Obese People Getting Disability Benefits

Off Topic
21

[quote]DBCooper wrote:
I’ve made my views on fat motherfuckers pretty clear here in the past. That being said, there really isn’t any difference between this fat fuck’s disability and any other disability any of us could end up with that would allow us the same general privileges that hers provides. The only real difference is the nature of the disability itself and all that boils down to is choice.

I have a friend who is currently getting virtually the same “privileges” as this obese woman, except that his disability stems from a major motorcycle accident he was in two years ago. His choosing to get on the motorcycle and drive down a windy mountain road isn’t really that much different than this obese woman choosing to have the entire left side of the menu at McDonald’s for lunch.

They both are assuming inherent risks with their behavior. Perhaps the extent to which you are given disability payments and extra accommodations should hinge entirely on the risk factor involved with whatever activity it is you engage in that leads to the disability in the first place.

That being said, there are also more and more studies each year that indicate that there is a distinct possibility that a huge factor in someone’s weight is genetic in nature and that essentially many people cannot “choose” to not be fat, only the extent to how fat they become. I’ve even heard of studies raising the possibility of an “obese” gene. Perhaps this woman’s disability doesn’t even boil down to choice as much as it does chance.

My point is that I don’t think that much separates this woman from anyone else collecting disability for a more “legitimate” reason other than her grotesque physical appearance. Maybe I should start a thread lamenting the unfairness involved with giving my friend a handicapped parking space, frequent breaks due to intermittent pain and disability payments because he was stupid enough to drive his motorcycle well in excess of the speed limit on a road he was unfamiliar with.

I’ll also say this: it’s more than a little pretentious for a woman as beautiful as OctoberGirl to get on here and complain about this fat ass. You’re lucky that you don’t look like her, OctoberGirl, and you’re lucky that you won’t have all the escalating health problems that your co-worker will have later in life. I’d choose health and an attractive appearance over less working hours, assisted housing and convenient parking spaces any day.[/quote]

BUT:

Her condition is entirely reversible, your friends is not (yet at least).

Also, I am entirely convinced that some people are genetically determined to be a on teh chubby side, but once you break 300 lbs, whether with fat or muscle your behavior had something to do with it.

To paraphrase CS, yeah, nature might have cocked the gun but you pulled the trigger and reloaded.

Twice.

22

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:
I’ve made my views on fat motherfuckers pretty clear here in the past. That being said, there really isn’t any difference between this fat fuck’s disability and any other disability any of us could end up with that would allow us the same general privileges that hers provides. The only real difference is the nature of the disability itself and all that boils down to is choice.

I have a friend who is currently getting virtually the same “privileges” as this obese woman, except that his disability stems from a major motorcycle accident he was in two years ago. His choosing to get on the motorcycle and drive down a windy mountain road isn’t really that much different than this obese woman choosing to have the entire left side of the menu at McDonald’s for lunch.

They both are assuming inherent risks with their behavior. Perhaps the extent to which you are given disability payments and extra accommodations should hinge entirely on the risk factor involved with whatever activity it is you engage in that leads to the disability in the first place.

That being said, there are also more and more studies each year that indicate that there is a distinct possibility that a huge factor in someone’s weight is genetic in nature and that essentially many people cannot “choose” to not be fat, only the extent to how fat they become. I’ve even heard of studies raising the possibility of an “obese” gene. Perhaps this woman’s disability doesn’t even boil down to choice as much as it does chance.

My point is that I don’t think that much separates this woman from anyone else collecting disability for a more “legitimate” reason other than her grotesque physical appearance. Maybe I should start a thread lamenting the unfairness involved with giving my friend a handicapped parking space, frequent breaks due to intermittent pain and disability payments because he was stupid enough to drive his motorcycle well in excess of the speed limit on a road he was unfamiliar with.

I’ll also say this: it’s more than a little pretentious for a woman as beautiful as OctoberGirl to get on here and complain about this fat ass. You’re lucky that you don’t look like her, OctoberGirl, and you’re lucky that you won’t have all the escalating health problems that your co-worker will have later in life. I’d choose health and an attractive appearance over less working hours, assisted housing and convenient parking spaces any day.[/quote]

I understand your reasoning and hadn’t considered such things as a traffic accident and the receiving of benefits. That is a good point. I haven’t had time to consider my opinion in that regard.

