Ortiz vs Griffin

Bigger Stronger Leaner Powerlifting & Strength Sports
1

I want to warn everyone before going any further, if you have not yet seen the Oritz vs Griffin fight and want to be surprised when you do see it, read no further!

I think Forrest Griffin has proven that he is a force to be reckoned with in last nights loss to Tito Ortiz. Griffin frustrated Tito on at least four takedown attempts, causing the Ortiz to look forlorn at times. You could almost read his mind: “Why can’t I take this guy down at will?”

Tito came out as I predicted, with a vengence and all but owned Griffin in the first round. Taking him down and throwing elbow after elbow that caused some damage, and generally doing what he is noted for.

However, Griffin roaring back in the second round proved that he’s no quitter. Moving around in an odd way, but relentlessly throwing punch after punch.

Many thought that Griffin won the fight. But in all honesty, while it was a close fight, I have to agree with the judges. Tito beat him fair and square.

I watched it live last night and then reviewed the tape this morning and, while I am not a Tito Ortiz fan he did win the fight. I base this on his total domination of the first round, his two takedowns, and the punches (and elbows) that he landed causing far more damage than anything Griffin threw.

As I stated, Tito took him down twice and while Forrest threw many punches only three or so actually landed solidly. The others were very skillfully dodged or deflected by Tito. Tito threw less punches but more seemed to land, and in fact a couple rocked Griffin somewhat.

One more comment, I thought Tito ran into just a bit of a conditioning problem (nothing major)by the third round. While Forrest looked even more fresh in the third round than he did in the first.

What is it that makes Griffin a good fighter?

HEART!

And heart is sometimes all it takes to go the distance (hey you’ve seen the Rocky films :).

The game has come a long way since the early ground and pound days. If Tito is going to vie for the light heavy weight crown he needs to become an even better striker and also improve his submissions. Otherwise, I don’t see him coming close to beating Lidell.

But if he proved nothing else last night (and he may not have) it was that he is not going away and will be at least a contender for the next several years.

Anyone else have any thoughts?

2

i agree with everything you said - can’t add anything to a comprehensive post other than -
i wonder whats up with Ortizs leg? Was that the previous acl injury side?
A good fight.

3

[quote]Ryu wrote:
i agree with everything you said - can’t add anything to a comprehensive post other than -
i wonder whats up with Ortizs leg? Was that the previous acl injury side?
A good fight.[/quote]

I’m not sure about the injury. But did you hear Griffin talk about his one knee strike?

He stated that he kicked the knee saw Tito fall off balance and then thought he should stay away from it. Something on the order of him (griffin) being too nice a guy to go after a mans injury.

4

Forrest said that Tito won the fight fair square by virtue of his takedown in the third. That being said, I agree with the judges. Tito looked confused and lost with Griffin’s great sprawling, and generally gun shy when Forrest would throw. But Tito won this one, even though it only felt like half a fight. There’s some unfinished business there.

5

[quote]ZEB wrote:
I want to warn everyone before going any further, if you have not yet seen the Oritz vs Griffin fight and want to be surprised when you do see it, read no further!

I think Forrest Griffin has proven that he is a force to be reckoned with in last nights loss to Tito Ortiz. Griffin frustrated Tito on at least four takedown attempts, causing the Ortiz to look forlorn at times. You could almost read his mind: “Why can’t I take this guy down at will?”

Tito came out as I predicted, with a vengence and all but owned Griffin in the first round. Taking him down and throwing elbow after elbow that caused some damage, and generally doing what he is noted for.

However, Griffin roaring back in the second round proved that he’s no quitter. Moving around in an odd way, but relentlessly throwing punch after punch.

Many thought that Griffin won the fight. But in all honesty, while it was a close fight, I have to agree with the judges. Tito beat him fair and square.

I watched it live last night and then reviewed the tape this morning and, while I am not a Tito Ortiz fan he did win the fight. I base this on his total domination of the first round, his two takedowns, and the punches (and elbows) that he landed causing far more damage than anything Griffin threw.

As I stated, Tito took him down twice and while Forrest threw many punches only three or so actually landed solidly. The others were very skillfully dodged or deflected by Tito. Tito threw less punches but more seemed to land, and in fact a couple rocked Griffin somewhat.

One more comment, I thought Tito ran into just a bit of a conditioning problem (nothing major)by the third round. While Forrest looked even more fresh in the third round than he did in the first.

What is it that makes Griffin a good fighter?

HEART!

And heart is sometimes all it takes to go the distance (hey you’ve seen the Rocky films :).

The game has come a long way since the early ground and pound days. If Tito is going to vie for the light heavy weight crown he needs to become an even better striker and also improve his submissions. Otherwise, I don’t see him coming close to beating Lidell.

