T Nation

Please Critique My First Cycle

I’m 35, have been lifting naturally for 20 years, am 5’11" 255, about 16% bf.

I’m just looking for moderate strength gains while looking to get down to about 12%bf.

Here’s what I’m thinking:

week 1: 250 mg sust 1x week, 30mg winstrol ed

2: 500 mg sust e3d, 40mg winstrol ed

3: 750 mg sust eod, 50mg winstrol ed

4: 750 mg sust eod, 50mg winstrol ed

5: 750 mg sust eod, 40mg winstrol ed

6: 500 mg sust e3d

7: 500 mg sust e3d

8: 250 mg sust 1x week

.25 adex ed for all 8 weeks

40 mg nolva ed weeks 9-10

20 mg nolav ed weeks 11-12

I also have anavar and clenbuterol but am unsure how to incorporate them (or even if I should) for this cycle. I want to keep this cycle as simple as possible.

Thanks for your feedback!

Dude, sorry to tell you but this looks all kinds of messed up for several reasons! You may want to do a bit more study before taking the plunge.

I think most would recommend that you you do a simple Test cycle for your first. Someting like…

500mg Test E/week.

You would divide this up into bi-weekly or E3D/ injections ie 250mg on Monday and 200mg on Thursday. Some even inject one a week but I dont think its common here.

For your PCT you could use the Test Stasis/Taper method (recommended) or traditional PCT. For more info regarding the taper see the sticky at the top of the forum.

Save the other compounds for any future cycles you may run.

For your goals mentioned, your diet will play a LARGE part of this while using AAS.

Jazz

All I have is Sust, so I will have to stick with that for now.

Thanks for thr input.

Ok, so I looked into the Test stasis taper and it looks like I would do a 4 week taper starting at 100mg per week down to 20mg per week by week 4. I would also be off the adex by week 3.

I think my nolva dosage looks ok though.

So, just get rid of the winstrol entirely?

you cant do the taper with sust… some esters are too long.

As for your cycle… there is no need to taper UP to 750mg… start at that, or 500 or whatever you are choosing.

However you only seem to have 3250mg of Sust is this true>? this would leave you with 325mg a week over 10 weeks… That is fine if you are ok with that… if you want more get another 10mls and make it 575mg over 10 weeks, injected at 0.58ml 4xPW (EOD)…

then 3 weeks after the last injection you begin your PCT, the 40/40/20/20 is ok.

The adex is fine too… use proviron for better effect from the test1 :wink:

JJ

you cant do the taper with sust… some esters are too long.

As for your cycle… there is no need to taper UP to 750mg… start at that, or 500 or whatever you are choosing.

However you only seem to have 3250mg of Sust is this true>? this would leave you with 325mg a week over 10 weeks… That is fine if you are ok with that… if you want more get another 10mls and make it 575mg over 10 weeks, injected at 0.58ml 4xPW (EOD)…

then 3 weeks after the last injection you begin your PCT, the 40/40/20/20 is ok.

The adex is fine too… use proviron for better effect from the test1 :wink:

JJ

[quote] JJ wrote:
you cant do the taper with sust… some esters are too long.

As for your cycle… there is no need to taper UP to 750mg… start at that, or 500 or whatever you are choosing.

However you only seem to have 3250mg of Sust is this true>? this would leave you with 325mg a week over 10 weeks… That is fine if you are ok with that… if you want more get another 10mls and make it 575mg over 10 weeks, injected at 0.58ml 4xPW (EOD)…

then 3 weeks after the last injection you begin your PCT, the 40/40/20/20 is ok.

The adex is fine too… use proviron for better effect from the test1 :wink:

JJ[/quote]

I actually have 4000mg of sust, so I can do 500mg each week for 8 weeks and then start my pct. So, then drop from 500mg to 40mg in one week? Isn’t that a dramatic drop?

no… that isnt 40mg of sust… it is 40mg of nolvadex, and it isnt 1 week. its was 3… remember?

