T Nation

Not Losing on Ketosis

[quote]jskrabac wrote:
Good thread from way back:
http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/diet_performance_nutrition_supplements/rapid_fat_loss_vs_over_vdiet;jsessionid=ACEFD88AF6775A780209BA8ECFCA6AFE.hydra?id=2942161&pageNo=4[/quote]

Thanks this was tremendously helpful and will be referenced often by myself. I think the Rapid fat loss diet is exactly what I’m looking for and just didn’t find it earlier. I will start it six weeks out from my birthday which gives me a week or two left to just eat clean and maybe drop a lb or two.

[quote]The3Commandments wrote:

[quote]Matthaeus wrote:
It’s not about being healthy for the long term i just wanted to lose as much weight as possible in 8 weeks. Also the reason my meals are all the same is because i only work part time so i can only afford like 70 dollars a week for food and supplements. Most of if not all the diets on this site require you to spends several hundred dollars on supplements alone.[/quote]

If this is the case, then your OP makes even less sense.

a) Instead of Omega Three eggs, buy regular eggs.
b) Instead of chicken bacon, buy bulk chicken (boneless, skinless)

Seriously…broccoli is like a dollar a pound. [/quote]

The omega 3 eggs are about 40 cent’s more per 18 eggs. A single pack of chicken bacon is roughly 3 bucks and lasts me through 4-5 meals. Also broccoli isn’t a dollar a lb where i buy my groceries not even close. I don’t own a car so i have to walk home with my groceries so basically i can’t shop in several different locations or shop anywhere to far from home. I basically choose the nearest large grocery store in my case MAXI and do all my shopping there.

I wish i had a Costco anywhere even remotely close by but alas.

[quote]Josh Rider wrote:

  • You are producing ketone bodies, meaning you are in ketosis. Being in ketosis doesn’t even matter that much as it imparts no real metabolic advantage.

  • At 14-15% bodyfat, you shouldn’t expect massive decreases in scale weight on a weekly basis. 0.5-2 pounds a week is almost ideal. Of course, you should of seen some sort of weight decrease in the first two weeks of dieting with such a low carbohydrate intake and a fairly moderate caloric intake (should produce a deficit). You may be eating more calories than you think if you are not measuring what you are eating stringently.

  • Exercise intensity usually goes down in the first few weeks of ketosis as your body isn’t yet adapted to do intense enough exercise at such a low carbohydrate level. You could possibly be burning less calories during exercise.

  • Why the fuck would you do 15 minutes of HIIT before weight training? Do it after or on days off. If the rest of your training program reflects on this kind of logic, then there may be a problem.

  • Your diet is unbelievably bland and boring. You have like 5 food items that you are eating. Eggs and bacon all day isn’t a good idea. Where are vegetables and the real meat on your diet? If you aren’t obsessive compulsive or if you have a life, you likely won’t be able to maintain this diet for long. You are setting yourself up for nutrient deficiencies as well.

  • 2000 calories, no carbohydrates, and four 1.5-2 hour intense training sessions may run you down. I’d consider including carbohydrates somewhere in your regimen (possibly prior to workouts).

OVERALL, these would be my initial recommendations:

  1. Be patient with your weight loss and stay consistent.
  2. Do cardiovascular exercise AFTER weight training or on rest days.
  3. Increase the variety of your diet. You should not eat only eggs and bacon. Include a few servings of vegetables, some beef/fish/chicken/turkey (AKA meat), nuts, and you can even include some dairy and fruit if you are willing to slightly increase your carbohydrate intake.
  4. Possibly increasing carbohydrate intake either overall or at strategic times during the week may be a good idea.
  5. Post your approximate strength levels, fitness level, and the details of your training regimen for advice on what you are doing right or wrong. You may need to make some changes.
    6)If you are not losing weight, count the calories of what you are eating more precisely. Measure out portions more accurately. Adjust intake on a weekly basis dependent on progress.
    [/quote]

The reason i just do the cardio on training days is as simple as i don’t feel like walking to the gym for 15 minutes of cardio on all my off days. I want my off days to be just that off days. Been doing i spent the first 6 months of my diet doing 30 min HITT sessions 7 times a week every single day and didn’t lose any significant strength. I think the muscle loss surrounding it is largely bullshit unless your a very heavily muscled individual.

Also a lot of people mention nuts. I can’t seem to find any nuts that only have trace amounts of carbs. Most of them have a fairly significant amount per portion. Even Almonds. Or maybe I’m not finding the right nuts.

Also it’s not really relevant since I’ll be using the rapid fat loss diet starting 6 weeks out from my birthday but since you went through a lot of trouble to offer assistance here is my program and approx strength levels.