But if he proved nothing else last night (and he may not have) it was that he is not going away and will be at least a contender for the next several years.

Anyone else have any thoughts?

[/quote]

Good overview of the fight. I agree.

6

I don’t know, I like Forrest and his tenacity is undeniable, but he either needs to polish his striking up a lot or become stronger and faster. He was eating that left jab out of Tito every time he threw and Tito’s jab seemed to have more sting than anything Forrest was throwing. Tito has never had what one might term a quality standup game or even a remotely threatening one, but it is safe and effective for what he does. He got exposed against Liddell, but there aren’t too many in the UFC LHW division who can say they haven’t.

I don’t know if it was conditioning or his knee that caused Tito to slow, but it seemed as if his takedowns in the second and third were lacking explosiveness, and a knee injury will take a lot out of a fighter who does tend to muscle his takedowns. Anyways, I thought it was a good fight, and without any LHW’s in the UFC, Tito will probably be looking at a rematch with Liddell should he win against Shamrock.

As a sidenote, any fans who boo during these events should be subjected to a sparring session with Liddell, Sylvia, and Arlovski…even though I didn’t agree with the Penn/GSP decision, I was pretty pissed that everyone was booing him in the postfight interview.

7

[quote]slimjim wrote:
…I like Forrest and his tenacity is undeniable, but he either needs to polish his striking up a lot or become stronger and faster. [/quote]

Perfectly stated.

The thing about Forrest is this: he’s someone who could become a dominating force in MMA. Why? Because of his heart, drive, and resilience. Those are three of the most important attributes that any fighter can possess, but they CAN’T be taught. A person either has them, or he doesn’t.

Forrest is cool because he’s willing to admit that his skills aren’t great. But that can be fixed. A lack of heart, drive, and resilience, on the other hand, can’t be fixed.

8

[quote]slimjim wrote:
As a sidenote, any fans who boo during these events should be subjected to a sparring session with Liddell, Sylvia, and Arlovski…even though I didn’t agree with the Penn/GSP decision, I was pretty pissed that everyone was booing him in the postfight interview.[/quote]

Well said!

What man would not take the victory upon hearing the judges decision?

9

It was a very close fight, and I have to agree that Tito won though I question the judge who gave all three rounds to Tito. Was he not watching round 2?

I was dissapointed at first, but the more I think about it, I am more impressed with Tito the fight in general. I expected Griffin to win, based on his recent performances versus Tito in every fight since losing to Randy. Even the ones he won(Cote, Shamrock) seemed to lack some ‘Tito-ness’.

The second round was a perfect example of one fighter being completely frustrated by his opponent. Tito has never liked getting hit(I know that is a dumb statement, who really does–other than Forrest), and last night was an example of that. Though not near as bad as the Silva fight(run), he was obviously not in his game for all of the second and most of the third.

10

What really gave ortiz the win was that takedown at the end of round 3, griffin just couldn’t get that sprawl in, although he was countering nicely and looked good on his back, the decision had to go to ortiz.
Man i was crushed after arlovski get ko’ed, i mean you cant argue with that ref stoppage because there was no where else to go for arlovski he couldnt defend himself, i mean he should’ve kept silviya on this back after that punch or even taken him down after sylvia got back up but he got overconfident and went in with his hands down. heh Sylvia beat him fair and square, anyways ortiz did have a knee injury you guys can see the post-fight interview on sherdog, along with the other interviews:

11

To answer everyone’s question about Ortiz’s leg…he has a partially torn ACL. The injury happened during taping of The Ultimate Figher. So, major props to Tito for not pulling out of the fight.

I, too, thought Tito won but agree the fight was very close. Griffin showed a lot of heart.

The Ortiz-Shamrock fight will likely be pushed back a few months so Tito can rehab his knee injury. The fight was scheduled for July but I’d guess it will happen sometime between October-December.

12

I wonder if they are going to give Griffen a chance to bang on Shamrock since Ortiz is out with a torn ACL?
Hope so!!

Thank you and GOODNIGHT!!!

Cheers Rick

13

[quote]ZEB wrote:
Ryu wrote:
i agree with everything you said - can’t add anything to a comprehensive post other than -
i wonder whats up with Ortizs leg? Was that the previous acl injury side?
A good fight.

I’m not sure about the injury. But did you hear Griffin talk about his one knee strike?

He stated that he kicked the knee saw Tito fall off balance and then thought he should stay away from it. Something on the order of him (griffin) being too nice a guy to go after a mans injury.

[/quote]

Zeb - i did’nt hear any of the post fight interviews but Griffen staying away from the injured leg is a great thing for him to do. Many people probably think hes a moron for doing it but i certainly feel a greater measure of respect for him as a person and a fighter - always looking for the harder option lol.