"then 3 weeks after the last injection you begin your PCT, the 40/40/20/20 is ok. "

PLUS… if you dont have ant test to taper - what do YOU wanna do? I would recommend some sort of taper… but…

As others have already said just use 5oomg/week for all 8 weeks. I think that .25mg Adex eod will be just fine. The winstrol I would use in the last four weeks as opposed to the first 4. The sust has prop in it so the effects should be felt rather quickly with no need for an oral kickstart.

ditto what 2the said. Pop the winstrol in last 4 weeks for the SHBG affinity of it. help scavenge some last minute gains. Also from what im reading here, i would advise p utting this off for a little while so you can research up and educate yourself in AAS before you start.

[quote] JJ wrote:
no… that isnt 40mg of sust… it is 40mg of nolvadex, and it isnt 1 week. its was 3… remember?

"then 3 weeks after the last injection you begin your PCT, the 40/40/20/20 is ok. "

PLUS… if you dont have ant test to taper - what do YOU wanna do? I would recommend some sort of taper… but…[/quote]

ok, so just that I’m clear on this, after my 8 weeks, I don’t start with nolvadex until week 11 (assuming I’ve done my last injection in week 8)?

Correct you have to give the drug time to clear out of your system/

[quote]Game_over wrote:
Correct you have to give the drug time to clear out of your system/[/quote]

Ok, makes sense.

What are your thoughts on Anavar versus Winstrol as a stack with Sust?

kinda depends on your goals. anavar is cool and all but IMO too exotic, hard to get legit and not enough benefit for me. the winstrol will go good with the sust if you throw it in the last weeks instead of the first. you dont need a kickstart with sust.

At 250mg Sust every 4 days you are going to end up with peak blood levels of esters as follows…

The short ester (Propionate) will quickly peak and bounce around between 9 and 35mg in your system at any one time.

I’ll group the two mid range esters together (Phenylpropionate and Isocaproate) and these will give peak levels of between 170 and 265mg after about 2 weeks.

The long ester (Decanoate) will peak around about week 4 and with a range of about 250mg to 330mg on any given day.

IMO plenty high enough levels for a first cycle.

Shame you couldn’t have used Test E to simplify things on your first run but you’ve got what you’ve got.

Incidentally, to give an idea of the kind of time Game_Over is talking about for the drug to clear out of your system, on the last day of your cycle there would be 231mg of Decanoate ester in your body.

Given it’s half life it’ll take over a week to drop below 100mg and a further 2 weeks to drop below 25mg

Hence the waiting time before starting your PCT.

Thanks again here to JJ for educating me on exactly how to calculate this.

rents, Dopa introduced me to a different - possibly better - way:

http://www.come.to/roidcalc

It is great mate!

[quote] JJ wrote:
rents, Dopa introduced me to a different - possibly better - way:

http://www.come.to/roidcalc

It is great mate![/quote]

Sweet! Exactly the sort of direction I was going to take but in all honesty if it’s already done then I’m going to stop working on reinventing the wheel and get back to writing code that will make me some money!

Looking at that calculator it’s working in exactly the same way as you described. I’d still like to see the results in graph format too though without having to feed the results into Excel.

Cheers JJ

There is a button where if you have inputted your data, then press “graph” it will show the visual data…

[quote]Renton wrote:
At 250mg Sust every 4 days you are going to end up with peak blood levels of esters as follows…

The short ester (Propionate) will quickly peak and bounce around between 9 and 35mg in your system at any one time.

I’ll group the two mid range esters together (Phenylpropionate and Isocaproate) and these will give peak levels of between 170 and 265mg after about 2 weeks.

The long ester (Decanoate) will peak around about week 4 and with a range of about 250mg to 330mg on any given day.

IMO plenty high enough levels for a first cycle.

Shame you couldn’t have used Test E to simplify things on your first run but you’ve got what you’ve got.

Incidentally, to give an idea of the kind of time Game_Over is talking about for the drug to clear out of your system, on the last day of your cycle there would be 231mg of Decanoate ester in your body.

Given it’s half life it’ll take over a week to drop below 100mg and a further 2 weeks to drop below 25mg

Hence the waiting time before starting your PCT.

Thanks again here to JJ for educating me on exactly how to calculate this.[/quote]

Yeah, I should have gotten the Test E instead, but I was a little concerned with water retention and acne. From what I’ve read, Sust is a little better in that regard.

because it isnt as potent in my view… the dose is spread out so to speak rather than concentrated.

In enanth the dose is spread over 3 weeks or so.

In sust, over half is gone in the first week and a half, and the last fraction is a 3-4 week ester.

Less sides.