Father Corapi”, THEN began his own
Pseudo-Catholic sect or whatever with a menacing Wolf-like logo, then something’s amiss
in Christiandom, somthing’s wrong, the virus has infested the host, and only
God himself can fix it now because the damage is irreversable now.
And don’t get started on the whacked out Christian Conspiracy theorists on
Youtube…what a mess, what friggin shit stained and muddy mess of followers this
Faith is attracting, it really just makes one want to just lose faith AGAIN just from the
insane people that are in it like “Jonathan Kleck” for one small example on YT, just nausiating
crap all around.
What a Tower Of Babel Christianity is now… and if there’s such a thing as
a relationship with God, why does it seem like he’s not “there” when one needs his
help big time? If he’s waiting for me to “behave” perfectly for him to “help” me, that seems like that
would be bullshit too because we have to power now never before in history to observe the
bad things that happen to good believers all over america that HAVE prayed, that have humbly asked for just
SOME kind of assistance, yet the prayers seem to go unanswered…something’s amiss,
it’s a mess…a big contaminated mess, I’m stepping back…I gotta step back.
I can’t explain it further because words would do no justice…and NO i’m not emailing
or PMing anyone…lol…no need to correspond if prayer “works”, not holding my breath on that one.

[/quote]
I gave you some of the answers in the Hijack Haven thread. Email me (I don’t bite)

Yeah I guess you did I recall…been too busy lately, I hope for you that
the joy you get from Christianiy is “real”, and not just a euphoric biological brain state similarly acheived
by the buddhist monks of Tibet.
Merry Christmas.

â??In the 1970s, paedophilia was theorised as something fully in conformity with man and even with children,â?? the Pope said.

â??It was maintained â?? even within the realm of Catholic theology â?? that there is no such thing as evil in itself or good in itself. There is only a â??better than’ and a â??worse than’. Nothing is good or bad in itself.â??

Read more: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/popersquos-child-porn-normal-claim-sparks-outrage-among-victims-15035449.html#ixzz2FyQ445FD

Moral relativism at its finest…

May the God you invented forgive you.

[quote]Karado wrote:
Yeah man, I mean even if the one of the most popular Catholic Priests in America
fell and got busted with Cocaine and Women like “Father Corapi”, THEN began his own
Pseudo-Catholic sect or whatever with a menacing Wolf-like logo, then something’s amiss
in Christiandom, somthing’s wrong, the virus has infested the host, and only
God himself can fix it now because the damage is irreversable now.
And don’t get me started on the whacked out Christian Conspiracy theorists on
Youtube…what a mess, what friggin shit stained and muddy mess of followers this
Faith is attracting, it really just makes one want to just lose faith AGAIN just from the
insane people that are in it like “Jonathan Kleck” for one small example on YT, just nausiating
crap all around.
What a Tower Of Babel Christianity is now… and if there’s such a thing as
a relationship with God, why does it seem like he’s not “there” when one needs his
help big time? If he’s waiting for me to “behave” perfectly for him to “help” me, that seems like that
would be bullshit too because we have to power now never before in history to observe the
bad things that happen to good believers all over america that HAVE prayed, that have humbly asked for just
SOME kind of assistance, yet the prayers seem to go unanswered…something’s amiss,
it’s a mess…a big contaminated mess, I’m stepping back…I gotta step back.
I can’t explain it further because words would do no justice…and NO i’m not emailing
or PMing anyone…lol…no need to correspond if prayer “works”, not holding my breath on that one.

[/quote]

Never give up. You make a bad situation worse by giving up. You think your abandoned, that there’s nobody home? Well the worst is yet to come if you give up. Pass the test don’t be a pussy. I have seen what happens when people get pissed off and give up on God…It’s ugly. You don’t know how much you are getting supported until you give up. Then you spiral, I have seen it first hand. It’s very predictable. Hard times come, person gets pissed off at God, then proceeds to act out and do a bunch of shit they regret and life spirals out of control… Happens each and every time like clockwork.

I have been through more hell than a lot of people, less then some, but I have been shit on, pissed on, kicked in the teeth, screwed in the ass, use what ever metaphor you want, and it’s not over. I stumble, I fall, but I get back up and I don’t give up no matter how much easier that seems to be…it’s worse.

For the record I hate Christmas too, it’s just a giant pain in the ass for me. There is no joy in it at all. Still I don’t give up.

