T Nation

Polygamist Nabbed

FBI Captures Most Wanted Fugative:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,210959,00.html

Here is an intersting issue and I am very interested in the responses of people like “forlife.”

Here goes to all of you that say “I demand Homosexual Marriage.” If your deviant behavior should be acceptable and legal, then surely you agree that Mr. Jeff’s deviant behavior of marrying more than one woman and also marrying underage minors should be legal as well, right? Otherwise we have a situation where one man’s deviant behavior is better than another man’s deviant behvavior, don’t we?

For me, all such deviant behavior should be illegal and, if that is the wishes of the people in those states through laws made via their elected officials, so be it.

However, those who come on these forums and express longing for the day when men can marry men and women can marry women, surely then Mr. Jeff has a “constitutional right” to marry as many women as he wishes and that includes minor children, right?

This should be interesting…

[quote]steveo5801 wrote:
FBI Captures Most Wanted Fugative:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,210959,00.html

Here is an intersting issue and I am very interested in the responses of people like “forlife.”

Here goes to all of you “I demand Homosexual Marriage.” If your deviant behavior should be acceptable and legal, then surely you agree that Mr. Jeff’s deviant behavior of marrying more than one woman and also marrying underage minors should be legal as well, right? Otherwise we have a situation where one man’s deviant behavior is better than another man’s deviant behvavior, don’t we?

For me, all such deviant behavior should be illegal and, if that is the wishes of the people in those states through laws made via their elected officials, so be it.

However, those who come on these forums and express longing for the day where men can marry men and women can marry women, surely then Mr. Jeff’s has a “constitutional right” to marry as many women as he wishes and that includes minor children, right?

This should be interesting…[/quote]

Several women probably , minors only when they are allready allowed to marry, meaning with consent of their parents.

And no, it will not lead to people marrying lampshades…

I think people should be allowed to marry whoever they want, unless there is objective evidence that doing so could lead to harm. For example, I’m pretty sure that marrying a child would be potentially damaging to that child due to his or her lack of maturity and inability to provide informed consent. I don’t know what research is available on polygamy, but I think that research should be evaluated in making a civic decision on whether or not to allow it.

Steveo- Where in the Bible does it condemn polygamy?(Man with multiple wives)

I personally have no problems with it if all the involved adults are consenting and participating in it of their own free will.

I have no personal interest in homosexuality or polygamy, but as an adult I expect to be able to choose how I wish to live my life. As long as I’m not causing harm to others or being a burden on society, how I choose to live is nobody’s business but my own. I extend the same courtesy and liberty to other adults in choosing their lives.

Involving minors is an entirely different thing though, and is not acceptable.

According to the FBI, he was wanted not for polygamy but:

“FOR THE ALLEGED SEXUAL ASSAULT ON A MINOR IN 2002. HE IS ALSO WANTED FOR ONE COUNT OF CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT SEXUAL CONDUCT WITH A MINOR IN 2002… ADDITIONALLY, JEFFS IS WANTED FOR RAPE AS AN ACCOMPLICE IN UTAH.”

As far as I know, rape, sexual assault on a minor, and conspiracy to commit sexual assault on a minor are not just considered “deviant” but are illegal in all states, regardless of sexual orientation.

http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten/fugitives/jeff_ws.htm

One can legally live with multiple women, will them your assets, and have children with them.

I have no problem with a man marrying multiple women, or a woman marrying multiple men, as long as all parties involved are aware of the arrangement.

Underage girls are a different matter and cloud the issue. This isn’t an instance of one kind of deviance vs. another. There are married people who only sleep people other than their spouses. This is “deviant,” yet legal in most states.

Heterosexual men can try to marry underage girls as well, by the way.

[quote]steveo5801 wrote:
FBI Captures Most Wanted Fugative:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,210959,00.html

Here is an intersting issue and I am very interested in the responses of people like “forlife.”

Here goes to all of you that say “I demand Homosexual Marriage.” If your deviant behavior should be acceptable and legal, then surely you agree that Mr. Jeff’s deviant behavior of marrying more than one woman and also marrying underage minors should be legal as well, right? Otherwise we have a situation where one man’s deviant behavior is better than another man’s deviant behvavior, don’t we?

For me, all such deviant behavior should be illegal and, if that is the wishes of the people in those states through laws made via their elected officials, so be it.

However, those who come on these forums and express longing for the day when men can marry men and women can marry women, surely then Mr. Jeff has a “constitutional right” to marry as many women as he wishes and that includes minor children, right?

