T Nation

Oral Only Cycles


#1

Read some threads on here discouraging orals only. If you’re going to add to that on this thread, your time is best spent elsewhere.

A little brief: I’ve been living in Japan for about 10 years, lifting for most of it. I’ve decided to do a cycle, but ran into the legalities of syringes here – they’re a no-go in other words.

I’ve read many success stories / cycles of others, but they generally include an injectable in the stack. Is there any legitimate oral only information out there including type and dosage along with recommended PCT? Guides with pros, cons and real user’s sides would be most appreciated.

So far, I’m leaning more towards an OT cycle.


#2

Click on the top post in the pharma page ‘About the Pharma category,’ look specifically into the ‘Steroid newbie cycle planning’ post.
The Short cycle part has some oral only options that may be of help.


#3

I certainly think blood testing would be important for oral only cycles, liver damage is no joke.
I personally find my liver enzymes are elevated on injectable cycles (given they were high dosing). My point is, genetics play a big role with how your body deals/not deals with orals… some people experience organ pains whilst others tolerate them well.

I have not used orals only but feel I may do at some point.


#4

If I was going to do an oral only cycle I’d run anavar at 200mg a day for as long as I could afford it, which would be no time, so I guess I wouldn’t do it.

Hope that helps!


#5

And as for cons: well, any oral steroid is going to be hard on your system.

Even a “mild” steroid like anavar will have your lipids in the shitter from pretty much day one, which may or not cause some serious problems (but it’ll never be good).

Chances are that if you can get your hands on injectable steroids, you’ll be able to find needles.


#6

Thanks. Going to read into that thread now (soon as I find it).

The hospital nearby has tests that cover this for a few dollars:
CBC WBC/RBC/Hgb/Hct/platelets
GOT/GPT/γ-GPT
Triglyceride/HDL/LDL/total cholesterol

But I think it would be important to pay more to see where I stand from 5 years ago in regards to testosterone levels (although it would be a PITA to get TRT anyway, since it didn’t work then) before and after the cycle.

Is there anything else you would add to check for before/during/after? And what would they indicate?


#7

A few things…

  1. Are you able to get an AI and PCT drugs? If you can’t obtain these (I would look for Arimidex and Nolvadex, generically known as anastrozole and tamoxifen), then I wouldn’t run the cycle. You don’t want to risk not being able to recover from the cycle, and then being out of luck because you can’t get syringes to do ‘self administered’ TRT. Just a risk I wouldn’t take.

  2. My first cycle was oral only. It was Epistane. I loved it. Ran it for 6 weeks at 40mg per week. I gained a lot of strength on it. Anavar and Dbol would be better options, I just did the Epistane because it was legal at the time. It tanked my testosterone though. A week or 2 after my cycle ended, I got bloodwork done. Testosterone was essentially at zero (too low to be measure). That sucked. Be prepared for that as a possibility.

  3. The biggest issue with oral only, in my opinion, is the low ceiling, and the fact that gains will be so difficult to maintain for long, mainly because you just won’t gain that much in the first place. And after your first cycle or 2, you will have made as much progress as you ever will. I wouldn’t have done an oral only cycle if I wasn’t prepared to do injectables in the future.

  4. Since you asked about dose… It depends on your source. If your anavar is 100% legit, you could use as low as 50mg/day, and get substantial results. Most people go up to about 100mg/day, but I believe that’s because they’re getting lower quality gear. Dbol should be run at 50mg/day. It’s rarely faked, so dosing is more clear.

Hopefully this helps.


#8

Supposedly, pills and powders of AAS/test/etc. are allowed into the country. So hypothetically as long as the source is legit, the package will arrive. The only problem lies in syringes for at-home concoctions, which is why I have turned to trying oral-only cycles.

I’ve been looking into PH’s and orals. It seems safer - to say the least - to do orals as they have been researched to a degree, unlike PH’s.

There is a problem in the misinformation that I seek though. As OT doesn’t aromatize some say that A-dex isn’t necessary; though, others say keep it on hand as you never know as some could be prone to gyno. As I have gyno that never went away from my teens, I think that this ought to be kept on hand from what I’ve read.

This is what I’ve thought as well. If I shut down, won’t I need TRT? In that case, it’s simple blood work for a doctor to see a 0 count. Afterwards, I’d get a script for it (unsure if self-administered or not). Is this a route that some people take for legit test? Shut down and then get tested?


#9

Check AST, ALT levels (liver enzymes). They are raised when liver is damaged or injured, or in the process to being so…

As long as the levels return to normalcy post cycle you are okay. Given, levels are not massively out of whack when on cycle (personally mine were moderately elevated).