Did you actually say whether or not you support an obese person’s right to benefits for the disability of being fat?

You mention the fat gene. Sometimes we have to work harder to overcome our issues. My brother is dyslexic and he had to work very hard to get through school and then college but he did it. I for some reason, get lost all the time. It is bizarre. But I try to prepare with mapquest and my parents bought me a GPS. I’ve lived in San Diego my whole life but I get lost, so I work harder to over come that issue.

You say I am pretentious for starting this thread. Are you suggesting I am disallowed an opinion on social issues because you think I have an advantage? This issue isn’t just about appearance it is another’s choice that is taking money out of my pocket.

[/quote]

Perhaps pretentious was a poor word to use. No, you’re not disallowed from having an opinion. I agree with your opinion to an extent. But I think the real problem is the welfare state we’ve created where people like her are allowed to suckle on the govt’s teat their whole lives. Her situation may very well be irreversible, or at least as difficult to reverse as other disabilities such as my motorcyclist friend.

To me, she is simply the benefactor of a problem, not the problem itself. I think it’s misguided and smacks of picking on an easy target to attack her by listing off the outlandish shit she gets that you don’t. The real target is this bullshit sense of entitlement that people have, but if any of those entitlements were available to any of us, we’d probably take advantage of them as well.

THAT’s my point here: that the whole thread just picks on some fat ass who may not even be able to reverse her situation (and if she did, she needs so much time and effort to do it that she’d probably collect unemployment or some sort of other govt welfare so that she can take the time off work to fully dedicate herself to changing in the first place) and your initial post does little, if anything, to offer a real solution to the overarching problem that lies at the heart of your disdain for your disabled co-worker.

23

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:
I’ve made my views on fat motherfuckers pretty clear here in the past. That being said, there really isn’t any difference between this fat fuck’s disability and any other disability any of us could end up with that would allow us the same general privileges that hers provides. The only real difference is the nature of the disability itself and all that boils down to is choice.

I have a friend who is currently getting virtually the same “privileges” as this obese woman, except that his disability stems from a major motorcycle accident he was in two years ago. His choosing to get on the motorcycle and drive down a windy mountain road isn’t really that much different than this obese woman choosing to have the entire left side of the menu at McDonald’s for lunch.

They both are assuming inherent risks with their behavior. Perhaps the extent to which you are given disability payments and extra accommodations should hinge entirely on the risk factor involved with whatever activity it is you engage in that leads to the disability in the first place.

That being said, there are also more and more studies each year that indicate that there is a distinct possibility that a huge factor in someone’s weight is genetic in nature and that essentially many people cannot “choose” to not be fat, only the extent to how fat they become. I’ve even heard of studies raising the possibility of an “obese” gene. Perhaps this woman’s disability doesn’t even boil down to choice as much as it does chance.

My point is that I don’t think that much separates this woman from anyone else collecting disability for a more “legitimate” reason other than her grotesque physical appearance. Maybe I should start a thread lamenting the unfairness involved with giving my friend a handicapped parking space, frequent breaks due to intermittent pain and disability payments because he was stupid enough to drive his motorcycle well in excess of the speed limit on a road he was unfamiliar with.

I’ll also say this: it’s more than a little pretentious for a woman as beautiful as OctoberGirl to get on here and complain about this fat ass. You’re lucky that you don’t look like her, OctoberGirl, and you’re lucky that you won’t have all the escalating health problems that your co-worker will have later in life. I’d choose health and an attractive appearance over less working hours, assisted housing and convenient parking spaces any day.[/quote]

I understand your reasoning and hadn’t considered such things as a traffic accident and the receiving of benefits. That is a good point. I haven’t had time to consider my opinion in that regard.

Did you actually say whether or not you support an obese person’s right to benefits for the disability of being fat?