Yeah, you know, I’m not giving up, I’m stepping back…Hard to put into words.
Ok, what’s your name? “Pat”, I’m NOT giving up Pat…I’m not, I’m gonna heed your warning
and hold you to what you just said to me, IF what you said is true…IF it is true.
Because if it is true what you just warned me about, if I DO NOT “give up” then the
EXACT POLAR OPPOSITE of what you just warned about, will transpire, and that would
be just wonderful, just fantastic…I’m holding you to that.
We’ll see what happens, I’ll be expecting something miraculous in my life soon.
Merry Christmas

You have the whole wrong attitude Karado. Not because you’re an idiot or an especially bad man, but because you have not submitted yourself to Him by being part of His body the church. He owes you nothing except eternity in hell and He is not stressed over whether you believe in Him or not. My joy is a happy symptom of my knowing what I deserve and what I’m receiving instead. The gospel is not about you and your mortal life. It’s about Jesus and what YOU can do for HIM during your time here. There are things in your life that must and WILL change if you are His. Happens every time. If not then you are simply not His. I wish you could believe that I want you to have what I have and that is my only motivation in anything I say to you. You are however in NO position to demand ANYTHING from the Lord.

ok, thx.

[quote]Karado wrote:
Yeah, you know, I’m not giving up, I’m stepping back…Hard to put into words.
Ok, what’s your name? “Pat”, I’m NOT giving up Pat…I’m not, I’m gonna heed your warning
and hold you to what you just said to me, IF what you said is true…IF it is true.
Because if it is true what you just warned me about, if I DO NOT “give up” then the
EXACT POLAR OPPOSITE of what you just warned about, will transpire, and that would
be just wonderful, just fantastic…I’m holding you to that.
We’ll see what happens, I’ll be expecting something miraculous in my life soon.
Merry Christmas
[/quote]
God works with wispers. Don’t expect firebolts and lightening. Otherwise, you’re right. Do the right thing and stay the course and you will see, for sure. I am positive.

Thx Pat, I really appreciate that, I treat peeps out there like I want to be treated.
I’ve done humble prayer/request techniques from Christian Mystics like Neville Goddard
in the past, his stuff is amazing and his recordings are on YT…I forget that sometimes,
and those techniques have WORKED, Neville’s info is generally suppressed, instead we’re
force fed by charlatans like Pat Robertson who said God told him Romney would be President,he said it twice in the space of two minutes…see where I’m coming from here?
No one seems to understand that even though one or two here have tried to justify that as
a ‘mistake’, or have verbally Jiu-Jitsu’d that Pat has saved more souls than I ever will.
I mean, what is this, a ‘see who saves more souls’ cosmic contest here?
I don’t have Pat’s money, I could never win that contest anyway.

It’s about truth and compassion for your fellow man, and that old attempting to scare the fuck
out of someone with eternal damnation is not how one will win me or anyone else over.
I posted earlier that I’ve “humbly” requested a little help in the past, then Tiribulus
warns that I shouldn’t “demand” things from the Lord…that’s not fair, not fair at all, I don’t
“demand” anything, that’s a very strong word, I said I “humbly” have asked, then a few posts later
I get told not to “demand”?..WTF.
I’m done with Tiribulus, nothing personal Tiribulus, but your style is too old school ‘fire and
brimstone’, puritan descended repellent stuff. I will read your posts, but will not respond,
God knows my heart, and only he knows where I stand with him, and I have never EVER ‘demanded’
anything from him, ever.
Sometimes people get moved to the point of tears when one’s not understood,
but that’s just maybe because one focuses too much on a MAN’S opinion of a person,
I personally am not worried about that anymore, life is extremely difficult and lonely
enough for too many to add fuel to the fire of warning someone they’re gonna be stabbed
by pitchforks for eternity if one doesn’t toe the line.

[quote]Karado wrote:
Thx Pat, I really appreciate that, I treat peeps out there like I want to be treated.
I’ve done humble prayer/request techniques from Christian Mystics like Neville Goddard
in the past, his stuff is amazing and his recordings are on YT…I forget that sometimes,
and those techniques have WORKED, Neville’s info is generally suppressed, instead we’re
force fed by charlatans like Pat Robertson who said God told him Romney would be President,he said it twice in the space of two minutes…see where I’m coming from here?
No one seems to understand that even though one or two here have tried to justify that as
a ‘mistake’, or have verbally Jiu-Jitsu’d that Pat has saved more souls than I ever will.
I mean, what is this, a ‘see who saves more souls’ cosmic contest here?
I don’t have Pat’s money, I could never win that contest anyway.

