PCT Goes Very, Very Wrong

Isn’t the DSM written by a group of guys on the payroll of other companies? —I am not a medical professional in the slightest, just find that to be odd.

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:
Isn’t the DSM written by a group of guys on the payroll of other companies? —I am not a medical professional in the slightest, just find that to be odd. [/quote]

The DSM V is horrible for many various reasons, but on this issue it becomes a moot point. Not a whole lot of money to be made.

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:
Isn’t the DSM written by a group of guys on the payroll of other companies? —I am not a medical professional in the slightest, just find that to be odd. [/quote]

The DSM V is horrible for many various reasons, but on this issue it becomes a moot point. Not a whole lot of money to be made.[/quote]

Oh okay. What about pharm companies that benefit from a certain illness making it in? I totally get if thats a stretch, just curious.

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:
Mental illness? [/quote]

No, its a disorder/physical problem, some studies show that due to conditions in the womb (exact cause remains unknown) these people develop the brain of the opposite sex but a different body.

It would literally be like you being in a woman’s body now

It’s not some sort of impulsive decision, it involves many consultations and steps with experts. Courtesy of the new DSM[/quote]

Case closed. That’s it. And it’s true for every case. Every. Single. One.

Good thing you came to T-Nation to find this stuff out. [/quote]

I am sure you in your infinite wisdom has more answers than all those so called “experts” with their useless Phd’s, fuck they should get you to write the new DSM since clearly you have better answers[/quote]

Wait, I was agreeing with you that whatever we believe to be the case today is exactly the truth, and there is nothing more to learn about this particular area of human psychology and physiology, and that we should just trust the all-knowing, never mistaken opinions of the experts who put together the DSM, because panels of learned men have never, ever, ever been completely dead wrong about anything in the history of our existence as a species.

See, you and I, we think the exact same thing!

http://corrosion-doctors.org/Elements-Toxic/Mercury-medical.htm

http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2011/03/21/the-surprising-history-of-the-lobotomy/

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:
Here you go, Cap. The first is Test/Tren/Dbol, the second is similar, but employing a particular growth hormone protocol developed by BBB. Both were fantastic cycles, especially the second.

Thanks for your interest!

[/quote]

I’m going to check these out too.

I have to say man you clearly know your shit when it comes to training and AAS, would be good if you would get involved with the AAS subforum and training areas of the site again.

Come back to us Cortes, we need you!
[/quote]

Haha. I don’t know, I kind of left that forum behind. Maybe I could be dragged back there, but the couple of times I’ve popped back over there I ended up leaving pretty quickly. Not because anything was necessarily wrong with the forum itself, it seemed pretty much the same to me. Just because I felt I’d kind of grown out of it.

I will say that I am always happy to address direct questions so if there happen to be any and you make a thread over there please feel free to point me that way and I’ll do what I can if my schedule allows it (I have busy periods which is why you see me disappear and pop back up after a month or two again).

I will also add that when I first joined this website, having been led here by the print publication, I was 5’11", 175lbs, and I used to wonder if I would ever manage to achieve the 220+ with abs physique I dreamed of having. A few years later (having made a ton of progress well before employing AAS), I was absolutely thrilled to find that even a lifetime weak-sauce skinny-boy hardgainer like myself could have the honor of receiving such flattering compliments as you and Cap has paid me here. Thanks so much, I’m seriously nothing special except that I relentlessly study and relentlessly persevere.

[/quote]

Thanks for the info man, I appreciate it.

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:
Here you go, Cap. The first is Test/Tren/Dbol, the second is similar, but employing a particular growth hormone protocol developed by BBB. Both were fantastic cycles, especially the second.

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/cortes_testtrendbol_run

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/bbbs_hgh_protocol_

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/the_hgh_experiement

Thanks for your interest!

[/quote]

I’m going to check these out too.

I have to say man you clearly know your shit when it comes to training and AAS, would be good if you would get involved with the AAS subforum and training areas of the site again.