You mention the fat gene. Sometimes we have to work harder to overcome our issues. My brother is dyslexic and he had to work very hard to get through school and then college but he did it. I for some reason, get lost all the time. It is bizarre. But I try to prepare with mapquest and my parents bought me a GPS. I’ve lived in San Diego my whole life but I get lost, so I work harder to over come that issue.

You say I am pretentious for starting this thread. Are you suggesting I am disallowed an opinion on social issues because you think I have an advantage? This issue isn’t just about appearance it is another’s choice that is taking money out of my pocket.
[/quote]

Also, if the real issue here is one’s behavior leading to taking money out of your pocket, let’s get into the wide world of subsidized mortgages! Yes, if you have a home mortgage I am the one subsidizing it. If you are a farmer and the government is engaging in the entirely backwards practice of price ceilings/floors and subsidizes your farm (and they DO subsidize it), I am the one paying for this.

If you are older than me by more than say, 20 years, chances are that I am the one paying for you to retire at the age of 65. Let’s take on the real big fish here if unfair redistribution of income is the real crux of your argument. Fuck fat people.

24

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

Perhaps pretentious was a poor word to use. No, you’re not disallowed from having an opinion. I agree with your opinion to an extent. But I think the real problem is the welfare state we’ve created where people like her are allowed to suckle on the govt’s teat their whole lives. Her situation may very well be irreversible, or at least as difficult to reverse as other disabilities such as my motorcyclist friend.

To me, she is simply the benefactor of a problem, not the problem itself. I think it’s misguided and smacks of picking on an easy target to attack her by listing off the outlandish shit she gets that you don’t. The real target is this bullshit sense of entitlement that people have, but if any of those entitlements were available to any of us, we’d probably take advantage of them as well.

THAT’s my point here: that the whole thread just picks on some fat ass who may not even be able to reverse her situation (and if she did, she needs so much time and effort to do it that she’d probably collect unemployment or some sort of other govt welfare so that she can take the time off work to fully dedicate herself to changing in the first place) and your initial post does little, if anything, to offer a real solution to the overarching problem that lies at the heart of your disdain for your disabled co-worker.[/quote]

Why would I need to offer a solution? There is a solution, lose the weight.

DB, it may be harder for some people but it is always doable. A person may not get down to lean but they can get far away from obese.

I am not even sure I have disdain for these people. That makes it personal and I do not have any feelings directed towards the person, just the situation. It is exasperating.

I do agree with you that the government has fostered the welfare state. I have been on unemployment but that was monies I paid in to the system so that isn’t the issue.

Does anyone know why or how the giving out of these benefits is a good thing for the government? Is it just to keep people happy for their votes? I really don’t know.

25

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

Also, if the real issue here is one’s behavior leading to taking money out of your pocket, let’s get into the wide world of subsidized mortgages! Yes, if you have a home mortgage I am the one subsidizing it. If you are a farmer and the government is engaging in the entirely backwards practice of price ceilings/floors and subsidizes your farm (and they DO subsidize it), I am the one paying for this.

If you are older than me by more than say, 20 years, chances are that I am the one paying for you to retire at the age of 65. Let’s take on the real big fish here if unfair redistribution of income is the real crux of your argument. Fuck fat people.[/quote]

There are a lot of issues out in the wide world. I expressed an opinion on one of them. A lot of things irk me, but I just focused on one.

You are incorrect about the crux of my argument, perhaps that is your’s? Or were you trying to come up with a rallying cry for me?

26

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

Perhaps pretentious was a poor word to use. No, you’re not disallowed from having an opinion. I agree with your opinion to an extent. But I think the real problem is the welfare state we’ve created where people like her are allowed to suckle on the govt’s teat their whole lives. Her situation may very well be irreversible, or at least as difficult to reverse as other disabilities such as my motorcyclist friend.

To me, she is simply the benefactor of a problem, not the problem itself. I think it’s misguided and smacks of picking on an easy target to attack her by listing off the outlandish shit she gets that you don’t. The real target is this bullshit sense of entitlement that people have, but if any of those entitlements were available to any of us, we’d probably take advantage of them as well.