This should be interesting…[/quote]

Right GAY marriage is evil because it will lead Straight men to think that they should be able to have sex with multiple women…wait this happened when Adam left the Garden…

oh an the multiple marriages…guess what they have that in the middle east. and there is no gay marriage there.

so if gay marriage leads to multiple wife’s wouldn’t the opposite be true.

but you know what Marriage to different sex couple is the reason gay people think they should be allowed to marry I think we should just ban all marriage. that would be fair.

just say it you don’t like Gay people because God says so. let them live there lives and when the time comes you will be right and you can laugh and mastubate to them burning in agony, till then keep your biased self rightous mouth shut

Maybe this is Steve’s church:

http://www.godhatesfags.com

They seem to share some of the same logic and reasoning skills, anyway.

[quote]TSuderman wrote:
Steveo- Where in the Bible does it condemn polygamy?(Man with multiple wives)[/quote]

The fundies usually get silent when asked this question. They love to talk about “preserving traditional marriage”, but ignore the fact that polygamy was practiced regularly in the bible, by such esteemed prophets as Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob :slight_smile:

I don’t hate gays or polygamists. In fact, I don’t give a shit what they do- its got no bearing on my life at all.

It’s only the self-righteous assholes who want to get inside everyone’s bedroom that give two shits about any of this…man, what happened to “conservative” meaning “keep government out”? The Jesus Freaks have truly taken over the right…

Interesting guy, this Jeff:

A (fundamentalist) leader of a christianity-derived cult, establishing a parallel society in which women and children are molested and treated like in biblical times.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,,1860954,00.html

It is great to see the lawful state prevail over evil mofos like him.

Makkun

This is way too easy, so for once I’m going to keep my retarded posts to myself. If he hasn’t figured it out by now, he’s probably not gonna at all.

Here are some serious - and unloaded, honestly - questions for those who would endorse legal recognition of polygamy, etc.

  1. Should there be a cap on legally recognized partners? Wouldn’t any number be arbitrary?

  2. How should custody disputes over children be resolved?

  3. How should polygamist couples be taxed? Could the guy in the above story - with 40 wives and 60 kids - get to treat them as dependents?

  4. How would Social Security benefits be distributed to say six widows in the event of an untimely death of a polygamist husband?

  5. How would insurance work for families?

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
Here are some serious - and unloaded, honestly - questions for those who would endorse legal recognition of polygamy, etc.

  1. Should there be a cap on legally recognized partners? Wouldn’t any number be arbitrary?

  2. How should custody disputes over children be resolved?

  3. How should polygamist couples be taxed? Could the guy in the above story - with 40 wives and 60 kids - get to treat them as dependents?

  4. How would Social Security benefits be distributed to say six widows in the event of an untimely death of a polygamist husband?

  5. How would insurance work for families?[/quote]

I asked myswelf some of that questions when it came to gay marriage.

The argument was that marriages have fiscal benefits because they “produce” children which is obviously not the case in most gay marriages.

My answer would be to stop linking those benefits to marriages and start linking them to the number of children.

As for insurances and so on, let the market figure it out.

[quote]orion wrote:
thunderbolt23 wrote:
Here are some serious - and unloaded, honestly - questions for those who would endorse legal recognition of polygamy, etc.

  1. Should there be a cap on legally recognized partners? Wouldn’t any number be arbitrary?

  2. How should custody disputes over children be resolved?

  3. How should polygamist couples be taxed? Could the guy in the above story - with 40 wives and 60 kids - get to treat them as dependents?

  4. How would Social Security benefits be distributed to say six widows in the event of an untimely death of a polygamist husband?

  5. How would insurance work for families?

I asked myswelf some of that questions when it came to gay marriage.

The argument was that marriages have fiscal benefits because they “produce” children which is obviously not the case in most gay marriages.

My answer would be to stop linking those benefits to marriages and start linking them to the number of children.

As for insurances and so on, let the market figure it out. [/quote]

There is a huge difference between people living with who they want, and the state sanctioning such deviant behavior.

And no - deviant in this context has no religious overtones. It simply means a deviation from the accepted norm.

This case has very little to do with that. It does have everything to do with some sick bastard with a God complex arranging marraiges between adult males and little girls, and raping 9-year old girls.

If the moral relativists are going to look the other way on this one - you are as guilty as the sick bastard that actually committed the crimes.