Come back to us Cortes, we need you!
[/quote]

Haha. I don’t know, I kind of left that forum behind. Maybe I could be dragged back there, but the couple of times I’ve popped back over there I ended up leaving pretty quickly. Not because anything was necessarily wrong with the forum itself, it seemed pretty much the same to me. Just because I felt I’d kind of grown out of it.

I will say that I am always happy to address direct questions so if there happen to be any and you make a thread over there please feel free to point me that way and I’ll do what I can if my schedule allows it (I have busy periods which is why you see me disappear and pop back up after a month or two again).

I will also add that when I first joined this website, having been led here by the print publication, I was 5’11", 175lbs, and I used to wonder if I would ever manage to achieve the 220+ with abs physique I dreamed of having. A few years later (having made a ton of progress well before employing AAS), I was absolutely thrilled to find that even a lifetime weak-sauce skinny-boy hardgainer like myself could have the honor of receiving such flattering compliments as you and Cap has paid me here. Thanks so much, I’m seriously nothing special except that I relentlessly study and relentlessly persevere.

[/quote]

Thanks for the info man, I appreciate it.
[/quote]

My pleasure!

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:
Here you go, Cap. The first is Test/Tren/Dbol, the second is similar, but employing a particular growth hormone protocol developed by BBB. Both were fantastic cycles, especially the second.

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/cortes_testtrendbol_run

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/bbbs_hgh_protocol_

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/the_hgh_experiement

Thanks for your interest!

[/quote]

I’m going to check these out too.

I have to say man you clearly know your shit when it comes to training and AAS, would be good if you would get involved with the AAS subforum and training areas of the site again.

Come back to us Cortes, we need you!
[/quote]

Haha. I don’t know, I kind of left that forum behind. Maybe I could be dragged back there, but the couple of times I’ve popped back over there I ended up leaving pretty quickly. Not because anything was necessarily wrong with the forum itself, it seemed pretty much the same to me. Just because I felt I’d kind of grown out of it.

I will say that I am always happy to address direct questions so if there happen to be any and you make a thread over there please feel free to point me that way and I’ll do what I can if my schedule allows it (I have busy periods which is why you see me disappear and pop back up after a month or two again).

I will also add that when I first joined this website, having been led here by the print publication, I was 5’11", 175lbs, and I used to wonder if I would ever manage to achieve the 220+ with abs physique I dreamed of having. A few years later (having made a ton of progress well before employing AAS), I was absolutely thrilled to find that even a lifetime weak-sauce skinny-boy hardgainer like myself could have the honor of receiving such flattering compliments as you and Cap has paid me here. Thanks so much, I’m seriously nothing special except that I relentlessly study and relentlessly persevere.

[/quote]

Thanks for the info man, I appreciate it.
[/quote]

My pleasure!
[/quote]

What was your weight in your avatar picture around 200?

I am definitely in the skinny fucker crowd too.

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:
Here you go, Cap. The first is Test/Tren/Dbol, the second is similar, but employing a particular growth hormone protocol developed by BBB. Both were fantastic cycles, especially the second.

Thanks for your interest!

[/quote]

I’m going to check these out too.

I have to say man you clearly know your shit when it comes to training and AAS, would be good if you would get involved with the AAS subforum and training areas of the site again.

Come back to us Cortes, we need you!
[/quote]

Haha. I don’t know, I kind of left that forum behind. Maybe I could be dragged back there, but the couple of times I’ve popped back over there I ended up leaving pretty quickly. Not because anything was necessarily wrong with the forum itself, it seemed pretty much the same to me. Just because I felt I’d kind of grown out of it.

I will say that I am always happy to address direct questions so if there happen to be any and you make a thread over there please feel free to point me that way and I’ll do what I can if my schedule allows it (I have busy periods which is why you see me disappear and pop back up after a month or two again).

I will also add that when I first joined this website, having been led here by the print publication, I was 5’11", 175lbs, and I used to wonder if I would ever manage to achieve the 220+ with abs physique I dreamed of having. A few years later (having made a ton of progress well before employing AAS), I was absolutely thrilled to find that even a lifetime weak-sauce skinny-boy hardgainer like myself could have the honor of receiving such flattering compliments as you and Cap has paid me here. Thanks so much, I’m seriously nothing special except that I relentlessly study and relentlessly persevere.