THAT’s my point here: that the whole thread just picks on some fat ass who may not even be able to reverse her situation (and if she did, she needs so much time and effort to do it that she’d probably collect unemployment or some sort of other govt welfare so that she can take the time off work to fully dedicate herself to changing in the first place) and your initial post does little, if anything, to offer a real solution to the overarching problem that lies at the heart of your disdain for your disabled co-worker.[/quote]

Why would I need to offer a solution? There is a solution, lose the weight.

DB, it may be harder for some people but it is always doable. A person may not get down to lean but they can get far away from obese.

I am not even sure I have disdain for these people. That makes it personal and I do not have any feelings directed towards the person, just the situation. It is exasperating.

I do agree with you that the government has fostered the welfare state. I have been on unemployment but that was monies I paid in to the system so that isn’t the issue.

Does anyone know why or how the giving out of these benefits is a good thing for the government? Is it just to keep people happy for their votes? I really don’t know.

[/quote]

It’s extremely simple. People within govt feel that the role of govt is to provide for the people. The split occurs when some feel that this entails programs that are designed to alleviate social and/or monetary inequities and others feel that this simply means govt is designed to maximize the earning potential of the country as a whole and that this overall increase in consumer wealth will naturally lead to a better overall condition for the country. It’s nothing more than a matter of differing opinions.

27

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:
I think it’s an issue when you say that the person got obese from making poor food choices and not exercising; I see that pre-condition being twisted into (for example): “My mental/emotional state led me to make such lifestyle choices…” etc. until it becomes a pre-condition that qualifies for even a perversion of an existing pre-condition for disability. At least, that’s the cynic in me seeing that.

OG,

What if she was given such assistance and a timeline for getting “better” so her capacity for work would be restored, and then her wages were garnished to counter the state aid she received during the that time?

Throwing out a hypothetical, please don’t attack me ;)[/quote]

I don’t know about the timeline. That could be a good solution. But just think, won’t they lose to keep the benefits and then what? They succeed and there is no more free money so won’t they just put the weight back on to get the benefits again?

asshole (I kid! I kid!)
[/quote]

That’s a good point, but I didn’t flesh out my “solution” because I’m not aware of any fail safes employed by other countries. I’m curious what could be done in that vein, though.

Yes, I think community service is a good idea. We can have them wear jump suits in a color they hate, too, since shame is a great negative incentive for putting themselves in that position gain.

28

I’m all for spending taxes money on helping people who really need help. But to help people who made wrong choices over years? No.

If there isn’t any medical condition that justifies this person being obese, she shouldn’t get such benefits. What is she going to do now? Stay at home and eat more. Now, if she had been fired for being FAT, maybe she would try to do some exercice and clean her diet so she would be fit for other job.

29

You all do realize how a person is considered disabled correct? This is not a go fill out a piece of paper and the cut you a check. This is a long process, normally around 2 years minimum.

It goes through the court system and a judge is the person to decide who is officially disabled and illegible for Social Security benifits. Just thought I would add.

30

It’s kinda like this-

31

[quote]DJHT wrote:
You all do realize how a person is considered disabled correct? This is not a go fill out a piece of paper and the cut you a check. This is a long process, normally around 2 years minimum.

It goes through the court system and a judge is the person to decide who is officially disabled and illegible for Social Security benifits. Just thought I would add. [/quote]

But aren’t they the cause of their disability?

The ADA now recognizes obesity of itself as a disability as it impacts quality of life and health.

Maybe I am being ignorant in my opinion as I can’t possibly know what it takes to become a 350lb or more person and how life is at that weight, but isn’t the cause their choices?

32

[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:
I think it’s an issue when you say that the person got obese from making poor food choices and not exercising; I see that pre-condition being twisted into (for example): “My mental/emotional state led me to make such lifestyle choices…” etc. until it becomes a pre-condition that qualifies for even a perversion of an existing pre-condition for disability. At least, that’s the cynic in me seeing that.

OG,

What if she was given such assistance and a timeline for getting “better” so her capacity for work would be restored, and then her wages were garnished to counter the state aid she received during the that time?

