T Nation

Planning First Cycle - Please Comment


Hi guys, I have been planning to do this for a while now and I am just about ready to take the plunge. I am 5'10, 175lbs, ~14% bf, 26 years old and been training for 3+ years. Please comment on my cycle below and any improvements I could make:

Weeks 1-10: Test Cyp 400mg/week (200mg x2 inj)
Weeks 6-12: Winstrol 50 mg a day
Weeks 1-12: Arimidex .25mg EOD
Weeks 3-12: HCG 250ui x2 per week

Weeks 13-16: Clomid and Torem 50/50/25/25 and 120/120/60/60
Weeks 13-16: DAA (D-Aspartic Acid) 3gx2/day

Am I going too heavy with the PCT doses?

I am in no rush to get started, I will be waiting at least another month or so anyway. I am not hell bent on getting massive, I would be more interested in making lean gains and trying to keep them.


Beginners forum. Go there.

Steroids forum. GTFO


Gee you are friendly, I bet you are popular.

Am I reading your profile correctly, you are 23?


I think he means you obviously know nothng about bodybuilding if you are 5'10, 175lbs, ~14% bf, 26 years old and been training for 3+ years. Your diet and training obviously suck. Steroids will be a waste as you dont have the knowledge to make and keep gains.


I didn't realise that taking steroids automatically gave you license to be a complete cockhead. I started at close enough to 135lbs, found it extremely hard to gain anything but slowly worked my way up to something approaching a respectable weight. I have shitty genetics, my body hates muscle it seems, but I work hard and have learned as much as I can. Still learning and still making progress slowly. I am now looking at cycling in a month or so, have no desire to be 200lbs, in fact if I can gain 20ilbs and bring down bf% slightly in 2 cycles I will be happy.

If you have no interest in helping then that is ok, but being a complete jerk just because you are a bad ass with a halloween mask in your avatar is uncalled for. Rude cunt.


Cry me a river. I started off at 140lbs, and I got up to 230lbs naturally. You can complain about genetics all you want, but if you don't even want to get that big, why use AAS? They aren't magic, if you didn't work hard enough without them you will not keep your gains when you come off.


Youre small as shit. Stop whining and go eat.


Ok thanks. I have done my research and would like comments on the cycle above.


Torem and clomid is probably overkill

and LOL @ bonez, you rude cunt!


It's not a bad cycle, dude. You'll gain from it. And honestly, at 26, the recovery probably won't be bad at all. But, Bonez has a point. He's not exactly a sweetheart, but it's extremely unlikely that you're at your genetic potential. However, I think that most of the guys who claim you should reach your genetic potential before you start AAS probably started long before they hit their limit. Just sayin'...

I know what it's like to have to train hard to get to the point that some guys are at naturally. If I stayed out of the gym for a year, I'd have a 135# squat. No shit.

So... have at it, bro. You'll realize very quickly that training and diet have a far greater impact than you originally suspected. Just know that you'll likely be disappointed in your cycle. That's not a flame, it just is what it is. You'll learn that the "juice" isn't magic. You'll understand what it does and doesn't do, and you'll dial in your diet before you try again.

Best of luck. Seriously.


The cycle isn't bad just use clomid only for PCT though. You can keep the DAA if you want, but you shouldn't go on yet. No offense but your stats are awful. You need to get better without AAS first.

I went from 112lbs when I first started, to 253 natural. I went from 160 to 245 in a year, natural.

You need to fucking eat. Eat till you feel sick. Then sip some water to keep the vomit down, and keep eating.

I am betting your training is sub optimal too.

If you think you have done your research, then why wouldn't you frontload? Also why 400mg? 500mg is generally the minimum.


I hear a lot of Americans can go from 112lbs to 250lbs, it is quite problem over there. Sorry but you are either fat or full of shit... Post pics of your amazing 113lb natural gain in one year, I would love to see that.


Cute joke about the USA. Yeah, there are quite a few fat people here, and the country is going to shit IMO, but that has nothing to do with this, and I am not one of the fat dudes.

I never said 113 lb gain in one year.

