This is a very complex question.
You should maintain your t levels at TRT where you feel best. Usually it is higher than natural levels of a young person due to the fact no TRT protocol can mimmick the intelligent way the body of a healthy young person produces testosterone. And with the years we build androgen resistance on receptor levels that needs to be overcome
And more is not necessarily better. For example these days Im switching from sustanon to cypionate, and to avoid the huge drops from the loss of the short esters I decided to take both compounds for 5 days. So now I feel a bit overwhelmed and easy to agitate, I guess my levels are pretty high right now.
My “natural” level was 170 total t, before Trt. So my levels on trt are definitely higher than my natural level. I think that was the point of going on trt, for me.
You’re better off with T only and once you get to where you feel great you can introduce HCG if your heart so desires. The Exemestane is just going to further complicate shit as well. If feeling optimal is your main priority then T only is your best bet especially if you want to get there remotely soon. I’m sure the HCG is to preserve fertility but you don’t need it right now unless you are actively trying to conceive. I have a good relationship with two of NYC’s top fertility docs (the ones the celebrities use) and both tools me without a doubt you don’t need HCG until you’re ready to conceive.
I’ve done the same shit you are and until I went to T only I never felt anything near how I feel now.
Okay man, thanks for the advice. I am startimg to feel better, so seeing as its been 5 weeks since the change was made I think I’ll wait the 8-12 weeks that most people recommend, but for sure if I’m not where I need to be I’ll suggest 8-12 weeks of T only to see how I feel on that.
Because other than Libido and erections (although this from what I have read on here can take 6 months), I do feel better in other areas, certainly much better than I did pre TRT (mood/energy/recovery etc) so thats why I am thinking of staying the course currently. Obviously if I felt terrible in every aspect I would think nothing of changing it for T only now, but as I am noticing imptovements in other areas I feel I should give it a little bit more time to see? For all I know this might be the right protocol for me and I’d hate to change that after only 5 weeks. Thats my thought process for maybe holding out for 12 weeks and then re-evaluating and then depending how I feel take up your advice of T only… call me mad! Thanks for the advice
I’m not sure that it’s an apples to apples comparison. At 303 ng/dL (my natural level at that point) I had all the symptoms of low T. My initial dose put me at 519 ng/dL. That’s pretty much the value an average man might have and cured MOST of my symptoms but not all. I still suffered from delayed orgasm. My dose was bumped up and my new level is 818 ng/dL. That resolved my delayed orgasm as well. Everything is working fine. But 818 ng/dL is higher than the typical man’s natural levels although not outside the physiologic range. But remember that when you are natural they typically measure your T at its highest in the morning and it can fluctuate significantly. You might be at 600 ng/dL in the morning but only at 400 ng/dL in the afternoon. On TRT they typically measure at trough so my 818 ng/dL is my low point just before I take another dose. My levels are more stable on gel but probably range 818 - 1000 ng/dL or so. That’s much higher than an average man though again, not supraphysiologic. But I have no negative side effects so I don’t see it as a problem as long as it resolves my symptoms.
I wonder if this is dependent on external factors rather than just hormones. I would describe my results as about like I was in my late 20s to early 30s but not my teens. But my life situation is much more like it was in my late 20s to early 30s than in my teens too. I’m not a horny teenager trying to meet a girl and hoping to get lucky anymore much as I enjoyed that feeling.
Just a quick question for if I decide to go on a TRT dose after my 400mg. With my testosterone already being through the roof on a higher dose (I can tell. Facial hair and body hair growing fast as all heck, massive energy and strength before taking those stupid AIs and crashing E2, etc.), will my T levels gradually drop down to a TRT dose level and then sail from there, or is some type of testosterone crash possible to happen? Like dropping to lower than it ever was before starting then waiting for it to come back up with TRT? Thanks.
When we do TRT it’s no longer natural. Therefore take the opportunity and leverage it for all its worth. Keep levels at a good range to achieve max benefits .
Just because I’m 50 and naturally should have a level of 20 does not men’s I keep it at 20.