[quote]rainjack wrote:
orion wrote:
thunderbolt23 wrote:
Here are some serious - and unloaded, honestly - questions for those who would endorse legal recognition of polygamy, etc.

  1. Should there be a cap on legally recognized partners? Wouldn’t any number be arbitrary?

  2. How should custody disputes over children be resolved?

  3. How should polygamist couples be taxed? Could the guy in the above story - with 40 wives and 60 kids - get to treat them as dependents?

  4. How would Social Security benefits be distributed to say six widows in the event of an untimely death of a polygamist husband?

  5. How would insurance work for families?

I asked myswelf some of that questions when it came to gay marriage.

The argument was that marriages have fiscal benefits because they “produce” children which is obviously not the case in most gay marriages.

My answer would be to stop linking those benefits to marriages and start linking them to the number of children.

As for insurances and so on, let the market figure it out.

There is a huge difference between people living with who they want, and the state sanctioning such deviant behavior.

And no - deviant in this context has no religious overtones. It simply means a deviation from the accepted norm.

This case has very little to do with that. It does have everything to do with some sick bastard with a God complex arranging marraiges between adult males and little girls, and raping 9-year old girls.

If the moral relativists are going to look the other way on this one - you are as guilty as the sick bastard that actually committed the crimes. [/quote]

Everyone responding thought there was a clear line between polygamy and child abuse so where is the problem?

[quote]orion wrote:
rainjack wrote:
orion wrote:
thunderbolt23 wrote:
Here are some serious - and unloaded, honestly - questions for those who would endorse legal recognition of polygamy, etc.

  1. Should there be a cap on legally recognized partners? Wouldn’t any number be arbitrary?

  2. How should custody disputes over children be resolved?

  3. How should polygamist couples be taxed? Could the guy in the above story - with 40 wives and 60 kids - get to treat them as dependents?

  4. How would Social Security benefits be distributed to say six widows in the event of an untimely death of a polygamist husband?

  5. How would insurance work for families?

I asked myswelf some of that questions when it came to gay marriage.

The argument was that marriages have fiscal benefits because they “produce” children which is obviously not the case in most gay marriages.

My answer would be to stop linking those benefits to marriages and start linking them to the number of children.

As for insurances and so on, let the market figure it out.

There is a huge difference between people living with who they want, and the state sanctioning such deviant behavior.

And no - deviant in this context has no religious overtones. It simply means a deviation from the accepted norm.

This case has very little to do with that. It does have everything to do with some sick bastard with a God complex arranging marraiges between adult males and little girls, and raping 9-year old girls.

If the moral relativists are going to look the other way on this one - you are as guilty as the sick bastard that actually committed the crimes.

Everyone responding thought there was a clear line between polygamy and child abuse so where is the problem?

[/quote]

The guy wasn’t arrested for polygamy. He was arrested for sexual assault, or stautory rape.

Everyone wants to get on their “it’s okay to marry as many of whatever gets you off” soapbox when that is not even the issue. It could have been an athiest that got busted, or a Baptist preacher.

My point is it seems that no one even knows what the case3 is about, but instead decided this was a forum to talk about polygamy.

A bigger crime wqould be why it is only a misdemeanor in Cali to have kiddie pron on your computer.

thunderbolt23- As per your questions 1. I do not think we would have to worry about the number of wives. Only the extremely wealthy would be able to support 60 wives and the children.

  1. As far as custody goes- It seems, in my uneducated opinion, that most marriages brake down over infidelity. And I believe the figure was that some 80% of the time it is the male’s fault. You would not have this problem with women who are humble enough to accept a life with multiple wives.

3 and 4- The laws these subjects are staggering in their complexity. It would be very simple if we were just all taxed the same. No brakes for anyone. Even the married. Marriage was instituted by God not government. I have heard of those who marry in a building with a minister but never bring it “to the government” so to speak, and they consider themselves married. Plus if you choose to live this way you would know the government(Social Security) would not support you so hopefully you would plan other means (life insurance,investments) to support your family should you give up the ghost.

  1. You can set up plans for those “outside” the family if I am correct.

[quote]makkun wrote:
Interesting guy, this Jeff:

A (fundamentalist) leader of a christianity-derived cult, establishing a parallel society in which women and children are molested and treated like in biblical times.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,,1860954,00.html

It is great to see the lawful state prevail over evil mofos like him.

Makkun[/quote]
Huh?! Which Bible did you read!?