Throwing out a hypothetical, please don’t attack me ;)[/quote]

I don’t know about the timeline. That could be a good solution. But just think, won’t they lose to keep the benefits and then what? They succeed and there is no more free money so won’t they just put the weight back on to get the benefits again?

asshole (I kid! I kid!)
[/quote]

That’s a good point, but I didn’t flesh out my “solution” because I’m not aware of any fail safes employed by other countries. I’m curious what could be done in that vein, though.

Yes, I think community service is a good idea. We can have them wear jump suits in a color they hate, too, since shame is a great negative incentive for putting themselves in that position gain.[/quote]

Why is working for what you receive a shameful act? Hyperbole isn’t always a good thing. After the Depression the Works programs for the unemployed actually restored their self esteem and pride in working for what they earn. There was more shame for that generation, in taking a handout.

I don’t have a solution. Since health problems do impact the economy also maybe assistance and education is a better way.

33

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

[quote]DJHT wrote:
You all do realize how a person is considered disabled correct? This is not a go fill out a piece of paper and the cut you a check. This is a long process, normally around 2 years minimum.

It goes through the court system and a judge is the person to decide who is officially disabled and illegible for Social Security benifits. Just thought I would add. [/quote]

But aren’t they the cause of their disability?

The ADA now recognizes obesity of itself as a disability as it impacts quality of life and health.

Maybe I am being ignorant in my opinion as I can’t possibly know what it takes to become a 350lb or more person and how life is at that weight, but isn’t the cause their choices?

[/quote]

Not disagreeing all I was stating that the process is really fucked up, she has probably spent the last few years getting “qualifying” medical records that her lawyer can show the judge.

I once had a patient that was on disability for his schizophrenic bipolar disorder, that he was diagnosed with after years of crack use. He also had 6 kids and he was only 25. That is our system and once they are legally disabled by Social Security that is for life. As long as they do not attempt to get a job or keep there income below a certain level its a done deal.

34

[quote]DJHT wrote:

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

[quote]DJHT wrote:
You all do realize how a person is considered disabled correct? This is not a go fill out a piece of paper and the cut you a check. This is a long process, normally around 2 years minimum.

It goes through the court system and a judge is the person to decide who is officially disabled and illegible for Social Security benifits. Just thought I would add. [/quote]

But aren’t they the cause of their disability?

The ADA now recognizes obesity of itself as a disability as it impacts quality of life and health.

Maybe I am being ignorant in my opinion as I can’t possibly know what it takes to become a 350lb or more person and how life is at that weight, but isn’t the cause their choices?

[/quote]

Not disagreeing all I was stating that the process is really fucked up, she has probably spent the last few years getting “qualifying” medical records that her lawyer can show the judge.

I once had a patient that was on disability for his schizophrenic bipolar disorder, that he was diagnosed with after years of crack use. He also had 6 kids and he was only 25. That is our system and once they are legally disabled by Social Security that is for life. As long as they do not attempt to get a job or keep there income below a certain level its a done deal. [/quote]

I didn’t even think about drug abuse, just like the motorcycle thing. DB is right that we do have an a large portion of entitled people and the government does seem to perpetuate the problem.

I don’t know if a solution would be to not give them assistance. Would we then have thousands living on the streets?

35

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:
I think it’s an issue when you say that the person got obese from making poor food choices and not exercising; I see that pre-condition being twisted into (for example): “My mental/emotional state led me to make such lifestyle choices…” etc. until it becomes a pre-condition that qualifies for even a perversion of an existing pre-condition for disability. At least, that’s the cynic in me seeing that.

OG,

What if she was given such assistance and a timeline for getting “better” so her capacity for work would be restored, and then her wages were garnished to counter the state aid she received during the that time?

Throwing out a hypothetical, please don’t attack me ;)[/quote]

I don’t know about the timeline. That could be a good solution. But just think, won’t they lose to keep the benefits and then what? They succeed and there is no more free money so won’t they just put the weight back on to get the benefits again?

asshole (I kid! I kid!)
[/quote]

That’s a good point, but I didn’t flesh out my “solution” because I’m not aware of any fail safes employed by other countries. I’m curious what could be done in that vein, though.