From looking into oral cycles one option looks promising, Anadrol and Wini.
They seem complementary in effects, aside from being in the same class.
I say this due to the water retention that may arise with Dbol, not a want of mine. Plus I personally like the hard leaner look for my goals…

BUT i would go with Tbol if you can afford to splash out on it… I cant legitimise spending so much for it at the price tag.


#10

I chose T-Bol over Winny because I saw that the consensus from most people was that a side effect was terrible joint pain. Do you say otherwise? I’m new to this, so haven’t picked an oral cycle as of yet, but I do know that I don’t want to do D-Bol because of the water retention.


#11

This is a highly individual thing, but the water retention issue is not a problem for a lot of people. It doesn’t make everyone look like a marshmallow, lol. I was on Dbol in my profile picture on here.

As for your question about TRT, what you’re saying is something I’m sure people have done. It makes little sense to do it in America, considering we can buy syringes easily, but in your case, I think the approach has more merit. Once you can get syringes, it would open up a lot more options.


#12

So theres no pins in a country that makes robots WTF… Grow a pair and order them online… Otherwise enjoy spending lots of $$$ for sub par gainz… People order pins for pet meds and all kinds of shit… I think this is a cover story for being a vag…Jus sayin


#13

LOL. You can’t be serious.

EDIT: Maybe you are serious. You can’t go online and buy syringes. No company will deliver syringes to a private individual in Japan. Ain’t gonna happen. A person could bring them into the country via a suitcase or something, but you risk jail if you get caught. Their laws are MUCH different from ours. Hell, you can go to jail for bringing adderall into the country, even if you have a prescription. Not kidding.


#14

Then Japan sucks… Except the food and weird sex stuff… Like real jail or just a fine like getting busted with a bag of weed here? In the US we order all kinds of juice from over seas hows the risk any different? Usually if you even get caught customs seizes your package and sends you a letter. Even if a company wouldnt send it, it wouldnt be hard to to have a friend do it from any other country… Not recomending this but in the USA we order stuff all the time and we have the DEA… Also the worlds largest Prison population so if any one is tough on crime its us and how often do you ever even hear of people getting busted… Its just not the focus


#15

Customs is the difference, generally speaking. I don’t actually know what they do if someone ships a box of needles to you and Customs discovers it. They might send a letter, but that’s not necessarily the case. They don’t HAVE to do things the way we do, after all.

And it’s not that Japan is tougher on crime overall necessarily, just very different laws with very different punishment structures.

And as a side note, last time I looked into it, it’s actually legal to possess anabolic steroids in Japan. So go figure. You can have a bag of testosterone powder, but you can’t reconstitute it and shoot it up. That’s why orals are a viable solution there. Nobody is getting in trouble for steroids, just needles. I’m sure the source of the laws is recreational drug-related.


#16

LOL, hebrewhero you crack me up man.


#17

Yep. Nobody is going down for steroids here, only syringes. Syringes are out of the question unless I can somehow obtain them legally (ie, the example above for getting self-administered TRT through a “shutdown”).

I’m trying to plan an oral only cycle, but there is a lot of information that isn’t quite pieced together right – or contradictory from source to source which makes it all seem wrong. Then, there is always that large group of people that state it’s not worth it as all gains will be lost, which also appears to be arguable as well.

Would it be best if I just pieced together what I think would be best after my research and post it for criticism?


#18

Go with Tbol, from all accounts its a great option, I did some looking back when i was considering using it…
A little bit milder than others, and some people say the results slow down past week 5/6.

Do more looking into Tbol you should be able to find some info on the web. Even some studies about it that were on the this board I believe. I’d have used it myself, but the cost for the needed mg’s is around a normal injection based cycle, thats from the darknet sources in AU…


#19

My Bad Baka… Its just every week someone posts a thing about orals only cuz they are too pussy to pin… I see this isnt the case… That sucks man… If it was me I’d find away to get pins. Sick pet, diabetes, trt… If you could somehow get a box of 1000 slins that would be best imo… Cheap and really unless your a faty you can use them on your oils too


#20

Yeah, I wish it weren’t the case. I was in the military and remember having 100s of shots; I would have no problem administering one to myself (which will be the case if I can get TRT the 2nd time, and you don’t need to go in each week for the shot, I honestly don’t know how that would work).

It’s the fact that I’d be doing hard time in a work camp on a 1500 calorie diet if caught with paraphernalia such as even 1 syringe.

Orals are truly the only feasible way I can see running any type of cycle while living here.

Still reading up on TBOL, PCT, etc. from others who’ve run a cycle…