It’s about truth and compassion for your fellow man, and that old attempting to scare the fuck
out of someone with eternal damnation is not how one will win me or anyone else over.
I posted earlier that I’ve “humbly” requested a little help in the past, then Tiribulus
warns that I shouldn’t “demand” things from the Lord…that’s not fair, not fair at all, I don’t
“demand” anything, that’s a very strong word, I said I “humbly” have asked, then a few posts later
I get told not to “demand”?..WTF.
I’m done with Tiribulus, nothing personal Tiribulus, but your style is too old school ‘fire and
brimstone’, puritan descended repellent stuff. I will read your posts, but will not respond,
God knows my heart, and only he knows where I stand with him, and I have never EVER ‘demanded’
anything from him, ever.
Sometimes people get moved to the point of tears when one’s not understood,
but that’s just maybe because one focuses too much on a MAN’S opinion of a person,
I personally am not worried about that anymore, life is extremely difficult and lonely
enough for too many to add fuel to the fire of warning someone they’re gonna be stabbed
by pitchforks for eternity if one doesn’t toe the line.[/quote]

I think the old fire and brimstone approach to faith is also not the right way to carry on in faith. Faith is a journey. The ‘fire and brimstone’ stuff is a stop along the way, it’s things you need to know, but it’s not the end all be all of faith. It’s important to understand that stuff and know essentially and eventually, evil is punished, and good is rewarded but we are called to a deeper love and connection with God. You are not going to have that, if all you do is worry about getting punished or if you are ticking things off your ‘heaven’ card.
At this point, I am not motivated by reward and punishment anymore. It’s the relationship I am interested in.
I understand what you are going through. Suffering is a part of life, no religious or non-religious convictions are going stop it. That’s not the point. Being faithful is not easy, but it is manageable. We are constantly tested and pushed to the brink. God NEVER promised it would be easy, or that Christians have some upper leg in life. As matter of fact, he said it would be hard. But it’s going to be hard regardless, so you can have it hard with God or without, but without that relationship, your center is off. You lose focus on what’s important, and that focus is what gets you through.
That’s why I think it’s important to stay the course. I understand suffering. I don’t understand it as deeply as some, but at the same time I understand it better than a lot of people. I mean does it really matter if you made it out alive if you’d rather be dead?
You lose that center, you lose focus, you do stupid shit.
There are things we have to go through. It’s not a choice, what is a choice is what we do with it. What we do with it can affect our lives more dramatically than what happens to us.

Don’t put your faith in people, they always let you down. Maybe 30-40 years ago, Pat Robertson was a reasonable guy, but clearly he has bats in the belfry now. People who claim to be religious do bad shit all the time. People let you down. It’s depressing, but it’s not what faith is.

Dig in deep, keep your faith and things will turn out right. Maybe not like you think they should, but it will be right. And when you look back, you’ll see it clearly and you will see the hand of God in it. You will also be able to look back without regret and that’s worth it’s weight in gold.

[quote]Karado wrote:<<< I’m done with Tiribulus, >>>[/quote]There’s only one gospel dude. And it’s very old. I’ll be here.

[quote]Karado wrote:
I can actually forgive this guy if he’s senile now, but if he’s not,
he’s got to go.

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/popersquos-child-porn-normal-claim-sparks-outrage-among-victims-15035449.html[/quote]

Hahaha. You even took your own article out of context. Granted, you didn’t get the article 100% wrong. I know I tend to be inflammatory in my titles, but at least I try to get the entire idea of the article right before making titles.

You can argue against his historical claims, but trying to say the Pope said, "Pedos not that bad.’ Is out right false, his address and the article contradict that statement, fully. He was speaking of the context of these events, not giving an actual moral judgement on their actions.

The article said that he claimed that it was normal in the context of culture in the 1970’s and that victims were outraged because of his claims. The victims were outraged because they think he just talks about fixing the situation, but doesn’t do anything about the abuse, not that he’s claiming it is actually normal or even good.

If you want to read the words from the horse’s mouth: http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/speeches/2010/december/documents/hf_ben-xvi_spe_20101220_curia-auguri_en.html

The overall summary of his speech (which was two years ago) is thus, since the 1970’s saw itself in a morally relativist world, where nothing was bad or good in itself, just more bad or more good than something else, the abuse is normalised; however, Natural Law does not allow such relativism and neither does scripture (therefore the Church). And, therefore the injustices need to be fixed. He called out the Curia, bishops, priests, deacons, &c. to repay injustices and stop any future abuse. Not only by programs, but by making sure that seminarians and all are given formation that properly teaches theology and Natural Law.

I’m sorry you’re having a bad time

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
â??In the 1970s, paedophilia was theorised as something fully in conformity with man and even with children,â?? the Pope said.

â??It was maintained â?? even within the realm of Catholic theology â?? that there is no such thing as evil in itself or good in itself. There is only a â??better than’ and a â??worse than’. Nothing is good or bad in itself.â??

Read more: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/popersquos-child-porn-normal-claim-sparks-outrage-among-victims-15035449.html#ixzz2FyQ445FD

Moral relativism at its finest…

May the God you invented forgive you.[/quote]

Only if you’d be half as logical as Rand you’d realize from the article alone that the Pope was addressing moral relativism and the destruction it has had, evident of the 1970’s.