[/quote]

Thanks for the info man, I appreciate it.
[/quote]

My pleasure!
[/quote]

What was your weight in your avatar picture around 200?

I am definitely in the skinny fucker crowd too.[/quote]

I’m in the low 200’s there, as that pic was taken in the last few days before a comp.

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:
Mental illness? [/quote]

No, its a disorder/physical problem, some studies show that due to conditions in the womb (exact cause remains unknown) these people develop the brain of the opposite sex but a different body.

It would literally be like you being in a woman’s body now

It’s not some sort of impulsive decision, it involves many consultations and steps with experts. Courtesy of the new DSM[/quote]

Case closed. That’s it. And it’s true for every case. Every. Single. One.

Good thing you came to T-Nation to find this stuff out. [/quote]

I am sure you in your infinite wisdom has more answers than all those so called “experts” with their useless Phd’s, fuck they should get you to write the new DSM since clearly you have better answers[/quote]

Wait, I was agreeing with you that whatever we believe to be the case today is exactly the truth, and there is nothing more to learn about this particular area of human psychology and physiology, and that we should just trust the all-knowing, never mistaken opinions of the experts who put together the DSM, because panels of learned men have never, ever, ever been completely dead wrong about anything in the history of our existence as a species.

See, you and I, we think the exact same thing!

http://corrosion-doctors.org/Elements-Toxic/Mercury-medical.htm

http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2011/03/21/the-surprising-history-of-the-lobotomy/[/quote]

so you’re claiming that what you know is much more in depth than people who have studied these phenomena in much more detail and much longer?

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:
Isn’t the DSM written by a group of guys on the payroll of other companies? —I am not a medical professional in the slightest, just find that to be odd. [/quote]

The DSM V is horrible for many various reasons, but on this issue it becomes a moot point. Not a whole lot of money to be made.[/quote]

Oh okay. What about pharm companies that benefit from a certain illness making it in? I totally get if thats a stretch, just curious.[/quote]

oh there is no denying that just not on this particular disorder

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:
Mental illness? [/quote]

No, its a disorder/physical problem, some studies show that due to conditions in the womb (exact cause remains unknown) these people develop the brain of the opposite sex but a different body.

It would literally be like you being in a woman’s body now

It’s not some sort of impulsive decision, it involves many consultations and steps with experts. Courtesy of the new DSM[/quote]

Case closed. That’s it. And it’s true for every case. Every. Single. One.

Good thing you came to T-Nation to find this stuff out. [/quote]

I am sure you in your infinite wisdom has more answers than all those so called “experts” with their useless Phd’s, fuck they should get you to write the new DSM since clearly you have better answers[/quote]

Wait, I was agreeing with you that whatever we believe to be the case today is exactly the truth, and there is nothing more to learn about this particular area of human psychology and physiology, and that we should just trust the all-knowing, never mistaken opinions of the experts who put together the DSM, because panels of learned men have never, ever, ever been completely dead wrong about anything in the history of our existence as a species.

See, you and I, we think the exact same thing!

http://corrosion-doctors.org/Elements-Toxic/Mercury-medical.htm

http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2011/03/21/the-surprising-history-of-the-lobotomy/[/quote]

so you’re claiming that what you know is much more in depth than people who have studied these phenomena in much more detail and much longer?
[/quote]

You keep repeating this.

Quote where I said I “know” anything.

I’ll wait.

By the way, there’s a term for when the bulk of one’s argument rests upon the purported authority of men with letters behind their names.

It can be found here:

[quote]Cortes wrote:
I’m looking at one extremely radical, nearly irreversible option for treatment. With very little allowed by modern “progressive” society in the way of alternatives.

Or am I wrong to be skeptical or to wonder if perhaps something else isn’t actually going on here?

EDIT: by “allowed” I mean “allowed to be discussed”[/quote]

I guess I am being a bit overzealous, but the alternative to adapting the body to the brain (in VERY simplistic terms) is adapting the brain to the body which is a metric dickload riskier and harder (pun intended)

[quote]Chushin wrote:

[quote]super saiyan wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:
Here you go, Cap. The first is Test/Tren/Dbol, the second is similar, but employing a particular growth hormone protocol developed by BBB. Both were fantastic cycles, especially the second.

