If one wanted to use westside methods but substistuted the clean for the deadlift, how would this be done? Can one ME method be used for both squat and clean? And DE day?
This could be as simple as modifying the exericses. For example, do low clean pulls instead of deads and front squat instead of back squat.
Go over to elitefs and read Q&A section. They answered some questions over that topic. They mentioned about doing OLY before doing DE but I am not exactly sure. Joe Kenn does it with his Tier system but it's based on improving athlete's performance, not maximizing strength or muscle gain like Westside as i've tried both. I'm in the proces trying to make it more like Westside with 3 days rather than 4 days but not as easy as it sounds.
I've actually adapted WSB barbell slightly to include an ME and DE for Back on which i train Olys. This only works because i don't train deads on squat days. If i do deads i might do snatch or clean deads on my ME back days.
I find it works well for me. So I end up with 6 training days, Squat ME DE, Bench ME DE and Back ME DE. Haven't had any overtraining issues so far but i keep my volume modest.
Creed, 6 days? wow.You must have built up alot of capacity to deal with that amount of work! Interesting... is that all you do? no cardio, sprinting, etc?
Errr I acutally box twice a week and run 400m interval a couple of times a week and do a 2 hour vale tudo session a week as well, maybe thats why i struggle to gain weight? But i when i say 6 training days that isn't always in one week! I will do 3 consective days then maybe two days off and then 3 more consecutive days. if i am feeling really good i might only take off one day in between (say when taking vitamin T). And i never spend more than 90mins in the gym.
Don't the clean and the dead use a lot of the same muscles? At least in the first pull? So couldn't use still use good mornings and all the other WS standard ME Squat/dead movements for both the back squat and clean? And then maybe some heavy high pulls as a supplementary exercise?
Would this work:
Squat/clean ME day
Max Movement: Goodmorning or RDL
Supplemental exercise 3-5 reps:
High clean pulls or front squats
Westsiders may disagree, but I think you will get much better results for your clean by training a more clean specific movement on your ME day. Also, I am not exactly sure why this works, but o-lifters manage to get great results and not over-tax the CNS by training the lifts far far more frequently than Westside does. You could try, on ME day first doing a clean exercise--high pulls or cleans themselves, and then doing the squat assistance exercise. The TUT of the clean exercise is small enough that it should leave you alright for max effort squat work, but just do not do too many sets (you might even find the relatively high speed of the ME clean work prepares you nicely for the squat work).
Alright I may give that a try. Thanks.
Thanks CoolColJ that is going to help out a lot! Preciate it!