T Nation

? on Power Snatch in Meltdown II Training

In Meltdown II, the description of the power squat makes it sound like it is two distinct movements, the first like a deadlift, and the second like the second half of a regular snatch. I was under the impression that a snatch was one movement from the floor to the overhead position, finishing by standing up out of the quarter or half squat position. Can somebody clarify the correct way to do this in Meltdown II? Thanks,

MO

A “Power Snatch,” by my understanding, starts just below/just above the knees in order to simplify the lift.

Since Meltdown II has you “rerack” the weight between each rep, it would seem like the lift is a two-parter, but if you were doing it for reps, you would pull to just below the knees, power snatch it up, and put it back to just below the knees, and repeat.

Hope that makes sense.

Dan “Snatch it up!” McVicker

i’m not sure what article you are talking about but…
a power snatch is from the ground all the way up in one motion without dropping under the bar. if you drop under it would be a full snatch (or squat snatch). if you start off the ground, below the knees or around the knees, it is called a hang snatch. and you can do a hang power snatch or a hang full snatch.

Hence, my confusion. . .

MO

MO,

The snatch/power snatch is almost always described in terms of a “first pull” and a “second pull” so that it does in fact make it seem like two lifts. This makes sense for teaching purposes because it is common practice for the first pull to the knees to be slow and then the second pull to be explosive (I won’t get into it, but some lifters can achieve good results with a fast first pull). In actuality, the transition is supposed to be seemless so that it really looks like one continuous move from floor to overhead. Hence the problem - many lifters have trouble transitioning from the first and the second pull. For training purposes, I would just start at the hang. Since you can probably deadlift much more than you can snatch, the first pull will be of no benefit. The easiest way to do the lift is to just deadlift the bar up and straighten your knees. Then, drop down into the hang position and from there, explode up. The second pull is really the meat of the power snatch/power clean.

What the hell was I thinking?

I hadn’t had my protein shake this morning.

I was thinking ‘from hang’.

Seriously.

Dan “Crack Smokin’” McVicker

Dan,

You know all of those free supplements you won?

YOU’RE NOT SUPPOSED TO TAKE THEM ALL AT ONCE!

Mike The “Smartass” Bear

Thanks guys. I started the routing thinking snatch, thus doing it in one motion, just like on the Olympics. I would start the first half relatively slow, but then start to accelerate until I was up on my toes, then dipping my body while the bar continued up to the overhead position, and lastly, standing up. But after about two weeks of this, I just happened to look at the excercise description really close, and got really confused! Thanks for the help, it is much appreciated.

MO

Mike,

I’m upping my dose of Power Drive starting today.

It’s the only thing keeping me sane.

Dan “Tyrosine: my best friend” McVicker

Well since CoolcolJ isn’t here!
Just to add to the excellent descriptions already given, the only difference between a power snatch and a snatch is that a power snatch shouldn’t have a knee bend of more than 90 degrees when dropping under the bar.
For the purposes of developing power the power snatch is actually better and less demanding in flexibilty and technique.

Man, people gotta stop trying Olympic lifts… for real. This has gotten out of hand. It honestly seems as though people think that if they’re expereiced at weights, then they should be able to do every exercise. That’s just not the case.

Not disrespecting anybody, just voicing my educated opinion.

Cheers!

How are you going to learn if you never try?

But to be honest I agree with you to some extent. I’ve been doing Olys since Nov and I haven’t got a clue what my form looks like!
I would love to have a coach but there just aren’t any round here. So I just learnt what I could off the more experienced guys off the forum and read everything I could lay my hands on.
I do know that my snatch went from 35kg (77lbs) to 77.5kg (170lbs) and my clean went from 60kg (130lbs) to 105kg (230lbs) in that time. My take downs and throws are vastly improved and my punching power has increased. My traps are bigger than ever. So it can’t be all bad?

Maybe one day I will post a video on the forum and people can critique my awful form :slight_smile:

So, Dave, in your highly educated opinion, why should people never try any Olympic lifts? When I read the recommendations of users of this forum, and I read an article on training that specifically calls for Olympic style lifts (Meltdown II), should I have just assumed that they are all noneducated opinions? Does that mean that myself or nobody else should do Meltdown training? (better take it out of the archives). Since I got all the info for that training off of this forum, should I ignore all other advice, too? Has Westside gotten way out of hand? Has weightlifting gotten out of hand? Since you never really said, I have no understanding of your reasons for avoiding these types of lifts - if you have a good reason, you never gave it. I’d like to hear why you think I should not try Olympic style lifts - you might have valid reasons, and if so, I would like to hear them. But for the record, although I am no record setter by any means, I have only been doing these lifts for a few weeks and there has been noticeable improvements in my hams and quads, and my shoulders and traps have grown quite well.

MO

I thought it was time for someone to step up and write what many people are thinking. It seems as though we’re all “hardcore” with weights and know quite a bit about training. Now this Olympic lifting stuff comes out (to the bodybuilding public) and we all want to try it. Fair enough, but people need to be aware of the downsides.

As for why not to do them: 1) As I may have mentioned earlier, people who are working out to look good naked generally have little use for O lifting. Years of slow training (relatively speaking) condition our bodies for that type activity, making O lifting VERY hard on their bodies. We?re not talking a great new stimulus for muscle growth, but rather predisposition to injury. This is something I have need first hand on more than one occasion.

  1. O lifting seems contradictory to body composition goals. If it were great at ?packing on mass? then most athletes would do nothing to but. As for fat loss, they may result in a huge calorie expenditure, but there are other ways of doing that that don?t involve the same risk.

  2. Technique is everything. By repeatedly performing the technique incorrectly, you?re actually programming yourself to perform better? at doing the lifts incorrectly. I don?t believe that anyone can learn to do these lifts properly from a book or website.

Now having said all of that, there?s always a caveat or two. Creed is a shining example in that he?s an athlete and has no chance of getting a coach. He also seems to be doing everything he can to learn the lifts. This is a far cry from some guy who?s just trying to get huge, which is the population I am trying to reach.
People need to realize that trying the O lifts aren?t simply like trying a new exercise, they?re far too complicated for that.

MO, your asking for an explanation is certainly warranted, but your cynicism is not. We?re all friends here, though we may not always agree -but that?s okay! I felt that it?s finally time to give the other side of the coin, and maybe hurt a little dogma.

Cheers!