Yes, I think community service is a good idea. We can have them wear jump suits in a color they hate, too, since shame is a great negative incentive for putting themselves in that position gain.[/quote]

Why is working for what you receive a shameful act? Hyperbole isn’t always a good thing. After the Depression the Works programs for the unemployed actually restored their self esteem and pride in working for what they earn. There was more shame for that generation, in taking a handout.

I don’t have a solution. Since health problems do impact the economy also maybe assistance and education is a better way. [/quote]

The Works Program wasn’t necessarily a handout, given that the work ethic back then was much stronger. Also, as a side note, because of the WP, there have been monumental public works of art (many still existing today), which if you consider that a nation reflects its power and ideals through its unique culture, then those who took advantage of the WP have not only contributed to an American ideal, but more than payed back their debt.

Damn… that was rather long winded. I think I’ve been reading too many of DB Cooper’s posts.

lol

36

It should all be cut.

37

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:
I think it’s an issue when you say that the person got obese from making poor food choices and not exercising; I see that pre-condition being twisted into (for example): “My mental/emotional state led me to make such lifestyle choices…” etc. until it becomes a pre-condition that qualifies for even a perversion of an existing pre-condition for disability. At least, that’s the cynic in me seeing that.

OG,

What if she was given such assistance and a timeline for getting “better” so her capacity for work would be restored, and then her wages were garnished to counter the state aid she received during the that time?

Throwing out a hypothetical, please don’t attack me ;)[/quote]

I don’t know about the timeline. That could be a good solution. But just think, won’t they lose to keep the benefits and then what? They succeed and there is no more free money so won’t they just put the weight back on to get the benefits again?

asshole (I kid! I kid!)
[/quote]

That’s a good point, but I didn’t flesh out my “solution” because I’m not aware of any fail safes employed by other countries. I’m curious what could be done in that vein, though.

Yes, I think community service is a good idea. We can have them wear jump suits in a color they hate, too, since shame is a great negative incentive for putting themselves in that position gain.[/quote]

Why is working for what you receive a shameful act? Hyperbole isn’t always a good thing. After the Depression the Works programs for the unemployed actually restored their self esteem and pride in working for what they earn. There was more shame for that generation, in taking a handout.

I don’t have a solution. Since health problems do impact the economy also maybe assistance and education is a better way. [/quote]

The Works Program wasn’t necessarily a handout, given that the work ethic back then was much stronger. Also, as a side note, because of the WP, there have been monumental public works of art (many still existing today), which if you consider that a nation reflects its power and ideals through its unique culture, then those who took advantage of the WP have not only contributed to an American ideal, but more than payed back their debt.

Damn… that was rather long winded. I think I’ve been reading too many of DB Cooper’s posts.

lol
[/quote]

Exactly! Those people put in their time and effort, got paid, restored their pride and helped their community and the economy.

38

I HATE THIS SO MUCH. Just another way society is basically encouraging lazy fat asses. Instead of helping them be fat there should be penalties for taking up so much space and causing visual pollution. Let natural selection kill off those that can’t contribute to humankind.

Oh you developed diabetes and cant buy insulin because you didn’t bother to move for ten years and now can’t perform at work? Too bad. The government doesn’t buy everyone else’s medicine. Oh its tough on your knees to walk a little to your modified golf cart because you weigh more than a small elephant? Too bad. Everyone else walks to their cars. Maybe that’s why you’re a stumbling ball of adipose. Oh, you cant do your job because it puts strain of your fat encrusted heart to stand up? WHY THE FUCK DIDN’T THEY FIRE YOUR STUPID ASS?

It would be different if the fatty was a rocket scientist and works as hard as everyone else but the fact that they get disability aid is outrageous. Next time I see a walking tow truck anywhere near a McDonald’s Im going to shove a big piece of cake right into that dump site they think is their face.

39

[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:

Exactly! Those people put in their time and effort, got paid and restored their pride.

[/quote]

Better

40

What weight would a guy at 5’10" need to bulk to to get on disability? I sense possibility.