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/cortes_testtrendbol_run

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/bbbs_hgh_protocol_

http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_gear/the_hgh_experiement

Thanks for your interest!

[/quote]

I’m going to check these out too.

I have to say man you clearly know your shit when it comes to training and AAS, would be good if you would get involved with the AAS subforum and training areas of the site again.

Come back to us Cortes, we need you!
[/quote]

Haha. I don’t know, I kind of left that forum behind. Maybe I could be dragged back there, but the couple of times I’ve popped back over there I ended up leaving pretty quickly. Not because anything was necessarily wrong with the forum itself, it seemed pretty much the same to me. Just because I felt I’d kind of grown out of it.

I will say that I am always happy to address direct questions so if there happen to be any and you make a thread over there please feel free to point me that way and I’ll do what I can if my schedule allows it (I have busy periods which is why you see me disappear and pop back up after a month or two again).

I will also add that when I first joined this website, having been led here by the print publication, I was 5’11", 175lbs, and I used to wonder if I would ever manage to achieve the 220+ with abs physique I dreamed of having. A few years later (having made a ton of progress well before employing AAS), I was absolutely thrilled to find that even a lifetime weak-sauce skinny-boy hardgainer like myself could have the honor of receiving such flattering compliments as you and Cap has paid me here. Thanks so much, I’m seriously nothing special except that I relentlessly study and relentlessly persevere.

[/quote]

I can actually totally understand how you could grow out of the AAS subforum. While AAS is a pretty daunting topic when you first start looking into it, you learn pretty quickly that once you know what ancilliaries to use with what compounds there’s not much else to know. As for the forum itself, there’s only so many times you can tell a noob “500mg test E for 12 weeks” before you start just to not care anymore.

[/quote]
Haha, exactly. I found out a long time ago how to do exactly what I wanted to do with my body using the training, food, supps and drugs that are available to us, how to acquire and make everything myself, how to keep my body fine tuned with the correct amount and ratios of all of this, and how to reduce negative side effects to basically zero. I like helping people, but I need to be learning something in the process, as well, I guess.

If you do check out the BSL forum, do not start out in the “Meathead Camaraderie” thread. You will never go back.[/quote]
Was it something that I said?[/quote]

LOL. I think you know better than that.

[quote]Cortes wrote:
By the way, there’s a term for when the bulk of one’s argument rests upon the purported authority of men with letters behind their names.

It can be found here:

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/[/quote]

What fallacy specifically are you referring to?

I don’t see which fallacy is being committed.

Edit: If you’re referring to the appeal to authority fallacy, and the above is your understanding of it, then you don’t understand it.

[quote]Cortes wrote:
Sure that’s true, but the comment I was taking umbrage against compared a man taking transforming himself into a female to another man taking AAS in order to become bigger, stronger, and generally more awesome.
[/quote]

I’m going to have to play the Devil’s advocate here. Could an equal, if not greater, case be made for recreational (by which I mean, unrelated to performance in one’s profession) AAS use being a symptom of mental illness? Many such users would fit the criteria for a substance-related disorder, and most for a body dysmorphic disorder.

A larger point of contention is the subjectivity of what one might consider “generally more awesome”. If that guy leads a happier life as a girl, than that’s more awesome for her. On the other hand, there are many who would consider our physique goals (or our physiques) grotesque rather than awesome.

The only real difference I see here is that one side is incongruent with the individual’s biological sex. I personally don’t give a flying fuck about what hormones anybody else chooses to take. I just think it’s important to consider that everyone else has a right to their own body and may not have the same idea of “awesome” as you do.

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:
Mental illness? [/quote]

No, its a disorder/physical problem, some studies show that due to conditions in the womb (exact cause remains unknown) these people develop the brain of the opposite sex but a different body.

It would literally be like you being in a woman’s body now

It’s not some sort of impulsive decision, it involves many consultations and steps with experts. Courtesy of the new DSM[/quote]

Some studies, which studies? Please cite them.