http://www.charlespoliquin.com/Supplements/testosterone.php
Guys,
Wondering if anyone has had a chance to use this or just interested in some of your thoughts. Clearly a costly protocol but if B5, ALA and trib (which appear the main compounds) are bought in powder form it would certainly be much cheaper.
Valid PCT protocol with/without SERM support?
Or, just a fart into the wind?
This may well be effective. As effective as a SERM - I doubt it. How long lasting? I wonder. This would be prohibitively expensive for all but the wealthy. I respect Poliquin and his cutting edge research very much, but don’t see this protocol as being feasible for the general populace. Only a priveledged few.
That looks pretty wild. Dynamo, did you calculate up how much this would cost? I would love to see someone do a cycle of that stuff with bloodwork.
BenceJones,
No I didn’t tally it up, but I have used Poliquin products before and they are top quality and are priced accordingly. I used his HCL and Fenuplex for improved disgestion and insulin tolerance. I am a big believer in Poliquin’s BioSignature diagnosis and treatment of hormonal imbalances. I am sure blood levels would respond to the correct implementation of Poliquin’s principals.
Whether these supplements would be powerful enough to work as PCT, maybe but on a cost efficient basis, I’ll stay with a SERM for now.
Now, if you were to offer me a summer of training, diet and supplementation from Poliquin in person - I wouldn’t turn it down.
I can’t seem to find the “andro excellence” on his site but without it - it would run $159 (plus tax and shipping) that’s assuming you only needed a bottle of each item mentioned. What do you think should be swapped for the andro ? I am thinking about giving this a go…
This to me is a shart in the wind. I wouldn’t gamble my recovery rate on some unproven method.
[quote]Turbo Mysterio wrote:
This to me is a shart in the wind. I wouldn’t gamble my recovery rate on some unproven method. [/quote]
Oh I agree, no plans on using it for PCT - just curious about it’s effects…
Contact Poliquin’s customer service. They’ll give any required info regarding his products.
Do you think Poliquin is on TRT or takes this stuff? He seems to have a good bit of muscle mass for his age.
I think he is natural. He knows how to manipulate hormones through diet and supplementation. The man is a friggin genius.
Well like I said you can get the main ‘ingredients’ in powder form (and not from the Poliquin site lol) which makes it WAAAAAAY cheaper.
So turbo you don’t believe there would be any benefit even in addition to proper SERM use? I mean what is actually ‘proven’ when it comes to AAS anyway. We all just seem to learn from accumulated experience anyway.
I’ve actually ordered ALA, B5 and TT and will get some quotes tomorrow for blood work post current cycle and then pre next cycle. Problem is I haven’t had blood work before so I can’t compare the effects of this PCT protocol versus SERM only dam it.
[quote]NZ RABBIT wrote:
I mean what is actually ‘proven’ when it comes to AAS anyway. We all just seem to learn from accumulated experience anyway.
[/quote]
The techniques you refer to (SERM based PCT) have been not only proven over time (which is proof enough really), but in medical journals detailing the actions of SERM’s (and HCG) on the HPTA in hypergonadal men.
Turbo is pointing out that the protocol by Poloquin is not as researched as SERM protocols. Even if the research is only 10-20 years of bodybuilder’s experiences and the natural evolution of that information, further increasing the recovery capabilities of the drug.
If a theory holds up to the test of time - then that is good enough by my reckoning, but if you also need medical papers to ‘prove’ the effect SERM’s have on the HPTA in hypergonadal men, then that exists too.
You cant argue that SERM PCT protocols have no proof… it simply is not correct.
Brook
Problem with buying the ingredients individually is that so many supplement companies have questionable quality. It’s just like AAS, the best brewer is only as good as his raw material. There are few checks on quality control. Christian Thibaudeau states that he only trusts products from Poliquin, Biotest and a native Quebec company. Many supplements like tribulus have to have their ingredients harvested from the right crop at the right time of the year, etc. How many companies do you think would go to those lengths? Only those who value the integrity of their name.
[quote]NZ RABBIT wrote:
Well like I said you can get the main ‘ingredients’ in powder form (and not from the Poliquin site lol) which makes it WAAAAAAY cheaper.
So turbo you don’t believe there would be any benefit even in addition to proper SERM use? I mean what is actually ‘proven’ when it comes to AAS anyway. We all just seem to learn from accumulated experience anyway.
I’ve actually ordered ALA, B5 and TT and will get some quotes tomorrow for blood work post current cycle and then pre next cycle. Problem is I haven’t had blood work before so I can’t compare the effects of this PCT protocol versus SERM only dam it.[/quote]
DH,
I personally think the ‘questionable quality’ thing is overstated. I could be wrong but don’t most of the raw materials come from China anyway?! Even so, why not just increase the dosage of each ‘questionable’ compound to ensure you are getting enough of what you intend to? Makes it much cheaper still.
Anyway, back to topic anyway surprised we haven’t heard from users of ALA, trib and to a lesser extent B5 and their perceived/measured effects on test levels?
[quote]NZ RABBIT wrote:
So turbo you don’t believe there would be any benefit even in addition to proper SERM use? I mean what is actually ‘proven’ when it comes to AAS anyway. We all just seem to learn from accumulated experience anyway.
[/quote]
To be perfectly bold and honest, no. No supplement, herbal potpourri, or heavily manipulated diet will instill the amount of change a properly executed AAS regiment will have on a man. As for including it in the recovery process, I would rather spend my funds on the building blocks of my next cycle.
-Turbo
[quote]NZ RABBIT wrote:
DH,
I personally think the ‘questionable quality’ thing is overstated.
[/quote]
Oh no, there is quite a difference between your Rite Aid quality tribulus and a high quality product that is selectively harvested, processed, etc. Not by any means more anabolic nor androgenic in nature, but merely one works quite well as an ED aid and the other is soy flour and ground alfalfa.
All the bull shit with all their herbs and fuckin indian plants IT DOESNT WORK- there is no such thing as an effective, super safe, natural no side effects alternative to roids. Id say you go and buy the SERM and see some acttal results
You go boy!