14

[quote]Ryu wrote:
ZEB wrote:
Ryu wrote:
i agree with everything you said - can’t add anything to a comprehensive post other than -
i wonder whats up with Ortizs leg? Was that the previous acl injury side?
A good fight.

I’m not sure about the injury. But did you hear Griffin talk about his one knee strike?

He stated that he kicked the knee saw Tito fall off balance and then thought he should stay away from it. Something on the order of him (griffin) being too nice a guy to go after a mans injury.

Zeb - i did’nt hear any of the post fight interviews but Griffen staying away from the injured leg is a great thing for him to do. Many people probably think hes a moron for doing it but i certainly feel a greater measure of respect for him as a person and a fighter - always looking for the harder option lol.[/quote]

If that’s true, and I have no reason to disbelieve it. That’s something that is almost unheard of in this day and age. And it should be talked about more.

15

Some clips of Forrest in training, and a casual mini-interview. Griffin definitely seems like a laid-back kind of guy.

I didn’t see the fight either, but from everything I’ve read, it sounds like it was a decent decision.

[quote]ZEB wrote:
If that’s true, and I have no reason to disbelieve it. That’s something that is almost unheard of in this day and age. And it should be talked about more.[/quote]
I think you’re talking about tiny little concepts known as “professionalism” and “class”. Very true, it would be better for the sport as a whole if those were more common traits.

16

watched the other two rounds in slow motion and looked at every exchange and yes, it did take a little time to do, but I got the stats for the fight and if anybody wants to question it they can get a tape out and run through all these points because I marked every point in the fight where something clearly landed. Believe me, in real time it looks as if alot more is being done to each fighter.

They are swinging and missing quite a bit and this expecially applies to Forrest who looks like he was dishing out a lot more then what he did. Tito was covering up and being very defensive, Forrest missed a few close ones that look like they landed in real time, but clearly missed in slow mo. Here are all the significant points in those two rounds going by the clock.

2nd round:
4:57 Tito-left, Forrest-grazing right/4:56 Forrest-right/4:49 Tito-left, Forrest-left/4:28 Forrest-left/4:25 Tito-grazing left hook/4:08 Tito-left hook/4:05 Tito-grazing right hook/4:00 Forrest-right/3;51 Tito-left/3:42 Forrest-left/2:58 Tito-left hook/2:47 Tito-left/2:17 Forrest-left hook/1:46 Forrest-left, Tito-right/1:43 Forrest-right/1:38 Forrest-left/1:33 Forrest-left hook/1:15 Tito-left/1:04 Tito-left/:58 Forrest-right hook body/:53 Forrest-left hook/:34 Forrest-left/:27 Tito-left/:12 Tito-left, Forrest-left

Tito landed: 14 Forrest landed: 14
I got this round dead even, but Forrest gets it because he pushed the action better IMO.

3rd round:
4:58 Tito-left/4:38 Tito-left/4:18 Tito-left/4:16 Tito-right/3:30 Tito-right hook/3:08 Tito-left/3:01 Tito-right hook/2:58 Tito-left/2:56 Forrest right hook/2:50 Tito-left/2:40 Forrest- right low kick/2:28 Forrest-left/2:00 Forrest-right uppercut/1:45 Tito-right/1:37 Tito-takedown(right hook from top)/:13 Forrest-left hook/:9 Forrest-left

Tito landed: 11 Forrest landed: 6
Tito obviously won this round. Look at the tape. Most of what Forrest threw was blocked. Tito was countering well and he got the takedown. Forrest’s elbows don’t count because they had no leaverage and didn’t even hit with the point of the elbow.

NOT WRITTEN BY ME

17

I missed the fights. Someone please tell me how in the HELL Arlovski lost to Silvia. I am absolutely stunned by this. Was Arlovski sloppy? Over confident? Surely he is a better fighter!

18

[quote]nolecat wrote:
I missed the fights. Someone please tell me how in the HELL Arlovski lost to Silvia. I am absolutely stunned by this. Was Arlovski sloppy? Over confident? Surely he is a better fighter![/quote]

Arlovski vs. Sylvia

19

[quote]ZEB wrote:

Tito beat him fair and square.
[/quote]

“Fairly squarely”, IMO

20

[quote]michael2507 wrote:
Arlovski vs. Sylvia

That almost looked like a throat shot that made Arlovski go down. Could just be the bad camera angle.

YouTube keeps amazing me. Here’s the last 4 minutes of Round 3 between Ortiz and Griffin. Be forewarned, the guy doing the videotaping was pretty shaky at some points, so there are some spastic moments. But, it does give some decent shots of nice action.