Chest/Biceps

BB decline: 95x12 135x10 185x8 225x10
DB incline: 35x12 50x10 65x8
Cable crossover/Lower cable crossover: 3 sets each 12-15 reps light weight
Rest 5 minutes
Concentration curls: 25x12-15x3
Lying incline hammer curls: 35x8-10x3
Straight bar curl/behind the back wrist curl: 3 sets each 15-20 reps starting at 55/45/35 lbs.

Legs

BB Squat: 135x10 225x8 315x6 365x4 405x2 (sometimes 225x20 at the end)
Leg ext/Lying leg curl: 10 stacks 8-10 reps, 8 stacks 12-15 rep 6 stacks 15-20 reps.
Standing calf raise/seated calf raise: 3xfailure whole stack.

Delts/Tris:

Seated DB military: 35x12 50x10 65x8
BB shrugs: 135x15 225x12 315x10 225x15
Machine side laterals: 4 stacks x15, 5 stacks x12, 6 stacks x10
Reverse pec dec: 8 stacks x15, 9 stacks x12, 10 stacks x10
Rest 5 min
Dips: BWx12-15, BWx12-15, BW+45 lbs x4-6, BW x failure
Overhead DB ext: 50x12, 65x10, 65x10
V bar push downs: 60x15, 80x12, 100x10

Back:
Deadlift: 135x10 225x8 315x6 365x4 405x2
Close grip chins: BWx15-20, BWx15-20 BW+45lbs x4-6, BW x failure
T-bar rows: 45x12, 90x12 115x10
Close grip cable rows: 4 stacksx12, 5 stacksx12, 6 stacksx10
Pullover machine: 4 stacksx15-20, 6 stacks 12-15

That’s pretty much my week in a nutshell been training consistently since May 2010. Had 1 small 6 month stint of training back in April of 2009 but stopped due to financial/injury reasons and lost all gains made in that short time.

almonds are fine. one of my meals while working with shelby starnes was 1/3 cup almonds and a piece of chicken while i was on a keto diet

My main issue wasn’t that you were doing HIIT on training days but rather that you said that you did it on training days right before weight training. I suggest you do the HIIT or steady state cardio after the weight training.

Lyle Mcdonald’s Rapid Fat Loss diet is also a good choice for quick fat loss but note that it is not intended to be done with lots of exercise. I haven’t read the book in a while, but if I’m correct the protocol is just a well designed PSMF:

~1.5g protein/lb of lean body mass
Baseline amounts of omega-3 fat (eg. 6 fish oil pills a day or 1 serving of salmon a day)
Unlimited intake of most vegetables
Some conditional supplements (eg. Calcium, Potassium)
Lowish amount of maintenance exercise (eg. some low-moderate intensity steady state cardio and some low-volume maintenance weight training).
0 calorie beverages and very low calorie condiments are permitted (eg. hot sauce, mustard, salsa)
Fat burner/caffeine usage optional
Daily multivitamin

I’d personally recommend to listen to my advice from my last post for the upcoming month and then do the PSMF the month prior to your goal while dialing down exercise volume/intensity. Personally, I find your training program isn’t exactly perfect for your specific goal/nutrient intake, but it should do fine for now (it isn’t bad). The PSMF will allow you to lose a lot of fat, but it is difficult to maintain for long periods of time and with high-volume exercise programs.

[quote]Matthaeus wrote:
Nah lol i just been dieting for like 7 months lost about 45 lbs. [/quote]

This is probably the key fact for why you have stalled. I would not go on an extreme psmf. Your diet, despite sucky food choices, should lose you body fat if hormones in check but they are probably not any more having been dieting for so long. I would suggest a diet break. Be proud of what you have achieved so far but look at the long game not just short term goals. Dieting can fuck you up.

Most of Lyle McDonald’s ebooks talk about it. I prefer A guide to flexible eating rather than rfl.

[quote]Kvetch wrote:

[quote]Matthaeus wrote:
Nah lol i just been dieting for like 7 months lost about 45 lbs. [/quote]

This is probably the key fact for why you have stalled. I would not go on an extreme psmf. Your diet, despite sucky food choices, should lose you body fat if hormones in check but they are probably not any more having been dieting for so long. I would suggest a diet break. Be proud of what you have achieved so far but look at the long game not just short term goals. Dieting can fuck you up.

Most of Lyle McDonald’s ebooks talk about it. I prefer A guide to flexible eating rather than rfl.[/quote]

Bingo bango right on.

[quote]Kvetch wrote:

[quote]Matthaeus wrote:
Nah lol i just been dieting for like 7 months lost about 45 lbs. [/quote]

This is probably the key fact for why you have stalled. I would not go on an extreme psmf. Your diet, despite sucky food choices, should lose you body fat if hormones in check but they are probably not any more having been dieting for so long. I would suggest a diet break. Be proud of what you have achieved so far but look at the long game not just short term goals. Dieting can fuck you up.

Most of Lyle McDonald’s ebooks talk about it. I prefer A guide to flexible eating rather than rfl.[/quote]

Good advice. I agree.