I was 112 when I started. Over a few years I reached 160. Then I got serious, and gained up to 245 in a year. Thats 85lbs in a year. Yes I gained some fat. About 65lbs of it was muscle though. Then stopped gaining so fast to lean up slightly, and slowly gained to 253 before going on. Being super lean is not a concern of mine though, I am a powerlifter, not a bodybuilder.

And I most certainly will not post pictures in the steroid forum. There could be some serious implications for me from doing that. Even if I edit the face out there is a chance someone who knows me well would recognize the background, and that could fuck up numerous things for me.

You can believe me or not. Personally idgaf, and if you really want to be a fucktard and go on anabolic steroids when you are 14% bodyfat at 176lbs, then go ahead. Thats fucking pathetic. I was like 8-9% bodyfat at 160 before I was even serious. Granted I am not that lean now, but I am also almost 100lbs heavier, and only train/eat for strength and optimal performance.

I seriously doubt you eat anywhere near what I did. Thats why you don't grow. When I was bulking a normal day was like this (yes I used to keep diet logs) :

6am- 12 whole eggs, 3 baked potatoes, quart whole milk

7 30am- Quart whole milk, sweet potato

930am- 3 scoops muscle milk, peanut butter sandwich

1130 am- 2 Roast beef sandwiches, quart of whole milk, apple

130pm- 3 scoops muscle milk, banana

3pm- banana, bowl of oatmeal, quart of gatorade, glass of milk (pre-workout meal)

4-7pm- training- during training- half gallon of gatorade, 25g BCAAs

7pm- Post workout shake- 4 servings nesquick, 5g creatine, 10g BCAAs, 3 scoops muscle milk

8pm- 1 box of spaghetti, meat sauce, 3 slices garlic bread, 2 cups of whole milk

10pm- 6 eggs and cheese

11pm- 3 scoops muscle milk before bed

That was one day.. pretty normal at the time.


65lbs of muscle, naturally, in one year? You are full of shit, and as a 250+ lb powerlifter I suspect you are also fat. Mate if I didn't care about bf% I could gain easily... But right now if I raise cals I just put on fat, and if I lower I lose muscle. 'Roids should fix it.


If your convinced that that cycle will help, run it.

I don't know why these people care if you waste your money.

Just don't act butthurt when you look the exact same after PCT.


Thank you 16 year old yoda of roids. I was being sarcastic with roids should fix it comment. But if I raise cals on cycle then at least most should go to muscle not fat. I could possibly achieve my goal of 195ish lbs naturally but roids should make it easier and from what I hear/read should also be fun.

If anyone has any useful input I am all ears, but other than mr. KFC diet powerlifter who honestly believes he added 65lbs of muscle naturally in one year, without gaining twice that in fat, all I see is bunch of useless cunts bagging me out because I don't want to be 250lbs.


Haha, dude, you are right. I am full of shit. I am a 250+lb fatass(13% bodyfat, isn't that less than yours?) who can probably squat more than your three lift total. You are right bro. It can't be the quality of the calories you add causing the fat gain. You have reached your pathetic ass genetic peak, so I suggest you go ahead and juice up, because like you said, roids should fix it...

I personally think you should just not even worry at all about diet or training and you should just double the dose of everything in your cycle.... that should fix it. Right?

Fucking idiot.


P.S. 'steroids should only be used by athletes, not to look good'. Hahahahahaha Hahahahahaha Hahahahahaha you fucking retard, only drug cheats should use roids, Hahahahahaha Hahahahahaha.


Yeah bro, because scales and calipers are wrong. Thank god you are here to tell me from Australia how fat I am. Good god I was delusional. Thanks for the wakeup call.

Nobody is hating on your for not wanting to be 250lbs... but my fucking god, your stats are way too fucking bad to consider using anything.

I will admit, I was also growing (grew about 3 inches over that year) at the time I added that much weight. So that did help. But regardless, I did it naturally.

You think whatever you want, I don't give a fuck.

Go run your fucking cycle. Then come back and tell us how wrong we were.

Good luck.


You are a fucking idiot. Whats the point in wasting your money if you aren't competing? Just to look good, which I doubt you will...

At the very least, be jacked, and wanting to get even more jacked if you are just using it for personal goals. Not going from the physique of a teenage girl to the physique of an average man.

How fucking insecure are you about yourself?