For example my father is 75 and he’s 15. Some would say no way a man his age has that high of free t. Usually that’s a 50 year old.
What i am saying is that natural levels are shit. We don’t really know what true natural levels were for men until shit hit the fan and we started to pay attention. That’s after modernization and the world became toxic.
Optimize your hormones and get all the benefits from health and wellness to productive benefits from cancer and other illnesses men get in older age.
That makes a lot of sense, great perspective and input! The thing with me is, I am still in my 20s. So why would I do TRT? Well, I am combining it with smaller blasts of 400-500mg because my father who is an ex accomplished bodybuilder with thousands of clients is starting a business and we will be virtual and nation wide, and as he is in his 50s he is using me as his physical model. In other words, my body will be making him and I money. So, with that being said, do you have any idea how TRT would affect me any different than someone in their 50s? Would I just simply have higher levels on TRT because my natural is already much higher?
Provided you are doing blasts you have already compromised your natural test levels.
You must maintain with TRT where you FEEL best. That’s it. THere is no magic number. Find where you feel good. For most men 150mg per week is a good starting point split in 2-3-7 injections according to their SHBG.
TRT will not make wonders to your physicue and will not have the effect of a blast. But provided your diet and training are in place you can maintain the gains from blasts. When doing blasts pay very close attention to lipids and liver enzymes and dont be tempted to use orals.
Thanks man! I have only done 1 blast so far, in a few weeks going to my TRT and 140-160 is what I was planning with EOD injections. And yeah no orals. I will not even be hopping on anything other than T and will not surpass 500mg. My dad is a genius with diet and exercise and test alone is enough to make me really competitive as I can see from just 1 blast. I don’t think a lot of these guys who overdo it look great anyways, way too superhuman looking. One blast of 400mg test has me looking phenomenal yet human. Thank god it’s not my goal to look like those guys and destroy my body like that.
No, your endogenous testosterone levels will drop to nothing, as you will be replacing it with exogenous testosterone. Your body will not need to produce it, so it will stop and you will go with whatever you are injecting.
Dont blast and cruise man. Start off and get stable. Get a 200mg dose for your age and run with it. So many guys here get nice and jacked with a TRT dose. Doing blasts is just not smart if you aren’t on a steady dose. It is also too many ups and downs . I have never blasted and cruised before, and I know that guys dont just take an injection and increase the dose once a week. They go on for 2-3 months and then drop back down to TRT levels.
If someone is doing this for anything but therapy I wouldn’t screw with any hormones. It sucks when they drop and you are now stuck with a need for supply and a good doctor. It costs money, time, and takes a ton of patience to get it right. Low T is a nightmare.
I actually am coming to an end really soon with a 12 week blast, it was 400mg. I did have those highs and lows and I don’t like it, I have been contemplating over and over whether I should even do the blasts and I’m seriously leaning towards no. I did get my bloods and everything checked. BP was normal, other bloods were normal, test was obviously quite high and my estradiol was a little low, 16. I am in recovery from crashed E2 from almost 3 weeks ago but am starting to feel way better in the joints, brain, etc. So, from here, do you think a steady dosing of about 160mg would be a good one to run with? I would inject EOD for hormone balance, no AI. A dose of .5mg adex 2x a week was enough to crash me on 400mg, so I would assume stay away from it on 160?
There may be a very slight mental drop off between the 400mg and the leveling off at TRT doses where you feel a little less than once you level out but it won’t be that noticeable. It’s very important that you don’t go into it expecting depression, etc when you make the change. Your levels will gradually drop to the new levels so it won’t be very noticeable at all. If it’s feasible I would go from 400mg to 300mg for two weeks and then drop down to 200mg TRT dose and stay there but it’s not completely necessary.
It should be said that you shouldn’t do TRT unless you need it. I get the sense that you are looking only for body improvement, and TRT will give you a bit of a boost, and a bigger boost if you have low T. However, that little boost is not worth it IMO, if you don’t have symptoms, or actual measured low T.