Hey guys. I am noticing some PIP that lasts longer then normal and the odd headache post injection on this gear. It’s test 250 but I homebrewed it and I think it may be dosed a little higher.
I used 2% ba and 18% bb, but the powder was already introduced to heat (I thought it was moisture at the time but it didn’t seem possible…then I noticed how hot that room got one day amd it clicked)…
Anyways I measured the ML of the oil and did the math on how much test roughly I had but this is my first homebrew I’ve had this issue. All the others were fine.
The concentration isn’t what would cause the pip. Which ester is it? And what carrier oil did you use?
It’s Enanthate and grapeseed . I made a post a few months ago I was going to revive to just continue with all the details. I couldn’t weigh the powder very well. I got it weight roughly then did the math on the displacement after melting it to get ballpark 250mg/ml.
Well melting it may have had something to do with the pip. Liquefying the hormone is unnecessary and who the Hell knows how much you changed the chemical composition by doing that. My guess would be a combination of enanthate hurting more all on its own and your decision to melt it gave it extra pip.
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Are you saying you let the ba/bb help your powders turn to an oil patiently and don’t add any heat or just adding heat to test e powder without ba/bb in it is what could change the properties.
I can make sense of either one I just want to know exactly where I am going wrong. You helped me on that past post with @now_i_care and a direct quote from him was
- “any estered hormones can be held in oily solution if heated high enough for long enough and it can hold without ANY solvents like BB or whatever. Now I would not brew without BB but still it is something to think about. Also we need the heat during the brew to sterilize.”
So I take that theory with your statement just now as I should have placed the powder in the carrier and heated the carrier that way. (Ba/ba as well I’m any normal.circumstance but just the two for the sake of understanding what I did wrong adding heat to the powder)
Or… I guess in the end. Do you mean that because I stored it in a room that was too warm and it reached somewhat of a melting point and then was discovered later in a state of mush that I may have damaged the chemical properties not sustaining it in anything
Heating the powder in an un cooled room until it turned into an oily goo did absolutely nothing to damage it, as long as that is all that happened.
There is a re occuring theme with test enanthate and that is some batches just hurt once injected. I have been having that issue myself, I was going for 400 mg per ml. The pain is supposed to be from carbolic acid, enanthate is a carbolic acid so there is going to be some in there after they manufacturer it. They are supposed to clean it out but they don’t always do a very good job. A former large volume manufacturer told me that he heard that you can cook out the excessive carbolic acid by heating to 205 and stirring for over half an hour. Another thought on the cause of PIP is because the brew was simply not hott enough long enough. Like I said I have had the issue myself. So this last brew what I did was put just the test enanthate and just the carrier oil into a beaker then heated it. That guy told me if you want to try and cook out the carbolic then just heat it with the carrier, no bb or ba. Add those later. Well before I started I looked up carbolic acid and they have many different kinds and their evaporation temps vary all the way up to 300 degrees. Well not knowing exact what carbolic was my by product I decided to heat and stir but I changed the temp throughout the process. I put it on my auto stir hot plate and just varied the temp. I probably heated it almost 1.5 hours and ranged the temps all the way up to about 275 the temp where my carrier MCT oil can start to turn brown.
I also did a blend of tests I did 200 of each cyp and enanthate for a total of 400.
I can tell you that so far everyone that had issues with my prior test have had no issues with my new heated and blended test.
So if it were me and I don’t k ow your set up. First I would find out what temp GSO turns brown or burns or evaporates. If it turns brown at 280 then you know not to heat that hot when you try to cook out the carbolic. Now if you don’t have an automatic magnetic stirring hotplate then the cook out will be a pain but you can manage. I told you how long I was told and how long I did. Also when I actually did the “brew” with BB and BA then I just pretended I never pre heated it to cook out. I just treated it like a virgin brew and set up the hot plate auto stir. The brew was around 250 ish. I know my cyp doesn’t melt until close to boiling temp or 212. I probably let it stir and heat for close to 45 minutes if not longer. Then and this was once a theory of mine but it has been backed up by numerous sources; I always make my brews do a “slow” cool down. Basically once the hot plate and beaker were under 150 degrees I put a top on the beaker then wrapped a dish towel around the beaker. This let’s it cool slowly and I believe this is very important to help stop it from crashing later.
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I’m actually waiting on a magnetic hot plate and some smaller media to perform a few different tests of my own but I will start with testing my gso for sure and seeing where it starts to change then working bellow that with the stuff.
I can say that I may not have heated it long enough for sure. It’s looking real nice and clean and has been sitting for a while. But my last two pokes sucks for hard muscle and pip and just simply not absorbing. My buddy did one in each shoulder and both times got headaches and pip he can’t seem to ignore. His theory was the 400+mg/ml. I thought nothing of it because my reaction to the gear was minor compared to his and I thought I may have not been deep enough into the glute.
When I get the new equipment I will pretty much replicate what you do. And try the stuff again. If I can get this gear to an acceptable quality for use I’ll be happier then anything.
I’ll chime back in here next week after I give it a go and poke it
My brew is oil, BB, BA, raw powder, stir until mixed. I’ve never had to use any heat. I know some people do. And I was allowing for the possibility that you had gotten the heat too high, but if you didn’t then it’s unlikely that’s causing the pip.
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I heated it for about 40 mins to 200⁰ and it did appear to make a difference. I put a ml in my glute and its been about 4.5 days I have a hard spot there still. But I chocked it up to potentially not a great injection. My shoulder took it a little better.
When I started considering all the factors and my route to repairing the gear quality I didn’t want to dilute at all because I’m fairly certain my numbers aren’t crazy far off. The powder getting warm and oily may have caused this but I’m actually considering now maybe my GSO. I did change it. My last few bottles were made with GSO that was purchased in store. I tried an online “medical supplier” for the newest batch and now I see this problem.
I am doing some Sus next time so I may do a couple from each gso the exact same way and see if they’re any different.
I’m not sure it could be carbolic because this powder is the same powder from the very successful original batches. The only changes were where I bought the gso, the powder being oily and measured in ML after by the gram. Then brewed based on volume of test e in melted form. My math was at 250mg/ml and you (@now_i_care ) corrected me with it at 200mg/ml on that other post. So im sure I’m somewhere between our numbers and not sitting at 400mg/ml
I’ll know more when I get the sus powder on the gso I suppose.
Theoretically though. If I have absorption issues sometimes and someone else says it’s the best gear they’ve used in a while (vet running lean bulk) and someone else in their third month of their first cycle only started having problems on the bottle from this batch. Could we rule in the volume of test mg/ml again as possibly dosed high? @iron_yuppie