So go ahead and measure it. Doesn’t change my life 
The doctors in our group have thousands of patients among them and they have pretty much stopped measuring E2. The ONLY time it can become an issue is if some has a disorder where they aren’t making enough of it and E2 is extremely low. For 99% of guys out there, measuring it is just unnecessary. That is considered current best practices with the 10+ doctors in our group - the majority of them trained by Dr. Rouzier.
Once a guy is stable and been on a while, there isn’t much to be gained by measuring it. In the early going it can tell you lot of things, not just if it’s high, but if it’s weirdly low too. I don’t get on any doctor’s bandwagon, the names are essentially meaningless to me. I don’t have much use or respect for 99% of them, because in my experience they don’t deserve any.
Weirdly low is the only time it is of any concern and we’re talking about less than 1% of the population. 99% of men don’t need to worry about it. It isn’t ‘high E2 issues’. It’s ‘low free T issues’.
You’re on a forum where only that 1% with problems are likely to show up. If they were an easy dial in, they wouldn’t be here asking questions, they’d be taking their prescribed dose and unaware anyone has trouble. And you will find men who have issues when their free T gets too high as well. I know that doesn’t fit with the group conviction over there in Oz, but it happens.
Sounds great. Do it that way. We have guys in the group with free T at 60 and they are doing absolutely amazing beyond belief. But that’s ok. Keep your free T low, take the Ai, whatever you feel is best. The docs in our group don’t have a single guy on an AI right now and we are literally talking about thousands of patients. They say 99% because maybe one day they will find one. They haven’t yet. Maybe someone in here is really that special. I call BS. Just look at the thread entitled “Sky High SHBG, Low Free Test. Should I try TRT?” Dr Keith Nichols got him fixed up by ditching the HCG and the AI and getting his free T levels up. He’s in our group. By all means go tell him he doesn’t know what he’s talking about, or the other 10 plus docs there. Guys like Dr Scott Howell who do research on TRT full time. Dr Eric Serrano, Dr Neal Rouzier… go look them up. Just Google them. Tell them they don’t know what they are talking about. But it’s ok… take the AI, by all means!
I have no problem telling a doctor that he’s wrong,or even that he’s a fool, when he is. An E2 of 60 is not high, and most guys would be fine at that number, IMO. Mine is mid 60’s and I use no AI right now. I certainly wouldn’t be so bold as to tell anyone that they should do that though. There are guys who cannot handle E2 in the high 30’s. There are other guys who are fine foe a few years and then suddenly have low E2 and issue, or a spike and issues. If you don’t check that level, you don’t know what solution to look for. You came on here attacking and are shocked that someone punched back. You’re full of crap, go be a zealot somewhere else. This forum discourages AI use in general, which you would know if you had ever read any thing on here. Saying E2 doesn’t matter and cannot be too high is ignorant. A guy with an E2 of 120 is high. He is probably having issues with it that high. There are guys on here with that kind of number. There are a stack of threads about ED, most of them revolving around how it goes away when they manage their E2 a little. I don’t give two farts in the wind about that groups opinion, honestly.
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I said Free T of 60. Not E2. We have guys with E2 over 120 who feel great. Most guys who feel amazing have their free T anywhere between 30-50. You mentioned “stupid high Free T” and I asked you what you consider “stupid high”.
I’d love for you to have a chat with one guy in the group that I spoke with this morning. His E2 is 120 and he says he practically has an erection 24/7 and can’t believe it. Never felt better in his entire life. By all means tell him he must have some issue somewhere.
Guys who claim E2 issues have one of two problems:
- Their free T levels have not been optimized for THEM
- They need to have their thyroid addressed
It. Is. That. Simple.
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300 would be stupid high in many. More is not always better, higher is not always better. There is always a limit on return and then a cross-over into negative territory.
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I wouldn’t say that he has an issue. I would say that his individual case has nothing to do with the next guys’ and blanket advice is foolish. People can have other health issues that do not include the thyroid, and E2 is a complicated hormone. There is no way for anyone to be able to say that E2 issues are really just one of those two things.
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300 isn’t TRT anymore. 300 is AAS.
Depends on the person. That sort of number has been posted on TRT dosing. So, are you admitting that there is an upper limit for Free T to be positive?
Agreed that ideal free T numbers depend on the person. Some guys feel better with a bit less and others with a bit more. Most guys feel best between 30-50. Some guys need as much as 60. I haven’t seen to many people above 60 and, if they were, they were slightly above. Those levels are already starting to get away from what we consider replacement levels. You’re talking about levels 5 times higher. You would need to be taking close to a gram a week to get there. That is not TRT.
@straightnasty WOW. This is ignorance of the highest level. Take my wife as an example. The most positive, motivated person you’ll ever meet. She gave birth and her progesterone levels plummeted. Didn’t matter what she tried to ‘think’ because it was of no use. Absolutely depressed. We fixed her hormones by giving her progesterone (not an anti-depressant as the doctor recommended) and everything went back to normal. If you think it’s just in their head… man, I’ve got news for you: You’re about as wrong as wrong can possibly get.
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yea in all the labs I’ve had low shbg, what does that mean exactly?
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You mean Autobahn? The highway in Germany? You prove you ignorance with every post.
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I couldn’t agree more.
No study in over 70 years showing the benefits of testosterone did they control E2 nor did the men complain of “E2 issues” in those studies. In every study where is was “controlled or blocked” there was harm. E2 is as beneficial to a man as it is a woman. We share every organ system except for our reproductive systems. Its amazing that NONE of the top physicians in the country that practice evidence based medicine and not Bro Science have any men with “estrogen symptoms”. The BS you are spouting out is not supported by any literature whatsoever. It is purely anecdotal and reported by men that think every single symptom they get is estrogen related. Raising E2 with testosterone has never shown any harm…only benefit…IN EVERY STUDY. What most refer to as estrogen causing harm are baseline studies in men not on testosterone with high estrogen levels which is due to their high visceral and subcutaneous body fat which is what is actually causing the harm (insulin resistance) not the E2 which is an innocent bystander and gets blamed.
The more time I spend in here, the more I value the group I’m in. This kind of stuff would never fly. You’d be blocked from the group in a heartbeat. No mods here to speak of. My time here has come to an end.